FM Fan Club Victims Bring Out the Big Guns?

Gypsy · #1 06-15-2003, 03:19 AM

May I present: The Internet Fraud Complaint Center (Or, as Bugs Bunny once said, "Ain't I a stinker?")

http://www1.ifccfbi.gov/index.asp

http://www1.ifccfbi.gov/cf1.asp

Description:
(IFCC) is a partnership between the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) and the National White Collar Crime Center (NW3C). IFCC's mission is to address fraud committed over the Internet. For victims of Internet fraud, IFCC provides a convenient and easy-to-use reporting mechanism that alerts authorities of a suspected criminal or civil violation. For law enforcement and regulatory agencies at all levels, IFCC offers a central repository for complaints related to Internet fraud, works to quantify fraud patterns, and provides timely statistical data of current fraud trends.

Collective Ledgie deep breath, everyone. It's kind of heavy.
However, enough is enough-bring out the big guns. I feel that we, as FM Fan Club Members, were terribly screwed, and have been chasing our collective tails. I know many of us have "irons in the fire", so to speak, and are willing to wait to see how things turn out, but every time I come online I read of new ways we are, or have been, misled and shafted again. To those that may say, "let it go, already", I say, if we weren't so upset about it, we wouldn't be bringing it up so damned much. We'd much prefer to go back to our families, and friends, and the music that we love that has brought us all together. We all regret that the "Fan Club Fiasco" occurred-but not as sorry as Jonathan Todd and SabreMark should be to have ever lied to us, taken our hard-earned money and trust, and disappointed us as fans of Fleetwood Mac. Accountability must take place.

Just an idea, and let me know what you all think:
I propose we make a very clear-cut, point-by-point list here of our Fan Club grievances (doubtless many of you already have lists like these). Perhaps we could use this thread as an information clearinghouse, point-by-simple-straightforward-point. Facts only. That list would be used as a basic backbone to refer to, as we fill out our individual complaints (in addition to adding our individual, personal experiences on the complaints.)

Shall we, friends? I believe that 50 complaints, to start out with, would cause enough interest to be raised at the IFCC and an investigation to be started, at least. We've all got the documentation, and we have got a case, you know.

Ideas, comments, anything, anyone? I would like to know that there's some grouping of support- that although we would go in and fill out our forms individually, that we would also be doing it as a group. Because the Internet Fraud Complaint Center may not investigate 10 or 20 complaints as deeply as they would if 50 rolled in about the same company, and focused on the same basic problems and grievances. That's why I suggest we take the time to do it properly, say, over the span of a week?

Hm. Let me know what you think, y'all.

Regards,
Gypsy

p.s. I know seeknpeace posted a link to this a while back, just sayin' thanks.

Gypsy-Rhiannon · #2 06-15-2003, 03:21 AM

I think this is a great idea. However my main grievance isn't so much with the fan club but with Jonathan Todd and his insulting mis-sent email. Can that be counted too?

Pip

Gypsy · #3 06-15-2003, 03:31 AM

You could add that as the personal experiences part of your email. It would be in addition to the grievances that all of us have, it would be just another nail in his coffin, because it happened to you, individually.
It's all in the wording, by the way. Feelings are not facts, but facts are facts. EVERYTHING's all in the wording, baby.

I would start posting some of the grievances, but I am so darned tired right now.

I'll come back tomorrow to do so unless people just want to start throwing some bones out there, in addition to posting about what they think...

Goodnight...

DownOnRodeo · #4 06-15-2003, 04:47 AM

I want Sabremark to be disassociated from FM. If they want a Mick Fleetwood Club - fine, but those two can leave Stevie and Lindsey out of their shameless money-grabbing ride on the wave of BN talent.
Sadly this is more a decision that Mick, Lindsey or Stevie need to make, I think.
On the other hand, Todd has and brazenly CONTINUES to grossly mispresent his poor product/service - I encourage you have been at the wrong end of that to use whatever consumer agencies and authorities are available to you in the US.

wetcamelfood · #5 06-15-2003, 09:22 AM

This is a good idea, but I thought this was the idea Marty had with this thread:

http://ledge.fleetwoodmac.net/showth...&threadid=8954

So maybe the separate areas should be taken from whatever was said in that thread? Just an idea.

John

highpriestess53 · #6 06-15-2003, 10:28 AM

I believe our protest should also be taken to people like PRWeb
please read the bull**** at this link...then if you will take the time to e-mail these people to tell them of the scandalous behaviour of SabreMark Inc.

http://www.prweb.com/firm/prf1830.htm

highpriestess53 · #7 06-15-2003, 10:36 AM

We should 'reach out' to SabreMark's affilliates. Does anyone here know of any methods by which we can do this?

seeknpeace · #8 06-15-2003, 12:26 PM

Hey. Pip...first off, The FBI thing won't apply for you cause you did not join the club, but, the BBB and the CA atty Gens office could, as you have a right as a concerned citizen to report suspected fraud...so, you could go with that. You could do the BBB because of his treatment to you, think.

If you go to Sabre Mark's website, he has a list of clients there and some letters that say what a wonderful dude he is and runs. However, if you go to those websites, you will not see any of those companies are using him, his company, or mentioning him on their websites, and the letters are all at least two to three years old. So, nothing recent and he is no longer affiliated with the companies.

