Lindsey discusses his firing (Rolling Stone)

[SteveMacD]

Originally Posted by Angel75

You would DO SOMETHING TO STOP IT. He was your good friend.

But they weren’t good friends. They were collaborators and had a great musical chemistry, but they weren’t especially close whenever they weren’t working. Christine has said this numerous times. She talked with Mick frequently throughout her retirement, with the occasional communications with John and Stevie, but never with Lindsey.

[dreamsunwind]

Originally Posted by SteveMacD

But they weren’t good friends. They were collaborators and had a great musical chemistry, but they weren’t especially close whenever they weren’t working. Christine has said this numerous times. She talked with Mick frequently throughout her retirement, with the occasional communications with John and Stevie, but never with Lindsey.

Speaking for myself, if I had known anyone for 4 decades and worked alongside them so much, I'd automatically consider that person a good friend, regardless of how often we may hang out and chat on our own. That's a long, long time to know and work with someone.

[bwboy]

Originally Posted by dreamsunwind

Speaking for myself, if I had known anyone for 4 decades and worked alongside them so much, I'd automatically consider that person a good friend, regardless of how often we may hang out and chat on our own. That's a long, long time to know and work with someone.

Pardon my long post, but your post really struck a chord with me. I know I like to think of FM as a family or as fairly tight friends, but SteveMacD is probably right- they are not close like I like to imagine. This incarnation has made, over the course of 40+years, 5 albums (FM, Rumours, Tusk, Mirage, and Tango). And we all know Tusk and Tango were not recorded by the band the way the other albums were. And when they toured, they likely spent very little time together except when they were on stage, and they makes sense, even though, again, I would have liked the idea that before the show, they might hang out and go sight seeing together, or have dinner, or whatever. Clearly they didn't, except when Billy Burnette and Rick Vito were in the band. Billy wrote in his book about how the entire band would jam after a show, including Stevie. Still, that was the exception rather than the rule. Once the band hit it big, any true closeness they had by traveling to gigs in a van or sharing hotel rooms vanished when they started taking jets and staying in individual penthouse suites. So Christine and Mick are close, Stevie and Mick are close, and John and Mick are probably kind-of close. Christine and Lindsey liked each other and had mutual respect, but they weren't close. Mick and Lindsey liked each other and had mutual respect, but they weren't close. And as I mentioned, during the past 40+years, they all probably went several years without communicating. We all know from mid-1987 to mid-1996, there was very little communication between them. Stevie recorded Twisted with Lindsey, and Mick and John worked on an album with Lindsey, but that was it. From 1997-2014, Christine probably talked to no one but Mick. I doubt Lindsey and John hung out, or Stevie and John, or Christine and John, or Christine and Stevie, or Christine and Lindsey. Mick seems to be the glue, if you will.

Stevie (and Lindsey, to a much lesser extent) talk a big game about their relationship, but to me, it's Hollywood talk. If Stevie's still hung up on Lindsey, then she needs to see a counselor. I really can't tell how much of her prattle about Lindsey is real or fake- even if they were like a married couple, they were still only together what, 4 years? Hardly a lengthy period of time, although going from struggling artists to successful millionaires virtually overnight would certainly create a bond, I grant her that.

The reason I write all this is that I've come to realize in the past few years that Stevie doesn't want to work with Lindsey anymore in the studio, and now she doesn't want to tour with him anymore, either. We know she didn't want to record with him because... after Say You Will, she didn't and wouldn't. She never said that in interviews, but it was obvious. Right or wrong, she made that decision and stuck to it, but she was still willing to tour with him. Then something happened and it sounds like she said "that's it, it's either him or me" and the band made their decision. I can't fault them, they need to make money to support their lifestyles, and recording doesn't bring in the money that touring does. Here's why people are going to say I'm wrong, but I can't fault Stevie, either. Regardless of her reasoning, she gave the band a the chance to choose, and they chose her. I've worked at the same agency for nearly 25 years in various positions, and I've had my share of conflicts with co-workers. While I've never given an ultimatum like that to my boss ("that's it, it's either him or me"), there have been times I wanted to! It's just that I couldn't afford to lose my job! Stevie CAN afford to issue that sort of ultimatum. We have to remember that being in FM is a job for them. In that respect, is it right to expect people who don't want to work together be forced to do so for our enjoyment?

A lot of people say that Stevie should have swallowed her pride, and that she owes Lindsey because if it hadn't been for Lindsey insisting she be allowed to join FM as well, she wouldn't be where she is today. Well, that's true, but it's just as possible that FM wouldn't have achieved the level of fame and success they did without Stevie. The simple fact is, those 3 songwriters created something together that probably wouldn't have existed if there had only been 2 of them. Lindsey left in 1987 because he had reached his limit and sadly, he left in 2018 because Stevie reached her limit. I don't recall anyone saying in 1987 that Lindsey should have sucked it up and toured with FM because he owed them for letting him join FM. Stevie doesn't owe Lindsey anymore. They've all been vastly rewarded for their work a million times over, financially and creatively.

