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  #616  
Old 03-08-2013, 09:43 PM
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rhiannondontgo rhiannondontgo is offline
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Originally Posted by The Catdancer View Post
I like your idea of her chucking her safe formula and just give us a night full of songs she has never done before. We've been fans for a long time and if she messes up we'll forgive her, we have in the past
I remember at my last SN show, she said to us that her dream concert would be multiple hours long where we could just throw out requests "like Angel or Sisters of the Moon" and she'd do them. And there would be "cookies and cakes and beer"
I doubt anything like that will ever happen but it's cool to think Stevie has thought about it.
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  #617  
Old 03-08-2013, 09:44 PM
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Oh, and here's my unpopular Stevie opinion -- I'm tired of fans saying she's "only in it for the money."

Do I believe the woman likes being rich? Of course I do. But 40 years in, I'm not sure why she has to keep proving to people that it's about more than just the money for her.

She could have easily sold off her publishing rights for millions and retired years ago, if that's all she cared about. Meanwhile, she's still recording (17 songs over the past few years) and writing.
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  #618  
Old 03-08-2013, 09:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Johnny Stew View Post
Oh, and here's my unpopular Stevie opinion -- I'm tired of fans saying she's "only in it for the money."

Do I believe the woman likes being rich? Of course I do. But 40 years in, I'm not sure why she has to keep proving to people that it's about more than just the money for her.

She could have easily sold off her publishing rights for millions and retired years ago, if that's all she cared about. Meanwhile, she's still recording (17 songs over the past few years) and writing.
I agree. It's not like IYD made her any real money. If she was only in it for the dough, she wouldn't be making albums. She'd be loading up on Greatest Hits tours and GH albums and wouldn't give a f**k about giving us new material. She's not delusional, she knows new albums will not be hits and will not rake in money. But she does it anyway.
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  #619  
Old 03-09-2013, 12:19 AM
MikeInNV MikeInNV is offline
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Originally Posted by Johnny Stew View Post
Oh, and here's my unpopular Stevie opinion -- I'm tired of fans saying she's "only in it for the money."

Do I believe the woman likes being rich? Of course I do. But 40 years in, I'm not sure why she has to keep proving to people that it's about more than just the money for her.

She could have easily sold off her publishing rights for millions and retired years ago, if that's all she cared about. Meanwhile, she's still recording (17 songs over the past few years) and writing.
I agree. I don't know why people say this so much more about Stevie than the other Macsters. If anything, she's the one who seems the least excited about this upcoming cash-grab tour. I think she would rather be spending her time with the IYD doc, or the Sound City Players, or any number of other things that would make her far less money than this tour.
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  #620  
Old 03-09-2013, 12:20 AM
bombaysaffires bombaysaffires is offline
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Originally Posted by rhiannondontgo View Post
I agree. It's not like IYD made her any real money. If she was only in it for the dough, she wouldn't be making albums. She'd be loading up on Greatest Hits tours and GH albums and wouldn't give a f**k about giving us new material. She's not delusional, she knows new albums will not be hits and will not rake in money. But she does it anyway.
But that's her solo stuff. This upcoming tour is Mac.. and I am beginning to think she's adopted a sort of Lindsey attitude about it-- Mac is for making the big money and the solo work is an outlet for your art.
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  #621  
Old 03-09-2013, 01:11 AM
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Originally Posted by bombaysaffires View Post
But that's her solo stuff. This upcoming tour is Mac.. and I am beginning to think she's adopted a sort of Lindsey attitude about it-- Mac is for making the big money and the solo work is an outlet for your art.
I get that too...she might as well be sipping coffee during songs at Mac shows.

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  #622  
Old 03-09-2013, 07:08 AM
FierySequences FierySequences is offline
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Originally Posted by Johnny Stew View Post
Oh, and here's my unpopular Stevie opinion -- I'm tired of fans saying she's "only in it for the money."

Do I believe the woman likes being rich? Of course I do. But 40 years in, I'm not sure why she has to keep proving to people that it's about more than just the money for her.

She could have easily sold off her publishing rights for millions and retired years ago, if that's all she cared about. Meanwhile, she's still recording (17 songs over the past few years) and writing.
I agree with you, Rhiannondon'tgo and Mike^^^

You know, I posted awhile back on this topic "Stevie in it for the $". I don't believe this is ALL true. I truely believe that Stevie likes being in a "live" RnR band, she has told us this numerous times, and I don't doubt it. Am I naive to believe that she doesn't like to earn money? Hell no, and I don't fault her for it.

