Stevie, Lindsey or Christine?

[TerraRhiannon]

I think they are all equally amazing/ important but then again I am in the end.. a total Chiffonhead all the way But lately I have been listening to Christine's Mac songs a lot more than any other songs. I've just been in that mood....

[MacFan92]

I voted for Christine. Even though I overall enjoy Stevie slightly more, I voted just considering their Mac material, not considering their solo material. Plus Christine is gonna need help to mount support against the Lindsey and Stevie diehards. The truth is that all three are fantastic singers, songwriters, and performers, and polls such as these usally devolve into petty arguements in which people lose sight of what a forum such as this is about- coming together in mutual admiration of one of our favorite artists: Fleetwood Mac. These polls, while they can be fun, can at times tear people apart (a bit overdramatic, I know, but you get what I mean haha).

[MacShadowsBall]

Originally Posted by elle

seems my prediction may have been way off - results so far:

Christine McVie 9
Lindsey Buckingham 13
Stevie Nicks 29

so Christine might have more than 10 fans here, while Lindsey is not even close to 20 yet and there may be only 4-5 more people i could think of as LB fans here. must be that we are just really loud!

and Stevie is not even at 30 yet... but i am pretty sure that many rabid SN fans don't really ever look outside SN forum. probably don't even know there's rumours forum here!

I've read several posts from the Stevie forum that indicate to me that several of them don't check out/participate on the Rumours forum. I imagine they are more "Stevie Nicks" fans and not "Fleetwood Mac" fans. Though I don't post there much, but I do check it out and read them.

I haven't voted yet, but I will tonight.

BTW, did anybody read my post I made earlier? I hope I'm not on everybody's ignore list!

[elle]

Originally Posted by MacShadowsBall

I've read several posts from the Stevie forum that indicate to me that several of them don't check out/participate on the Rumours forum. I imagine they are more "Stevie Nicks" fans and not "Fleetwood Mac" fans. Though I don't post there much, but I do check it out and read them.

I haven't voted yet, but I will tonight.

BTW, did anybody read my post I made earlier? I hope I'm not on everybody's ignore list!

well, i am definitely a LB and not FM fan. but i do check and post here. and if i'm really really bored i check SN forum to see whether anybody's bashing lindsey. if they are, i even sometimes post there (after i tone down several notches what i initially want to say) - and most of SN forum posters promptly ignore what i have to say!

[elle]

Originally Posted by MacShadowsBall

This comes across to how people refer to Fleetwood Mac songs. Go Your Own Way is always "Lindsey Buckingham". Gold Dust Woman is known as Stevie's Gold Dust Woman. I get upset when Fleetwood Mac songs are referred to as songs by the individual members. Yes, I know he or she wrote the lyrics, melody, etc, but still they are Fleetwood Mac songs.

I think too the lines get blurred with Lindsey/Stevie doing so many FM songs are their solo tours and vice versa.

hmm, what do you want them to do?! those are their songs! just like oh well or man of the world are peter green's songs. otherwise you'd have a situation like CCR suing fogerty and he was not allowed to perform his own songs. i guess mick can become desperate and try to do that to lindsey and stevie, but i'm pretty sure they own most of the rights to songs they wrote.

[MacShadowsBall]

Originally Posted by elle

well, i am definitely a LB and not FM fan. but i do check and post here. and if i'm really really bored i check SN forum to see whether anybody's bashing lindsey. if they are, i even sometimes post there (after i tone down several notches what i initially want to say) - and most of SN forum posters promptly ignore what i have to say!

Not that one can't be both FM fan and a fan of the member's themselves and their respective solo careers.

I've found the "Preview Post" feature works wonders. Preview it, read over it, hit reply, log out and run away!

Originally Posted by elle

hmm, what do you want them to do?! those are their songs! just like oh well or man of the world are peter green's songs. otherwise you'd have a situation like CCW suing fogerty and he was not allowed to perform his own songs. i guess mick can become desperate and try to do that to lindsey and stevie, but i'm pretty sure they own most of the rights to songs they wrote.

...call them Fleetwood Mac songs!

