Tusk at 40: FM's defining record

[michelej1]

Originally Posted by elle

yes! there is that one part in Caution that sounds soo so Lindsey ("Straight out of the news"). i have been re-listening to that part and couldn't figure it out, same as you. can be either way. and we know he contributed some of his production tricks to the track, from what Ronnie was saying.

I think I hear him on Caution.

[SteveMacD]

How in the hell are you not grasping the question as to whether or not CHRISTINE sang on any of LINDSEY’S songs on LBCM?

That’s the entire premise of this thread. Aside from SYW (and “Eyes of the World”), Lindsey didn’t have the girls sing on his songs after “Rumours.”

[elle]

Originally Posted by SteveMacD

How in the hell are you not grasping the question as to whether or not CHRISTINE sang on any of LINDSEY’S songs on LBCM?

That’s the entire premise of this thread. Aside from SYW (and “Eyes of the World”), Lindsey didn’t have the girls sing on his songs after “Rumours.”

not sure who are you yelling at.... but some of us don't like people yelling and cursing.

Sad Angel. Red Sun. Miss Fantasy.

yes. aside from.

[SteveMacD]

Originally Posted by elle

not sure who are you yelling at.... but some of us don't like people yelling and cursing.

Sad Angel. Red Sun. Miss Fantasy.

yes. aside from.

Okay, AND EP... (forgive me for forgetting about something that was a thing for like five minutes). I guess I should also mention “The Dance,” too, while I’m at it.

“Red Sun” is a CHRISTINE vocal, so that doesn’t answer the very simple question as to whether or not Christine sang or played on any of the songs LINDSEY sang lead vocals on, but I suspect you’re intentionally being an obtuse pain in the ass instead of actually answering a simple question.

[elle]

Originally Posted by SteveMacD

Okay, AND EP... (forgive me for forgetting about something that was a thing for like five minutes). I guess I should also mention “The Dance,” too, while I’m at it.

“Red Sun” is a CHRISTINE vocal, so that doesn’t answer the very simple question as to whether or not Christine sang or played on any of the songs LINDSEY sang lead vocals on, but I suspect you’re intentionally being an obtuse pain in the ass instead of actually answering a simple question.

Steve. you need to calm down and stop yelling and insulting people. nobody is here so that you can question them either. and maybe you should read the title of the thread too, before claiming it's about something completely different.

Red Sun was originally a Lindsey song. Christine added lyrics to his music. she is singing a lead on his song. which part of that is so hard to understand?

you are arguing how somehow he is not "letting" her sing a backup on his songs - meanwhile he is not only "letting her" sing back up but she is singing lead on his song. Red Sun alone shoots down your whole premise. i understand you don't like it, but there it is. you know - collaboration.

[SteveMacD]

Originally Posted by elle

Steve. you need to calm down and stop yelling and insulting people. nobody is here so that you can question them either. and maybe you should read the title of the thread too, before claiming it's about something completely different.

Red Sun was originally a Lindsey song. Christine added lyrics to his music. she is singing a lead on his song. which part of that is so hard to understand?

you are arguing how somehow he is not "letting" her sing a backup on his songs - meanwhile he is not only "letting her" sing back up but she is singing lead on his song. Red Sun alone shoots down your whole premise. i understand you don't like it, but there it is. you know - collaboration.

No it doesn’t. That’s a collaboration. He had the music, which was probably intended for Stevie, and she added lyrics and melody. In publishing, Christine would be considered 75% writer.

However, HIS songs (as opposed to THEIR songs), the ones he sang lead on, weren’t collaborations. Did Christine sing on THOSE?

[UnwindedDreams]

Originally Posted by SteveMacD

“Red Sun” is a CHRISTINE vocal, so that doesn’t answer the very simple question as to whether or not Christine sang or played on any of the songs LINDSEY sang lead vocals on, but I suspect you’re intentionally being an obtuse pain in the ass instead of actually answering a simple question.

I want to state I disagree with this bullying of Elle. Would a male also be called the same in this context? Or demanded of to answer to someone here.

To my ears, Christine sings on the chorus of Love Is Here to Stay, On With the Show, and Lay Down for Free.

[mitzo]

I guess the reason Lindsey insisted on filling FM albums with his own solo work (that nobody wanted to hear) is his failed solo career and jealousy of Stevie's success. It was always his way of asserting himself and "getting even". It hurt the band as a number of cuts on albums were unlistenable to the majority of fans, and caused the group to basically stop recording at all as Stevie just shut down any efforts to try again.

[SteveMacD]

Originally Posted by UnwindedDreams

I want to state I disagree with this bullying of Elle. Would a male also be called the same in this context? Or demanded of to answer to someone here.

Bullying?!?

Yes, for the record, I absolutely would criticize a man for intentionally being an obtuse pain in the ass if he was intentionally being an obtuse pain in ass.

It was obvious what the initial question was and Elle kept intentionally dodging it by bringing up irrelevant examples, going to great lengths to not answer the question or simply say she didn’t know.