She could very well call FM quits and be done. Do her "side" work and be fulfilled artistically and finacially. I may be alone in this opinion, but I believe Stevie can not/will not let go of Mac. She will never be able to face "Yesterday's Gone" when it comes to the band. There is her love affair with the past, the band's legacy, and the bands members (read into what you like) that will always draw Stevie back in.

Aside from this fact, I do believe she considers her bandmates her long-term friends, which she should. She has this need to be needed and helpful. Stevie sees this as an opportunity to make some money, (hopefully) have some fun, and also help her mates out in the process. Let's not even bring up the fact that Jess and Barbara fixed her and Chris up pretty nicely in recent years.

I think that she gets alot of flack for "doing it for the money" b/c she will not/is not interested in creating a new album with Mac. It's not as if Stevie has a house full of children/teens and another mortgage to pay off or even a brand new restaurant in Maui. Stevie is stepping up to the mike to help her old mates out. Of course, she is doing it for the money and the spotlight, too. But she is doing it with an open heart and is genuinely concerned for her friends.

Her heart is in the right place, even if she just "phones" in her performances...all that tells me, as a fan is that she often has true intentions in the "grand idea" of things and gets bored very easy when the band tours for a whole year or so.
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  #623  
Old 03-09-2013, 10:12 AM
mitzo mitzo is offline
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For me. at least, the "in it for the money" thing is a result of her reluctance to record. She let 4 years pass between The Dance and TISL, content to cruise on a retrospective - Enchanted. She let 9 years elapse between TISL and IYD, content to cruise on two retrospectives - Soundstage and Crystal Visions. She now balks at recording with FM. During all this time, she has toured, making money off of the concerts. If, as many here seem to agree, there is no money in recording, then that is probably why she is so unproductive, and prefers to tour. Therefore she is in the business for the money. All this is just fine as a business model. But touring and singing the same songs over and over for decades is not making art. Art implies creation, and that implies new music.
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  #624  
Old 03-09-2013, 12:26 PM
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Originally Posted by mitzo View Post
For me. at least, the "in it for the money" thing is a result of her reluctance to record. She let 4 years pass between The Dance and TISL, content to cruise on a retrospective - Enchanted. She let 9 years elapse between TISL and IYD, content to cruise on two retrospectives - Soundstage and Crystal Visions.
'Enchanted' was a contractual obligation -- the record company was going to put it out whether Stevie was involved or not, so she choose to be involved to make the package something special. As such, we got tons of rare photos, lyrics to every song, and an entire disc of tracks that never appeared on one of Stevie's albums.

Once the 'Enchanted' promotion and tour was wrapped up, she went right into working on 'TISL.' As Sheryl Crow was Stevie's choice for producer, she had to work around Sheryl's own recording & touring schedule. When they saw that it was taking too long to finish Stevie's album, John Shanks was brought in to help finish it (as was David Kahne and Pierre Marchand).

And don't forget that, between 'TISL' and 'IYD,' we got 10 new Stevie songs with Fleetwood Mac.

Meanwhile, both 'Soundstage' and 'Crystal Visions' might not have included any newly-penned songs, but she did put a personal effort into making both packages stand out.

Mind you -- I'm not saying that there wasn't way too long of a gap between new songs for my taste. I just think we should remember that Stevie wasn't at home with her feet up on the couch the entire time.

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Originally Posted by mitzo View Post
During all this time, she has toured, making money off of the concerts. If, as many here seem to agree, there is no money in recording, then that is probably why she is so unproductive, and prefers to tour. Therefore she is in the business for the money. All this is just fine as a business model. But touring and singing the same songs over and over for decades is not making art. Art implies creation, and that implies new music.
She's in her mid-60s (the same age as my father, who's retired) -- I think she's earned the right to rest on her laurels a little, without having her artistic integrity called into question. Like I said in my previous post, I would have thought all those years of writing like mad and recording tons of material -- not to mention her renewed creativity -- should be enough proof to fans that she's not "all about the money."

Last edited by Johnny Stew; 03-09-2013 at 12:30 PM..
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  #625  
Old 03-09-2013, 03:02 PM
mitzo mitzo is offline
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Johnny Stew: "all those years of writing like mad and recording tons of material"

Were back in the '70's and '80's.
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  #626  
Old 03-09-2013, 07:36 PM
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Originally Posted by mitzo View Post
Johnny Stew: "all those years of writing like mad and recording tons of material"

Were back in the '70's and '80's.
Sure... but a hell of lot of performers slow down in their 50s & 60s. Especially if they kept the pace that Stevie did for a couple of decades.

