Lindsey was fired. RIP Fleetwood Mac.

[elle]

starting a clean slate, because it seems that new people keep coming out of the woodwork asking why he "left" every few seconds. some people don't want to accept the sad truth that the band he made huge fashioning its music for the last 43 years betrayed one of their own, a family member.

Lindsey's kids are on the internet very clearly saying - he was fired. and that FM is not FM without him, and how proud of him they are.
his brother is out there too, saying the same.
his wife's IG is sporting #teamlindsey hashtag.

news outlets confirmed that he was fired by the band insiders who don't want their names out there, but want the truth to be known. Rolling Stone and Variety are not gossip rags that put out there some unconfirmed gossip. Billy's leaks pulled the trigger before Fm was ready.

i can't help but wonder what's going on behind the scenes. there is a lot of buzz that Lindsey was fighting it legally, but who knows. not clear whether he's fighting to stay in the band or just suing the pants out of them. i understand all my friends who are FM fans first and are sad that the band's longest and most successful incarnation is dead (and properly moved to post-rumours forum here), and want him back. ii did sign and amplified all the various petitions from people wanting him back. but i can't help thinking how betrayed he must feel by the people he considered family, and that he probably doesn't want to see them for a while now. as far as the band members, Stevie, i'm just sad for. she must be a very unhappy person. but mostly i'm disgusted with Mick. and his cold statement cements it and is lower than low.

from all the backlash, maybe their tour will bomb badly. wouldn't that be karmic considering that they fired him because of money, ie pretty rational calculation that FM minus Lindsey would make more money than FM minus Stevie? most general social media comments are laughing at the complete craziness and yet another post-success chimera version of the band. i think with this move they made sure there will be movies made about FM.

[lennonfan]

Originally Posted by elle

starting a clean slate, because it seems that new people keep coming out of the woodwork asking why he "left" every few seconds. some people don't want to accept the sad truth that the band he made huge fashioning its music for the last 43 years betrayed one of their own, a family member.

Lindsey's kids are on the internet very clearly saying - he was fired. and that FM is not FM without him, and how proud of him they are.
his brother is out there too, saying the same.
his wife's IG is sporting #teamlindsey hashtag.

news outlets confirmed that he was fired by the band insiders who don't want their names out there, but want the truth to be known. Rolling Stone and Variety are not gossip rags that put out there some unconfirmed gossip. Billy's leaks pulled the trigger before Fm was ready.

i can't help but wonder what's going on behind the scenes. there is a lot of buzz that Lindsey was fighting it legally, but who knows. not clear whether he's fighting to stay in the band or just suing the pants out of them. i understand all my friends who are FM fans first and are sad that the band's longest and most successful incarnation is dead (and properly moved to post-rumours forum here), and want him back. ii did sign and amplified all the various petitions from people wanting him back. but i can't help thinking how betrayed he must feel by the people he considered family, and that he probably doesn't want to see them for a while now. as far as the band members, Stevie, i'm just sad for. she must be a very unhappy person. but mostly i'm disgusted with Mick. and his cold statement cements it and is lower than low.

from all the backlash, maybe their tour will bomb badly. wouldn't that be karmic considering that they fired him because of money, ie pretty rational calculation that FM minus Lindsey would make more money than FM minus Stevie? most general social media comments are laughing at the complete craziness and yet another post-success chimera version of the band. i think with this move they made sure there will be movies made about FM.

I'm still so surprised by this. I had no idea it was this bad behind the scenes. It really doesn't make sense, I mean, didn't they have plenty of time recently to do their own thing? If they can't stand each other why commit to a tour in the first place? Mick's statement is one of the most cold things I've read in a while. It also supremely contradicts what he's said in the past.

I'm very upset they're treating Lindsey this way. Danny...then Bob....now Lindsey. I doubt I can ever look at Mick the same way again. This jumps the shark.

[aleuzzi]

RIP Fleetwood Mac indeed.

This is the craziest, most idiotic move of this band's crazy and idiotic career.

[NotonRodeo]

Such are my feelings towards this "band" [sic] now that I do really hope Buckingham sues the heck out of them. And he will have a far better claim than Bob Welch ever did.