Whew... again, sorry for the long post. I am not trying to change anyone's mind here. I just wanted to show another POV here. Lindsey's interview was very classy and I am THRILLED that he shared his story. I can't wait to see him in concert.

[Jondalar]

How bitterly ironic. Lindsey wouldn’t join FM without Stevie and now she has him kicked out over nothing.

[secondhandchain]

Originally Posted by Jondalar

How bitterly ironic. Lindsey wouldn’t join FM without Stevie and now she has him kicked out over nothing.

Doesn't matter what the chiffonheads say, she will FOREVER be known at the old hag who busted up the Rumours five.

[StevieandChris]

Originally Posted by secondhandchain

Doesn't matter what the chiffonheads say, she will FOREVER be known at the old hag who busted up the Rumours five.

By some people.

[Angel75]

Originally Posted by bwboy

Lindsey left in 1987 because he had reached his limit and sadly, he left in 2018 because Stevie reached her limit.

Not to be TOO nitpicky....but Lindsey did not leave, he was FIRED...not his CHOICE

[bombaysaffires]

Originally Posted by bwboy

Pardon my long post, but your post really struck a chord with me. I know I like to think of FM as a family or as fairly tight friends, but SteveMacD is probably right- they are not close like I like to imagine. This incarnation has made, over the course of 40+years, 5 albums (FM, Rumours, Tusk, Mirage, and Tango). And we all know Tusk and Tango were not recorded by the band the way the other albums were. And when they toured, they likely spent very little time together except when they were on stage, and they makes sense, even though, again, I would have liked the idea that before the show, they might hang out and go sight seeing together, or have dinner, or whatever. Clearly they didn't, except when Billy Burnette and Rick Vito were in the band. Billy wrote in his book about how the entire band would jam after a show, including Stevie. Still, that was the exception rather than the rule. Once the band hit it big, any true closeness they had by traveling to gigs in a van or sharing hotel rooms vanished when they started taking jets and staying in individual penthouse suites. So Christine and Mick are close, Stevie and Mick are close, and John and Mick are probably kind-of close. Christine and Lindsey liked each other and had mutual respect, but they weren't close. Mick and Lindsey liked each other and had mutual respect, but they weren't close. And as I mentioned, during the past 40+years, they all probably went several years without communicating. We all know from mid-1987 to mid-1996, there was very little communication between them. Stevie recorded Twisted with Lindsey, and Mick and John worked on an album with Lindsey, but that was it. From 1997-2014, Christine probably talked to no one but Mick. I doubt Lindsey and John hung out, or Stevie and John, or Christine and John, or Christine and Stevie, or Christine and Lindsey. Mick seems to be the glue, if you will.

.

maybe not family but more like comrades in arms. like a squadron that's been through the war together (hello, hello sad angel.. have you come to fight the war?) they've been in the trenches, they've been through **** together, they've seen each other at their worst... inevitable traveling around so many years. so yeah, there's a bond there. you see things, you don't have to like the person or the action but you have a code that says what happens in the band isn't discussed outside the band.

[gldstwmn]

Originally Posted by bwboy

Stevie (and Lindsey, to a much lesser extent) talk a big game about their relationship, but to me, it's Hollywood talk. If Stevie's still hung up on Lindsey, then she needs to see a counselor. I really can't tell how much of her prattle about Lindsey is real or fake- even if they were like a married couple, they were still only together what, 4 years? Hardly a lengthy period of time, although going from struggling artists to successful millionaires virtually overnight would certainly create a bond, I grant her that.

Regardless that is the story they sold to a hungry public who bought it up in droves since 1997. I can't figure out what Lindsey is trying to accomplish by shattering his own myth even if that myth does happen to include Stevie. Me personally I never shipped anyone in this band. I've been a fan way before that was even really a thing. I just don't get it.

[bombaysaffires]

Originally Posted by gldstwmn

Regardless that is the story they sold to a hungry public who bought it up in droves since 1997. I can't figure out what Lindsey is trying to accomplish by shattering his own myth even if that myth does happen to include Stevie. Me personally I never shipped anyone in this band. I've been a fan way before that was even really a thing. I just don't get it.

He made it very clear in interviews that it was an "act" and "theatrics" -- his words. He stated that his family wasn't bothered by it because they all understood it was an act. He never pretended it was real.

