The Ledge

Go Back   The Ledge > Main Forums > Rumours
User Name
Password
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read


Make the Ads Go Away! Click here.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 04-09-2019, 11:27 AM
elle's Avatar
elle elle is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: DC
Posts: 10,978
Default Are we killing our rock stars?

https://www.loudersound.com/features...l7h0JTYosF0cXI

Are we killing our rock stars?
By James Cleveland (Classic Rock) 22 minutes ago Classic Rock

Rock is getting old, and no one ever, ever retires. Why?

Mick Jagger, Ozzy Osbourne and Stevie Nicks
(Image: NurPhoto / Dimitrios Kambouris / Frazer Harrison / Getty Images)

If there's anything that sums of the perilous state of affairs on the nostalgia circuit, it's the Rolling Stones pulling out of the New Orleans Jazz Festival due to illness, and their replacements Fleetwood Mac pulling out for the same reason.

Rock is getting old, and no one ever, ever retires.

Ozzy's current No More Tours II tour - the sequel to the Mo More Tours tour of 1992 (Ozzy was clearly beleaguered enough to consider retiring 27 years ago) - has been beset by illness and injury, and the dates now stretch into 2020.

When Bob Seger launched his Runaway Train tour in 2017, he lasted only 13 of the 32 shows before his vertebrae came a-callin' and the rest of the tour was postponed. After months of physiotherapy, he's back on the road, still fulfilling those obligations.

Brian May has a long list of Rhapsody dates to fulfil with Queen and Adam Lambert, but just two years ago he cancelled a UK tour in order to deal with a persistent illness he described as "destroying my energy and my will."

We could go on. And we will. Examine the awful list of musicians we've lost over the last few years, and the common denominator in almost every case is the same: they were still active. They might not be recording, but they were on the road, unlike the rest of us. While we look forward to sedentary retirements they're piling up the milage, pounding the boards, moving from hotel to hotel and accumulating air miles. It's not a healthy life style, and it's no wonder so many are susceptible to illness.

No one's denying a musician's right to tour. Once you've experienced the undiluted love a crowd can offer it must be a hard thing to forego. And as for the "they don't need any more money" argument for retirement, well, when did that apply to anyone, ever?

It's our fault. Every time a band tours, we get a diminished version of the previous experience, and we still pay up. The Rolling Stones of 2018 may have been a blast, but were the No Filter dates really as good as the Bigger Bang shows a decade ago? Or the Voodoo Lounge dates the decade before that? At some point diminishing returns must come into affect, and performing with a band is an athletic task. Usain Bolt retired at 31, so why are we expecting our rock stars to play into their 70s?

Why do we go? Is it just to be in the same room as these legends, one last time until the next time? Is it to pay tribute to who they used to be? Look at Brian Wilson: there's no doubting his genius, but if you distill his career down to the bits that really, absolutely matter, you're looking at an eighteen-month stretch more than half a century ago. Yet, as a live draw he's bigger than he's ever been.

Why can't we let rock stars retire?

The truth is we know the truth. We've struck bargains with our favourite musicians. We've given them a career and they've given us a lifetime full of memories. And that's the key word: lifetime. They've been an intimate part of our relationships and they've been there when others haven't. They're around for for the birth of our children. They've filled our homes and soundtracked our summers. And they're still doing it.

There's no statute of limitations on such a deal. It goes on until the very end, and is only torn up when one party or the other topples of the stage one final time and heads off into the darkness.

Rock stars don't burn out. They don't fade away. They just stop. Usually without warning. Usually when we least expect it. And never when we're ready.
__________________

"kind of weird: a tribute to the dearly departed from a band that can treat its living like trash"
Reply With Quote
.
  #2  
Old 04-09-2019, 11:42 AM
button-lip's Avatar
button-lip button-lip is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Argentina
Posts: 2,098
Default

Yes to all of this!!

And Brian May better stay healthy!!!
__________________
"I think what you would say is that there were factions within the band that had lost their perspective. What that did was to harm the 43-year legacy that we had worked so hard to build, and that legacy was really about rising above difficulties in order to fulfill one's higher truth and one's higher destiny."
Lindsey Buckingham, May 11, 2018.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 04-09-2019, 12:08 PM
elle's Avatar
elle elle is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: DC
Posts: 10,978
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by elle View Post
No one's denying a musician's right to tour. Once you've experienced the undiluted love a crowd can offer it must be a hard thing to forego. And as for the "they don't need any more money" argument for retirement, well, when did that apply to anyone, ever?