My point was that she -- in my opinion -- has more than earned the right to not have her artistic integrity questioned, even if she never records another song. She's paid her dues and she certainly shouldn't have to keep proving herself to anyone at this stage.
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  #627  
Old 03-09-2013, 08:41 PM
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Originally Posted by rhiannondontgo View Post
I agree. It's not like IYD made her any real money. If she was only in it for the dough, she wouldn't be making albums. She'd be loading up on Greatest Hits tours and GH albums and wouldn't give a f**k about giving us new material.:
Exactly, it's not about the money for new recordings, most of that goes straight to the big record company anyway . Stevie's far from ignorant, and must know, at her age, her selling marketability is limited. Sure, a hit single will sell more concert tickets, but Stevie is already a proven commodity. So while IYD may not have been cash cow, platinum selling album for Stevie, it was far from a flop. It was a creative resurgence, not only for Stevie, who had long started peppering her set-list with numerous covers to avoid sleep-walking through her set. But more importantly for her fans! "In Your Dreams" single-handidly reaffirmed and revitalized her hardcore fans who were beginning to grow weary & unimpressed (myself included) If it weren't for the hundreds of bootlegs to sustain my interest for over 15 years and IYD hadn't come along when it did, I would have lost interest @4 years ago, after the "Greatest Hits" w/ a deep cut or two thrown in - Unleashed concert tour of 09'. This coming from a fan of over 30+ years!

Last edited by Christopher; 03-09-2013 at 08:57 PM..
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  #628  
Old 03-10-2013, 01:00 AM
NoLight77 NoLight77 is offline
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Originally Posted by On Ice View Post
Hi No Light,
I agree with much of what you've said and you've expressed your thoughts accurately and respectfully. I especially like this comment:


I believe there is a huge missing piece in Stevie's life story that she has not captured well in either her writing or any of the "historical" perspective she puts forward. She has to know that her loyal fans have heard it all before and would be tired of hearing the same recycled stories with lots of inaccuracies thrown in for whatever reason she chooses to do so. She totally doesn't get the fan experience. I really have to wonder if she's ever asked herself the question, what do they see in me and how have they stood by me through all of the drama and disappointments through the years. The most current example is her hype around this 2013 tour and how wonderful it's going to be. Wonderful for whom? She and Lindsey or the thousands of fans paying money they can't afford to see her put as little effort as possible into songs she's sang thousands of times? This would be a great opportunity for self analysis and ask a few tough questions of herself: what I'm I bringing to the fan's experience and are they getting their money's worth? The toughest question I think is have I earned this loyalty they show me when I've disappointed them too many times to count over the years? The wonderful moments like the Wiltern show are just way to rare to warrant constant attention and shelling out the big bucks. My #1 reason for sitting out this tour.


Hi On Ice! I'm sorry it's taken so long for me to get back to you.

If this happened, if she got real with herself and us, we would see a different Stevie Nicks. I think that because she gets so much love from us that she thinks we love EVERYTHING she does. She gets our approval at every show. But when it comes to asking us how we feel...she doesn't ask us. And we can't ask her because there is no way to ask her. She sings for us but won't talk to us.

This changed when she recently did the q and a's for the doc, and talked to the fans. For the first time, she addressed us. This, after no other way to contact her. Had I been there, I would have told her about my love for some of her demos. I would not have cared about her reaction. I would have been nervous. But I would still tell her.

At these q and a's she admitted that she knows we would love a piano and Stevie tour, no other instruments. She said it would be great, but not practical.

I think it's easier for her to do the same songs because it's less work for her. I think her concerts are easy money for her...she knows what to do. Is she milking us? Sometimes, when I look at it, yes, she is milking us.

I think it's all about respect. Does she respect us? At the q and a for the doc, in the video I saw of the event, at the end when fans are outside waiting for her to exit the theater, she walks right by them and gets into her SUV. In my opinion, she could have stopped and talked with them. They were few in number. But she just got into her car with Karen. These fans are the ones who make sure Stevie has a nice house to live in. I would think that she would take the time to greet them. I've seen and heard of this behavior of her's way too much by other fans and it disappoints me no end. I've heard of people coming from out of state to a show and standing in the cold. She lets them stand there.

To defend Stevie on this, she learned how to tour from Fleetwood Mac. And being in a huge band, they, I guess, didn't stop to greet fans as much. I am guessing. So she doesn't do it in her solo career either.