Question for you, elle - how many Fleetwood Mac songs does Lindsey perform on his solo tours/performances? Don't wanna get away from topic, just curious about his solo shows, partly in comparsion to Stevie's solo shows.

EDIT: didn't want to double post

I made myself a playlist of my favorite Christine and Stevie's, Fleetwood Mac songs.

Christine - 11 songs
Stevie - 6 songs

...so for me twice as many Christine songs made my playlist. I found myself removing Stevie's songs, esp her early Mac and later Mac songs. However the remaining 6 songs, I'm fairly hardcore about. Where as with Christine's, I'm only hardcore about two or three of them. Does that make sense?

[elle]

Originally Posted by MacShadowsBall

Not that one can't be both FM fan and a fan of the member's themselves and their respective solo careers.

one can, sure! but when i listen to FM songs i find myself skipping over most of SN or CM songs. the only studio FM albums i own are Tusk and SYW. other than hits, i barely know other Mirage and TITN songs and when there was a poll comparing 2 albums i had to go on youtube to listen to songs so i can make more-less informed decision. in contrast, i own every studio and live album, DVD and blu-ray LB ever put out solo. so - make your own conclusions .

Originally Posted by MacShadowsBall

Question for you, elle - how many Fleetwood Mac songs does Lindsey perform on his solo tours/performances? Don't wanna get away from topic, just curious about his solo shows, partly in comparsion to Stevie's solo shows.

on SWS tour, LB did 6 FM songs, in the 19-song setlist all together.

he said he's trying to keep FM songs to a minimum during solo tours. btw did you hear he will tour SOLO (alone!! with just his guitar) this late spring and summer?!

ok, back to your question: he did NGBA, BL, SHN, Tusk, ISA, GYOW during SWS tour.

how many FM songs does stevie generally have as a part of her solo tours?

Originally Posted by MacShadowsBall

...so for me twice as many Christine songs made my playlist. I found myself removing Stevie's songs, esp her early Mac and later Mac songs. However the remaining 6 songs, I'm fairly hardcore about. Where as with Christine's, I'm only hardcore about two or three of them. Does that make sense?

sure!

[michelej1]

Originally Posted by Nico

He isn't the star of FM, obviously, and he did not have Stevie's lyrical prowess

For me, Lindsey is a terrific lyricist. I don't think he became poetic until Tusk and then, obviously, SYW began taking that to a whole other level entirely. But even early on, although his words didn't evoke the flights of fancy and dreamy imagination that Stevie's did, their simplicity allowed him to tie them to the emotion of a song and accentuate his tortured vocal, so splendidly.

To me, because ISA's words are so sparse, it feels more like someone who is slipping and falling into despair. And of course, Go Insane is the quintessential example of this. I mean, there are no words that can express what "she's a lot like you" means more than those 5 do, not the way he screams them. Suddenly, you see there's another woman in the relationship and she came out of nowhere, born in that simple sentence. She haunts him. She haunts them. I think the way Lindsey inserts her is magical and the way he delivers the line, tells us all we need to know about his losing battle to escape.

Those things blow me away, as do basic statements like "Fate takes time."

I never thought his lyrics lacked -- well, except for those horrible Family Man type lapses.

Michele

[MacShadowsBall]

Originally Posted by elle

one can, sure! but when i listen to FM songs i find myself skipping over most of SN or CM songs. the only studio FM album i own is Tusk. other than hits, i barely know other Mirage and TITN songs and when there was a poll comparing 2 albums i had to go on youtube to listen to songs so i can make more-less informed decision. in contrast, i own every studio and live album, DVD and blu-ray LB ever put out solo. so - make your own conclusions .

...and when I listen to Fleetwood Mac, I find myself tempted to skip over Lindsey's songs. Its like we are the complete opposite.

Originally Posted by elle

on SWS tour, LB did 6 FM songs, in the 19-song setlist all together.

he said he's trying to keep FM songs to a minimum during solo tours. btw did you hear he will tour SOLO (alone!! with just his guitar) this late spring and summer?!

ok, back to your question: he did NGBA, BL, SHN, Tusk, ISA, GYOW during SWS tour.

how many FM songs does stevie generally have as a part of her solo tours?