It's our fault. Every time a band tours, we get a diminished version of the previous experience, and we still pay up. The Rolling Stones of 2018 may have been a blast, but were the No Filter dates really as good as the Bigger Bang shows a decade ago? Or the Voodoo Lounge dates the decade before that? At some point diminishing returns must come into affect, and performing with a band is an athletic task. Usain Bolt retired at 31, so why are we expecting our rock stars to play into their 70s?

Why do we go? Is it just to be in the same room as these legends, one last time until the next time? Is it to pay tribute to who they used to be? Look at Brian Wilson: there's no doubting his genius, but if you distill his career down to the bits that really, absolutely matter, you're looking at an eighteen-month stretch more than half a century ago. Yet, as a live draw he's bigger than he's ever been.
it's the greed of the older bands and their management. squeeze outta them everything you can while it's still possible.

it's the need for adulation once they experienced it.

and for concertgoers - the need to be in the same room with legends, while they are still around. the need to notch that checkmark, if you were too young to see them before.
__________________

"kind of weird: a tribute to the dearly departed from a band that can treat its living like trash"
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 04-09-2019, 12:10 PM
michelej1 michelej1 is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: California
Posts: 25,073
Default

Some of them need the money.

Some of them need the adrenalin rush. Going home and being doting grandparents to the children of the children they neglected isn't enticing to them. They need the lights, the crowds, the adulation.

Most of them do not want to retire. I can't blame them for that. They want to die how they lived. Fine. They'd be lousy retirees anyway.

I just feel sorry for the ones who don't have the income to retire and continue to tour out of necessity.

That's not true for any of the Macsters except Mick -- and I hate him, so I'm not too concerned about his fate.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 04-09-2019, 12:44 PM
FuzzyPlum FuzzyPlum is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 2,860
Default

For a lot of them its down to their managers and other money men. Their managers need them to tour because they want their money. On the one hand its a bit lame when Christine says its up to their management whether they play Glastonbury or not. On the other hand I can understand there's probably a degree of truth in there somewhere. Older acts tour (and tour certain markets) because the money men tell them to.
__________________

'Where words fail, music speaks'
Mick Fleetwood
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 04-09-2019, 01:56 PM
SteveMacD's Avatar
SteveMacD SteveMacD is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: The Buckeye State
Posts: 6,735
Default

I mean, how could/why would anyone turn down ridiculous amounts money to play a few hours of music, their lifes passion and legacy, to adoring crowds? They get the adulation, they get to travel in style, they get to stay in the nicest accommodations, and they get a big payday when its all over. Its not like theyre working the coal mines.

I mean, McCartney is a billionaire and he still tours, so its not even a matter of needing the money. But looking at sheep through the window only goes so far. Well, I could spend three months looking at the sheep, or I could play in front of tens of thousands of people who think Im royalty and make a small fortune. What would the young Paul in Hamburg do? Hed probably kick my ass for even asking.
__________________
On and on it will always be, the rhythm, rhyme, and harmony.

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b313/SteveMacD/fm2014_zps5c60d7b9.jpg
THE Stephen Hopkins
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 04-09-2019, 02:19 PM
BombaySapphire3 BombaySapphire3 is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: San Francisco Bay area
Posts: 4,001
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveMacD View Post
What would the young Paul in Hamburg do? Hed probably kick my ass for even asking.
Nah ..he would have had Lennon do it for him.
__________________
Children of the world the forgotten chimpanzee..in the eyes of the world you have done so much for me. ..SLN.

Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 04-09-2019, 02:27 PM
SteveMacD's Avatar
SteveMacD SteveMacD is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: The Buckeye State
Posts: 6,735
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BombaySapphire3 View Post
Nah ..he would have had Lennon do it for him.


__________________
On and on it will always be, the rhythm, rhyme, and harmony.

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b313/SteveMacD/fm2014_zps5c60d7b9.jpg
THE Stephen Hopkins
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 04-09-2019, 03:49 PM
elle's Avatar
elle elle is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: DC
Posts: 10,978
Default

i thought this post by someone over on Steve Hoffman boards was interesting:

https://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threa...#post-20975161