IMO...one of the best ways to get anyones attn. is more ppl going to the CA Atty Gen. That is one avenue that DID write back....I think that the FBI is overwhelmed, but, the more letters the get the more quickly this will be dealt with.

So, Please.....Ppl....if you want this done, if you want JT out and if you want Sabre Mark out, then write write write. Call Call Call.

Please. The more, the more likely.

Miranda · #9 06-15-2003, 08:39 PM

What about all the conflicts of interest? What about the sequence of events? Is there a single place where anyone can go to see how this all went down? Any easy way to see the whole picture without surfing around the Internet and emailing everyone who's spoken badly of the fan club? It may seem easy to understand if you were involved in the club, but what about people who didn't follow the story from the beginning? For people like us, it's harder to see the whole picture. It's almost like this thing needs it's own website!

seeknpeace · #10 06-15-2003, 08:58 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Miranda
What about all the conflicts of interest? What about the sequence of events? Is there a single place where anyone can go to see how this all went down? Any easy way to see the whole picture without surfing around the Internet and emailing everyone who's spoken badly of the fan club? It may seem easy to understand if you were involved in the club, but what about people who didn't follow the story from the beginning? For people like us, it's harder to see the whole picture. It's almost like this thing needs it's own website!

I do think that we need a website. Several of us have that information, some of us in a legible timeline format. There is a core group who has documented it all and to whom the ppl who know that they have been violated have turned and thus then becoming part of that group.

I am not proficient in that area. A website, how to set it up, etc., is alien to me. Anyone out there who would like to tackle that job?

SaraRhiannon · #11 06-15-2003, 09:57 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by seeknpeace
A website, how to set it up, etc., is alien to me. Anyone out there who would like to tackle that job?

If all of the info is already typed up and somewhat organized, it would only take me a few minutes to get it up on the web. I'd be more than willing to host it and maintain it, but I probably won't have time to actually type up and compile everything-- is that pretty much done already? If so, it would be a breeze to put it up on the web, and I'd be happy to do that.

Gypsy · #12 06-16-2003, 12:09 AM

What a great idea. Hmm...does someone have this info in a format that SaraRhiannon could use....Seeknpeace? GypsyRhiannon? Highpriestess53? Anyone else?
Wow, what a great idea. OK, my head is spinning.
OK, if anyone wants to send me info on how to help out with this one, let me know. I'm really good at organizing and formatting things so that they make sense and are user-friendly.
Better watch out that JT doesn't try to hack the site, though. Hahaha. Let's see him try to copy the content off THAT site, *snicker*.
Alright, I'm off to put my thinking cap on.

OK-LANDSLIDE · #13 06-16-2003, 12:47 AM

I have written everyone and PR representive I have e-mail address for. I have gotten no response from anyone at all. I emailed Today Show, Tonight Show, CNN, MSNBC, local TV Networks and Newspapers. I feel like somebody out there has to listen to us on this issue and back us up. Todd is such a money sucking parasite he will not be stopped until he is made to do so.
They say things can be done in numbers....Maybe website is the way to go?? That way I feel we can attract more fan club members who got the shaft and also more attention to our issues with fan club. How many people have actually gotten refunds? I've been fighting for mine almost 2 monthes now. I am willing to do anything ask of me to help this cause out. I really don't know how to start a website but am willing to learn and would gladly do so or help anyone else with website. Someone just point me in the right direction on where to learn how to start website or how to help them with one. Because I can say I am willing to give 110% to this. I like many others want to get on with loving Fleetwood Mac and their music, but at this time I have been burned so bad by fan club fiasco it is very hard. I'm not so much upset with band as my disgust for JT!! But listening to Say You Will CD seems to just bring up the sleeping dragons I'm trying to put to bed. Just let me know what I can do to help.....because I like many others am sick of LIVING ANOTHER DAY IN THIS FAN CLUB HELL!! Not to mention the fact that daily with new leg of tour being added, others are still joining Fan Club.
OK-LANDSLIDE

highpriestess53 · #14 06-16-2003, 07:42 AM

GO TO THE THREAD 'NEWS CONTACTS FOR THE WORLD'

THIS SHOULD BE IN AT LEAST SOME OF THE NATIONAL NEWSPAPERS

seeknpeace · #15 06-16-2003, 09:47 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Gypsy
What a great idea. Hmm...does someone have this info in a format that SaraRhiannon could use....Seeknpeace? GypsyRhiannon? Highpriestess53? Anyone else?
Wow, what a great idea. OK, my head is spinning.
OK, if anyone wants to send me info on how to help out with this one, let me know. I'm really good at organizing and formatting things so that they make sense and are user-friendly.
Better watch out that JT doesn't try to hack the site, though. Hahaha. Let's see him try to copy the content off THAT site, *snicker*.
Alright, I'm off to put my thinking cap on.

Ok..this is something that we will do. I will try to organize this with you, and Sara and OK and anyone else if I can just have a few days...do not let it go. I have some intense work to do for all my clients and it is consuming my time right now. I have to get them all moved to another area by the end of the month and it entails contacting everyone of them and having new paper work, blah blah blah. SOOO, I will start on this asap...or try to get some others involved who can sooner.

Also, you guys, stay on me bout this cause I am overwhelmed right now with my business and I have a full sched and I would love to see this done. My info is complete, just not in as good of a format and time line. It will take me most of one or two days to get it ready and it is worth it to me.