So about 1/3 of his tour is FM songs. Stevie does about 4 songs - Rhiannon, Landslide, Dreams, and Gold Dust Woman. She typically has a shorter setlist and does about 2-3 cover songs.

Interesting though they both ignore the Post-Mirage songs and concentrate on the white album and Rumours album songs.

A true solo-tour sounds awesome, kinda like a 1-man show.

Also I'd like to add that generally, I'm not a guitar guy. I tend to gravitate to the vocals, drums, and then the keyboards. FM tend to emphasize vocals and rhythm quite well. A lot of their songs actually are "guitar lite".

[elle]

Originally Posted by MacShadowsBall

.Interesting though they both ignore the Post-Mirage songs and concentrate on the white album and Rumours album songs.

A true solo-tour sounds awesome, kinda like a 1-man show.

it is a 1-man show!

Big Love is from Tango, so post-mirage.

he does both Big Love and Never Going Back Again completely alone anyway - whether with mac or solo. and you can easily argue that acoustic Big Love is a completely different song that he reworked and first started doing acoustically on his 1992/93 solo tour, when he was on a 10-year hiatus from the mac.

NGBA, SHN and GYOW - from Rumours
Big Love - from Tango
Tusk - from Tusk
ISA - from FM

so he did 3 songs from Rumours, and 1 each from FM, Tusk and Tango. but he ignored Mirage and SYW, on the last tour at least.

of course, you can easily argue that most of LB's Tusk and SYW songs are solo songs anyway - since he recorded them either on his own away from the band, or as a solo album in the first place.

[MrStevie]

Originally Posted by michelej1

For me, Lindsey is a terrific lyricist.

Got to agree with you on this one.

And of course, Go Insane is the quintessential example of this. I mean, there are no words that can express what "she's a lot like you" means more than those 5 do, not the way he screams them. Suddenly, you see there's another woman in the relationship and she came out of nowhere, born in that simple sentence. She haunts him. She haunts them. I think the way Lindsey inserts her is magical and the way he delivers the line, tells us all we need to know about his losing battle to escape.

Michele

I apologize if this seems rude, but I've got to disagree with you a little bit on Go Insane. Not that your featured line isn't an example of LB's great gift as a lyricist. It is!!! Just for a different reason. I don't think the line you mentioned has anything to do with injecting another woman into a relationship. If you've seen the great video of the original single for GI, that song is all about Lindsey doing self analysis. "She's a lot like you" means "she" is a lot like Lindsey. The back and forth begins with "two kinds of people in this world...winners...losers..." he's talking about himself in both roles. He is also talking about himself when he compares the woman in the song to himself. The winners/losers line applies to her, too. Nothing within the song itself indicates a third party comparison, as far as I can tell. I'm not sure why everyone thinks so, but that's just my take. No biggie.

[David]

Originally Posted by elle

one can, sure! but when i listen to FM songs i find myself skipping over most of SN or CM songs.

Well, that's you, elle, but that's not me. The foundation of my fanaticism for this band is the orchestration of the tracks, and Lindsey happens to be the individual most responsible for those decisions (in several cases, he's also the individual most responsible for the execution of the orchestrative ideas). By orchestration, I mean the common definition: the "layout" of the sounds on a song or an album. That includes decisions about parts (the notes and chords played, which is also called arrangement), instrumentation (the combination of instruments used to generate the intended color), the vocal score, and the mix (applying dynamics and effects to what's on tape in order to create a specific atmosphere).

All this stuff is just as important to the Nicks and McVie tracks as it is to the Buckingham tracks--hence many people's interest in it. In fact, Lindsey himself has said--and I think I agree--that his best work of this sort has been on their songs, not necessarily his own.

the only studio FM albums i own are Tusk and SYW. other than hits, i barely know other Mirage and TITN songs and when there was a poll comparing 2 albums i had to go on youtube to listen to songs so i can make more-less informed decision. in contrast, i own every studio and live album, DVD and blu-ray LB ever put out solo. so - make your own conclusions

I'd conclude that you don't have much interest in Buckingham as an arranger, orchestrator, vocal harmonizer, or guitarist, because all this stuff plays such a major role in Mac albums from 1977 to now. But of course I don't know for certain what turns you on about Lindsey.