[chriskisn]

Fleetwood Mac has survived for 51 years, don't reckon Lindsey going will be the end. The music will live on, the crowds will still flock to see them, the money will roll in. Albums might not sell but then even with Lindsey they weren't going to sell many.

We don't know why, it will come out in the end but hell the facts are still muddied about the Weston sacking and I wasn't even born then

I don't get too caught up in the personalities, just hope we get some new music, and a new album.

[Japhry]

word on the street has it that Lindsey refused to make any setlist changes and is/was very rigid. Mick, Stevie and Chris wanted to make significant setlist changes. Face it....as much as Lindsey contributed to the band, he was NOT the entire history of Fleetwood Mac and he was becoming bored with the Mac in recent years...

[David]

Originally Posted by chriskisn

Fleetwood Mac has survived for 51 years, don't reckon Lindsey going will be the end.

The notion of survival doesn't mean all that much to me. The planet is filled with bands that have survived, but who wants to listen to them? I drive down the 215 and see a billboard for yet another Journey concert at one of the north county casinos, and I think "Good Lord." Journey survives — but what's the point? Another year playing casinos and fairs milking the old hits made famous by the original singer? It really is just a paycheck at that point. If Fleetwood Mac wants to "survive" and tour with strange new members, milking old hits made famous by the departed, it is just a paycheck. No interest to me. Those who find it interesting are in luck, certainly — but I wonder whether they're kidding themselves.

The music will live on, the crowds will still flock to see them, the money will roll in.

I'm not so sure that the music will live on. Behind the Mask and Time are as dead as the next album in the cutout bin. This latest (and I hope last) incarnation will leave no lasting music, no legacy. The crowds will still flock, probably, and the money will roll in. The band just wants a paycheck, and they'll get a paycheck.

We don't know why, it will come out in the end but hell the facts are still muddied about the Weston sacking and I wasn't even born then.

I was trying to remember all the members who've been sacked: Danny Kirwan, Bob Weston, Dave Walker, Lindsey Buckingham (twice), Billy Burnette? Lindsey's distinction — a two-time sacking — must hold the record. How embarrassing. (Would you say that Brunning was sacked? Or was he hired only for one gig, which was made clear to him beforehand?)

I don't get too caught up in the personalities, just hope we get some new music, and a new album.

It's the personalities that make the music. Why not get "caught up" in them? Who do you think made Black Magic Woman and Sands of Time and Tusk and Sara and Come a Little Bit Closer and the Derelict?

I reject the sociological view of Fleetwood Mac. It isn't a neighborhood, where people can move in and out without affecting the particular character. Fleetwood Mac, to the contrary, has had so many people move in and out since 1967 that it has several characters, some memorable and some utterly unmemorable. The revolving door policy has certainly generated a bunch of very different audiences, many of which have been at each other's throats.

[TrueFaith77]

It is proper to start this thread because it highlights two key facts:

1. Lindsey was fired. We don't know why or on what grounds, but that is appears to be the case and needs to be reiterated and deserves all the informed conjecture Ledgies can throw at it.
2. Fleetwood Mac is over. It was great while it lasted.

As for the legal aspect, that's interesting. When Hooky was booted from New Order they had to square things with him legally and financially on complex levels because he is a co-founder of the band and (I think?) all members have songwriting credits on all songs. I'm not an expert, I should look into what deal they ultimately made with him to control the New Order name, release new music, tour, and play New Order songs he co-wrote.

I wonder what grounds Lindsey would have IF the band did agree to a certain tour schedule.

I hope he gets as much as possible.

[Lola]

Originally Posted by lennonfan

I'm still so surprised by this. I had no idea it was this bad behind the scenes. It really doesn't make sense, I mean, didn't they have plenty of time recently to do their own thing? If they can't stand each other why commit to a tour in the first place? Mick's statement is one of the most cold things I've read in a while. It also supremely contradicts what he's said in the past.

I'm very upset they're treating Lindsey this way. Danny...then Bob....now Lindsey. I doubt I can ever look at Mick the same way again. This jumps the shark.

Same here. I didn't know there was anything (arguments, whatever) going on around the time of Musicares until I read thru comments about Billy's post. The part I'm having trouble with is he was fired. Like clean out your desk and security will escort you out of the building. Holy crap! Things must have been brewing for awhile that we weren't aware of. I truly think some of this is Stevie's grief. Not excusing her--she married Kim Anderson after Robin died. She has a history of doing insane things in the grieving process. That doesn't excuse the rest of them.