Stevie made it known at the q and a's, that she knows what we want. She knows we want to hear different songs. She knows we want more new material. I guess it's just a matter of doing it. She knows some of us want to hear Sisters of the Moon at this coming concert.

We love Stevie too much to miss a show, either hers or FM's. But what other way can it be shown her that we are tired of the same ol'? I guess if we stopped paying for the same show?

I don't blame you for sitting out this coming show. I sat out the IYD shows after her mom died.

In the end, I agree with you that she doesn't get the fan experience, our experience. I also think it's about laziness. It's about singing Landslide over and over. It's about not respecting us, her fans.

Last edited by NoLight77; 03-10-2013 at 01:50 AM..
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  #629  
Old 03-10-2013, 01:36 AM
NoLight77 NoLight77 is offline
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Originally Posted by TheWILDheart View Post
The verses of Moonlight are actually "Lady From The Mountain" which was written in like 1974, so I doubt that's how she's feeling now.



The reason the Melbourne DVD was never release has nothing to do with her performance, and purely on the fact that Stevie had botox too close to the concert and it's VERY noticeable - she can barely move her face.



Not sure what songs you expect on a Greatest Hits package. Personally, I'll never tire of "Stand Back" or "Talk To Me" and I have no problem with GH albums, I just wish she'd shake up her live set and add some of those "Greatest Hits" back in. "Rooms on Fire" and "Whole Lotta Trouble" haven't been performed since 2000 and "Talk To Me" hasn't been performed since 1994, yet non-hits like "Enchanted" and "How Still My Love" (not that I don't LOVE those songs) and an abundance of cover songs that she doesn't need to include are always present - why ignore 1/2 your solo career in your set? I don't get it.

As for "hidden gem" collections, she's NEVER going to release her piano demo's - she's expressed her dislike of the bootleg and demo trading online and will keep as many demo's locked away as she can to dip into in the future, when she can be bothered making another album.



Agreed. She'll cash in on ANYTHING. Mick is just the same, hence the constant rehash releases of old material, tour after tour with the same setlist with a 10 year gap between new solo material and NO new Fleetwood Mac album. Where is her desire to create? She's just not interested anymore. Touring with the same sets brings in a LOT of money for something that's easy to do, especially with Fleetwood Mac.



Lady from the Mountain in the 70's, 80's, did not have the lyrics: "She's lonely, lost, disconnected. She finds no comfort in her surroundings. Beautiful, insecure, she has nothing. She moves from situation to situation like a ghost." These are new lyrics she added to it.

As for Melbourne, I'm going to agree with Johnny Stew who said it was probably meant more for audio, because yes, at the end she didn't change out of her B and B outfit for Dreams and Outside the Rain. As for her botox, what a time to get it when you do an album with an orchestra!!! Another miss in Stevie's career.

When it comes to the Crystal Visions cd, I just wish that the picture on the cover would match the music inside. The 80's picture would better match either a live album, or a rarities album. Not another greatest hits, which is all Stevie knew how to do before IYD.

As for her ignoring the other half of her solo career, good question. She could do Smile At You live now! Even though it's on SYW, she could do it solo! Why not?

Yeah, she won't release the piano demos. And as a result, lots of people don't know what Stevie is capable of! SO many beautiful songs, all collecting dust in her vault.

Last edited by NoLight77; 03-10-2013 at 01:57 AM..
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  #630  
Old 03-10-2013, 02:02 AM
mitzo mitzo is offline
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Exactly, it's not about the money for new recordings, most of that goes straight to the big record company anyway . Stevie's far from ignorant, and must know, at her age, her selling marketability is limited. Sure, a hit single will sell more concert tickets, but Stevie is already a proven commodity. So while IYD may not have been cash cow, platinum selling album for Stevie, it was far from a flop. It was a creative resurgence, not only for Stevie, who had long started peppering her set-list with numerous covers to avoid sleep-walking through her set. But more importantly for her fans! "In Your Dreams" single-handidly reaffirmed and revitalized her hardcore fans who were beginning to grow weary & unimpressed (myself included) If it weren't for the hundreds of bootlegs to sustain my interest for over 15 years and IYD hadn't come along when it did, I would have lost interest @4 years ago, after the "Greatest Hits" w/ a deep cut or two thrown in - Unleashed concert tour of 09'. This coming from a fan of over 30+ years!
Too bad that a creative resurgence has to come so late and so many years from other original material. The long dry periods make her lose fans and every new album, which appears 7 to 10 years after the last, has to be some re-entry or comeback. IYD came so many years after TISL. And she was 63 years old. I mean, come on. Now I am back to bootlegs and unreleased demos...
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