[dreamsunwind]

Originally Posted by bwboy

Pardon my long post, but your post really struck a chord with me. I know I like to think of FM as a family or as fairly tight friends, but SteveMacD is probably right- they are not close like I like to imagine. This incarnation has made, over the course of 40+years, 5 albums (FM, Rumours, Tusk, Mirage, and Tango). And we all know Tusk and Tango were not recorded by the band the way the other albums were. And when they toured, they likely spent very little time together except when they were on stage, and they makes sense, even though, again, I would have liked the idea that before the show, they might hang out and go sight seeing together, or have dinner, or whatever. Clearly they didn't, except when Billy Burnette and Rick Vito were in the band. Billy wrote in his book about how the entire band would jam after a show, including Stevie. Still, that was the exception rather than the rule. Once the band hit it big, any true closeness they had by traveling to gigs in a van or sharing hotel rooms vanished when they started taking jets and staying in individual penthouse suites. So Christine and Mick are close, Stevie and Mick are close, and John and Mick are probably kind-of close. Christine and Lindsey liked each other and had mutual respect, but they weren't close. Mick and Lindsey liked each other and had mutual respect, but they weren't close. And as I mentioned, during the past 40+years, they all probably went several years without communicating. We all know from mid-1987 to mid-1996, there was very little communication between them. Stevie recorded Twisted with Lindsey, and Mick and John worked on an album with Lindsey, but that was it. From 1997-2014, Christine probably talked to no one but Mick. I doubt Lindsey and John hung out, or Stevie and John, or Christine and John, or Christine and Stevie, or Christine and Lindsey. Mick seems to be the glue, if you will.

Stevie (and Lindsey, to a much lesser extent) talk a big game about their relationship, but to me, it's Hollywood talk. If Stevie's still hung up on Lindsey, then she needs to see a counselor. I really can't tell how much of her prattle about Lindsey is real or fake- even if they were like a married couple, they were still only together what, 4 years? Hardly a lengthy period of time, although going from struggling artists to successful millionaires virtually overnight would certainly create a bond, I grant her that.

The reason I write all this is that I've come to realize in the past few years that Stevie doesn't want to work with Lindsey anymore in the studio, and now she doesn't want to tour with him anymore, either. We know she didn't want to record with him because... after Say You Will, she didn't and wouldn't. She never said that in interviews, but it was obvious. Right or wrong, she made that decision and stuck to it, but she was still willing to tour with him. Then something happened and it sounds like she said "that's it, it's either him or me" and the band made their decision. I can't fault them, they need to make money to support their lifestyles, and recording doesn't bring in the money that touring does. Here's why people are going to say I'm wrong, but I can't fault Stevie, either. Regardless of her reasoning, she gave the band a the chance to choose, and they chose her. I've worked at the same agency for nearly 25 years in various positions, and I've had my share of conflicts with co-workers. While I've never given an ultimatum like that to my boss ("that's it, it's either him or me"), there have been times I wanted to! It's just that I couldn't afford to lose my job! Stevie CAN afford to issue that sort of ultimatum. We have to remember that being in FM is a job for them. In that respect, is it right to expect people who don't want to work together be forced to do so for our enjoyment?

A lot of people say that Stevie should have swallowed her pride, and that she owes Lindsey because if it hadn't been for Lindsey insisting she be allowed to join FM as well, she wouldn't be where she is today. Well, that's true, but it's just as possible that FM wouldn't have achieved the level of fame and success they did without Stevie. The simple fact is, those 3 songwriters created something together that probably wouldn't have existed if there had only been 2 of them. Lindsey left in 1987 because he had reached his limit and sadly, he left in 2018 because Stevie reached her limit. I don't recall anyone saying in 1987 that Lindsey should have sucked it up and toured with FM because he owed them for letting him join FM. Stevie doesn't owe Lindsey anymore. They've all been vastly rewarded for their work a million times over, financially and creatively.

Whew... again, sorry for the long post. I am not trying to change anyone's mind here. I just wanted to show another POV here. Lindsey's interview was very classy and I am THRILLED that he shared his story. I can't wait to see him in concert.

I get what you're saying and I agree that they're not all each other's very good friends but they're people who met each other decades ago and have stayed working together, on and off, ever since then. I think there's just something in having known someone and worked with them for such a lengthy period of time that's supposed to be special. Like Kristen even said, her kids called them 'Aunt' and 'Uncle' even if they didn't see each other that often.

And in the end I don't think getting picky about who owes or doesn't owe who what, who made the band what it was, who did this or that-- in the end I think whoever could do this to someone else just really messed up big time. No matter which way you spin it or how you may try to reason behind it, it's just a sad, ugly thing to do to someone.

[FuzzyPlum]

Originally Posted by SteveMacD

But they weren’t good friends. They were collaborators and had a great musical chemistry, but they weren’t especially close whenever they weren’t working. Christine has said this numerous times. She talked with Mick frequently throughout her retirement, with the occasional communications with John and Stevie, but never with Lindsey.

Maybe they weren't good friends, but I've no reason to believe they disliked each other. When you spend a year making a record with somebody and then do a tour with them there has to be some sort of relationship on some level. Unless they had a falling out on that tour (which I don't believe for one minute), her not being in contact after what went down is just bloody weird.
...Isn't that weird?