To my ears, Christine sings on the chorus of Love Is Here to Stay, On With the Show, and Lay Down for Free.

Maybe. It’s hard for me to distinctly hear her in there if she even is. It could just as easily the Fairlight.

[jmn3]

Originally Posted by mitzo

I guess the reason Lindsey insisted on filling FM albums with his own solo work (that nobody wanted to hear) is his failed solo career and jealousy of Stevie's success. It was always his way of asserting himself and "getting even". It hurt the band as a number of cuts on albums were unlistenable to the majority of fans, and caused the group to basically stop recording at all as Stevie just shut down any efforts to try again.

Um...cool take? Lindsey's solo stuff has rarely been something I am a big fan of (with some notable exceptions) and I would agree that some of his stuff on it's own is very un-Fleetwood Mac. But let's not just suggest that Stevie only brought gems to the sessions. Some of what ended up on any post-solo career Fleetwood Mac albums by any of the three were absolute pieces of trash that could be considered unlistenable to a majority of fans. If I never heard When I See You Again, Welcome to the Room, Sara, Sweet/Silver Girl, or Without You again, I would be absolutely fine. They belong in the same garbage heap of outtakes as Family Man, My Little Demon, and Red Rover.

[jmn3]

Originally Posted by SteveMacD

Bullying?!?

Yes, for the record, I absolutely would criticize a man for intentionally being an obtuse pain in the ass if he was intentionally being an obtuse pain in ass.

It was obvious what the initial question was and Elle kept intentionally dodging it by bringing up irrelevant examples, going to great lengths to not answer the question or simply say she didn’t know.



Maybe. It’s hard for me to distinctly hear her in there if she even is. It could just as easily the Fairlight.

To be fair, I would classify a lot of your posts to you being an obtuse pain in the ass just to be one. I would use that on a lot of men and women (and any other gender classifications one wants to use) on this board.

Also being fair, I agree with you that Lindsey's Fleetwood Mac songs would have benefited by including more of Christine and Stevie's voices over the years. This particular group of 5 has always been better together than any one of the individuals on their own. They all brought some critical ingredient to the pot that made those first albums fire. And yes, that includes Stevie. She's become an insufferable shrew
and her crap over the last two decades have resulted in a creative permafrost on the band culminating in her getting Lindsey fired and then going out with a ridiculous, unnecessary, and nonsensical version of the band in 2018-19. However, her input and presence was key to their achievements over the years.

[ViscountViktor]

Originally Posted by elle

guess you didn't have much interest in Buckingham McVie. it was all over their interviews at the time.

right, that's my point - your premise is flawed. there are tons of Lindsey tracks that are not "solo" after Rumours era, as you yourself point out. there are a good number that are solo too, sure. but it's not all or nothing, the way your theory is trying to present it.

so blaming it all on Lindsey doesn't work. he was trying really really hard to make a band album the last 15 years. there is someone else in that band who was putting a brake on it, repeatedly. we could have had several FM band albums since 2004. it's disingenuous to use the fact that Stevie repeatedly put a stop on those possible albums as an argument that it's all Lindsey's fault.

btw, I don't think Lindsey sings on Carnival Begins. and live, he definitely didn't sing on Too Far Gone (except maybe "too. far. gone" part, that the whole band sang on.

God you're unpleasant to converse with on here. Let's end this conversation.

[ViscountViktor]

Originally Posted by SteveMacD

How in the hell are you not grasping the question as to whether or not CHRISTINE sang on any of LINDSEY’S songs on LBCM?

That’s the entire premise of this thread. Aside from SYW (and “Eyes of the World”), Lindsey didn’t have the girls sing on his songs after “Rumours.”

Thank you. Exactly my point.

[ViscountViktor]

If Red Sun even was a Lindsey song, he probably gave the lead to Christine so the album would be split 50/50. That's really not my point.

ALL of Christine's leads on BuckVie have Lindsey on them. If Chris is on Lindsey's leads, it is very hard to make out and could easily be him putting his voice through effects, which is what he preferred to do for the MAJORITY of his 'band contributions' post Rumours. Fact.

I love loads of Lindsey's stuff post Rumours. Tusk is my favourite Mac album. But it doesn't stop my feeling that his songs would've been elevated more if he had actually allowed other people on them, in the spirit of, you know, this band he was in. I don't know the reason for it, but it comes across as selfish.

I mean, Stevie was sat in the studio for Tusk and Mirage for hours doing f*ck all. He could've actually used her.

[tabruns]

Originally Posted by ViscountViktor

Point is that after Rumours, Lindsey doesn't like sharing his tracks, which made a mockery of Fleetwood Mac being a 'band'.

I just think it's sad, what we missed out on had he allowed others in. But then strangely on Say You Will Stevie is all over his songs. Probably because he was forced to as part of her agreeing to do it.

I think FM would have benefited from Lindsey taking a more band-approach too. But regarding SAY YOU WILL, I think Buckingham and Nicks sharing vocals on most of the songs was because they were trying to avoid a "two solo albums put together" feel; and still some critics view SAY YOU WILL that way anyway.