Bassist
Zungguzungguguzungguzeng
Location: London

We are not far from a situation where none of the music of the 60s and early 70s will be being performed by the original artists. Then it truly becomes less Classic Rock and more Antique Rock. As in classical music there will undoubtedly be an Original Instruments / H.I.P craze. There will also be Marsalis types who draw a line in popular music history sometime around 1982 and call all that pre-dates that point "heritage music" and all that comes after it will be declared apostate unless the creators accept the rules that determine what constitutes the good and correct in Rock. The dividing line will be pre Fairlight / PCM music versus post. "Real" music versus the evil sampler. Rock artists will advertise their concerts listing the repertoire they are going to play in the exact order they are going to play it. Just how classical concerts are marketed. You will be able to hear note perfect versions of the standard pop / rock canon any day of the week in every major city. The music of the 65-75 era will never die, in fact you wont be able to get away from the stuff. Musicians who could be reaching for the new and the challenging will opt for being able to produce note and inflection perfect renditions of other people's records bereft of context and shorn of all the sacrifice, angst, love and inspiration that contributed to their creation. Those remaining few artists keen to keep pushing the boundaries of the music will go to the furthest sonic extremes to separate itself from the heritage canon and will alienate all but the most adventurous listener in the process. And that's the point where the music of the pre Live Aid era finally (and it has taken a while) loses what is left of its vitality and settles for being an exhibit rather than a real time visceral and emotional experience.

Last edited: Today at 2:41 AM
__________________

"kind of weird: a tribute to the dearly departed from a band that can treat its living like trash"
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 04-09-2019, 06:07 PM
cbBen cbBen is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 707
Default

Neil Young does it right. Goes out for 8-12 shows, takes time off, then goes out for another 8-12 shows.

Last edited by cbBen; 04-09-2019 at 06:47 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 04-09-2019, 06:57 PM
snroxman snroxman is offline
Senior Ledgie
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 116
Default

I'm all for artists continuing as long as they want and are able. But, do it smartly - more time between dates, take breaks, etc. It sounds like Neil Young is doing it right!
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 04-09-2019, 07:35 PM
michelej1 michelej1 is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: California
Posts: 25,073
Default

And while it is new for rockers, it's not new for entertainers in general. Many of those blues and jazz artists continued to perform into their 80s and 90s. And when I say they performed I mean they were touring for 2/3s of the year. When B. B. King was alive, you could point to any day on the calendar and he was likely to be on the road.

Jerry Lee Lewis married all of his teenaged cousins and killed all of his wives and he was still on the road until his stroke last month. He's 83. The guy had to cancel shows when the stroke happened.

In their youth, these people spent so much time away from their families that they don't feel comfortable "at home." They don't have those community or relationship bonds that we have. They want to die on the road, if they had their druthers.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 04-09-2019, 08:51 PM
SteveMacD's Avatar
SteveMacD SteveMacD is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: The Buckeye State
Posts: 6,735
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by michelej1 View Post
They want to die on the road, if they had their druthers.
Sure as hell beats Hospice.
__________________
On and on it will always be, the rhythm, rhyme, and harmony.

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b313/SteveMacD/fm2014_zps5c60d7b9.jpg
THE Stephen Hopkins
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 04-09-2019, 09:08 PM
BLY BLY is online now
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 1,303
Default

Its their life and all they know is the road. Some do retire like Grace Slick, REM just to name the first two that comes to mind. Its not always the money but Im sure the high that an entertainer gets from the energy of a live audience is like a drug to many.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 04-10-2019, 12:08 AM
bombaysaffires bombaysaffires is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: West Coast
Posts: 4,894
Default

Which is why La Nickss nonsense about wanting to retire to her apartment to dance is such crap

Just like a few years back she was whinging on about retiring to her trailer in Malibu never happened

Or before that retiring to some cliff side castle to write. Never happened.

She only does three shows a WEEK. The rest is in presidential suites with minions taking care of everything. This is a woman who moaned about the difficulties seeding a couple weeks with her family over the holidays.
__________________
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump

Billy Burnette Vintage 80's Pin Pinback Badge Rockabilly
$29.95
Billy Burnette Vintage 80's Pin Pinback Badge Rockabilly picturePress Photo Billy Burnette, Guitarist - spp41773
$19.99
Press Photo Billy Burnette, Guitarist - spp41773 picture1992 Press Photo Singer Billy Burnette - hcp33943
$18.97
1992 Press Photo Singer Billy Burnette - hcp33943 picture1980 Press Photo Entertainer Billy Burnette during a performance - hcp33944
$18.97
1980 Press Photo Entertainer Billy Burnette during a performance - hcp33944 pictureRARE 1980s Original 35mm Negative Strip of (3) Rock Star BILLY BURNETTE
$15.88
RARE 1980s Original 35mm Negative Strip of (3) Rock Star BILLY BURNETTE picture



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:59 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
© 1995-2003 Martin and Lisa Adelson, All Rights Reserved