[elle]

Originally Posted by David

Well, that's you, elle, but that's not me. The foundation of my fanaticism for this band is the orchestration of the tracks, and Lindsey happens to be the individual most responsible for those decisions (in several cases, he's also the individual most responsible for the execution of the orchestrative ideas). By orchestration, I mean the common definition: the "layout" of the sounds on a song or an album. That includes decisions about parts (the notes and chords played, which is also called arrangement), instrumentation (the combination of instruments used to generate the intended color), the vocal score, and the mix (applying dynamics and effects to what's on tape in order to create a specific atmosphere).

All this stuff is just as important to the Nicks and McVie tracks as it is to the Buckingham tracks--hence many people's interest in it. In fact, Lindsey himself has said--and I think I agree--that his best work of this sort has been on their songs, not necessarily his own.

I'd conclude that you don't have much interest in Buckingham as an arranger, orchestrator, vocal harmonizer, or guitarist, because all this stuff plays such a major role in Mac albums from 1977 to now. But of course I don't know for certain what turns you on about Lindsey.

beautiful post David - well most of the stuff about orchestration, although why do feel a lot of criticism towards what i may like screaming from the part that i bolded ?! are you saying LB puts no guitar, production or arrangement effort in his solo stuff?

i of course don't have nearly the extensive musical knowledge or appreciation that you do (i more/less coasted through music school playing flute and quit when i actually had to put some work and practice into it!) but i enjoy reading your dissections. and i just listen to what i like.

when i first started listening to lindsey's stuff, i was confused how all over the spectrum his music is. my preference and what drew me in was his more rocking stuff, and of course perfect tight little pop songs like SHN. but once i heard the acoustic BL and GI that sealed it for me.

although i love his guitar parts on Mac songs from other singer/songwriters, especially melodic ones on many of stevie's songs (i listen to a drivel like that SYW song just for that simple but melodic guitar part in the middle, and also stand through stevie's nasal singing of DR for that guitar outro - but can't stand gypsy - sorry LB, i know you are proud of it). i also love his harmonies especially with christine and the ones he pulled with stevie on the recent tour versions of beautiful child and storms, but to me this is still not enough to entice me to want to listen to their songs as much as his (with the exception of a song like hold me maybe!). there are many other singer/songwriters that would be on my list in between LB and the rest of the Mac members. (just to clarify, i'm talking rumours-era mac members.)

see what you started, now i'll hear it from people how i'm being mean again!

EDIT: just want to add, i respect and can appreciate your preference for the whole mac as a sum of the parts vs the individual members, and complete rounded songs. like you said though, that's you, not me. and that's why this is so interesting, we are all drawn towards and love different things and it's nice to hear different opinions and points of view! great discussion!

[MacShadowsBall]

Originally Posted by elle

see what you started, now i'll hear it from people how i'm being mean again!

I don't think you're being mean. Actually you're being quite clear, honest, and refreshing.

Obviously Stevie is the favorite of the three. The vote for Christine and Lindsey is mostly split.

[michelej1]

Originally Posted by David

I'd conclude that you don't have much interest in Buckingham as an arranger, orchestrator, vocal harmonizer, or guitarist, because all this stuff plays such a major role in Mac albums from 1977 to now.

I agree. You know, I love Jimmy Stewart, but except for Destry Rides Again (in which I think he was unusually sexy), I have not seen ANY of his westerns. I don't like westerns. I don't watch them. And I'm happy with that, but I realize that it gives me limited insight into Jimmy Stewart. And I always say with, Cary Grant, for instance, "If I didn't know how cold he was in Notorious, then I could never appreciate his wackiness as much as I do in Holiday."

Knowing the full panopoly and range gives me so much more to appreciate. Studying the differences between Cary with Dunne and Cary with Hepburn gives me such insight. The contrasts add so much depth to my understanding of his talent. And I don't have that with Jimmy Stewart. Cuz I don't like westerns.