[NotonRodeo]

Originally Posted by elle

starting a clean slate, because it seems that new people keep coming out of the woodwork asking why he "left" every few seconds. some people don't want to accept the sad truth that the band he made huge fashioning its music for the last 43 years betrayed one of their own, a family member.

Lindsey's kids are on the internet very clearly saying - he was fired. and that FM is not FM without him, and how proud of him they are.
his brother is out there too, saying the same.
his wife's IG is sporting #teamlindsey hashtag.

news outlets confirmed that he was fired by the band insiders who don't want their names out there, but want the truth to be known. Rolling Stone and Variety are not gossip rags that put out there some unconfirmed gossip. Billy's leaks pulled the trigger before Fm was ready.

i can't help but wonder what's going on behind the scenes. there is a lot of buzz that Lindsey was fighting it legally, but who knows. not clear whether he's fighting to stay in the band or just suing the pants out of them. i understand all my friends who are FM fans first and are sad that the band's longest and most successful incarnation is dead (and properly moved to post-rumours forum here), and want him back. ii did sign and amplified all the various petitions from people wanting him back. but i can't help thinking how betrayed he must feel by the people he considered family, and that he probably doesn't want to see them for a while now. as far as the band members, Stevie, i'm just sad for. she must be a very unhappy person. but mostly i'm disgusted with Mick. and his cold statement cements it and is lower than low.

from all the backlash, maybe their tour will bomb badly. wouldn't that be karmic considering that they fired him because of money, ie pretty rational calculation that FM minus Lindsey would make more money than FM minus Stevie? most general social media comments are laughing at the complete craziness and yet another post-success chimera version of the band. i think with this move they made sure there will be movies made about FM.

I think it's very smart tactics of Lindsey to keep quiet and let his kids and family speak for him. He knows more than anyone else how chaotic the management of the band is and probably expected they would not be able to come out with a coherent response any time soon--which is exactly what has happened.

It took Fleetwood Mac almost a week after Burnette and the TP photographer went on social media to announce this. I saw threads on Twitter mocking them because the rumour had already been spreading for months in some FM groups. By the time the formal announcement was made the firestorm had already erupted. Their clueless press releases fanned the flames even further.

[NotonRodeo]

It's like the current controversy with Facebook--Zuckerberg did not say anything for days and weeks into the scandal, which made the situation much worse than it would have been had he come out with a statement and interview a day or 2 after the news came out.

Then again, given Mick Fleetwood, an interview with him would only make the band look even more preposterous than they already are.

[lennonfan]

truly, I've never seen anything like this, not even the drama after Tango.

I feel like it wasn't Lindsey it was the FANS that just got bitch slapped by Mick.

The 'people come and go' thing may have worked in '87 but after that so famously tanked it was obvious who came back to save the day hence.

Stunned and admittedly angry it came to this.

[guillamene]

Originally Posted by elle

starting a clean slate, because it seems that new people keep coming out of the woodwork asking why he "left" every few seconds. some people don't want to accept the sad truth that the band he made huge fashioning its music for the last 43 years betrayed one of their own, a family member.

Lindsey's kids are on the internet very clearly saying - he was fired. and that FM is not FM without him, and how proud of him they are.
his brother is out there too, saying the same.
his wife's IG is sporting #teamlindsey hashtag.

news outlets confirmed that he was fired by the band insiders who don't want their names out there, but want the truth to be known. Rolling Stone and Variety are not gossip rags that put out there some unconfirmed gossip. Billy's leaks pulled the trigger before Fm was ready.

i can't help but wonder what's going on behind the scenes. there is a lot of buzz that Lindsey was fighting it legally, but who knows. not clear whether he's fighting to stay in the band or just suing the pants out of them. i understand all my friends who are FM fans first and are sad that the band's longest and most successful incarnation is dead (and properly moved to post-rumours forum here), and want him back. ii did sign and amplified all the various petitions from people wanting him back. but i can't help thinking how betrayed he must feel by the people he considered family, and that he probably doesn't want to see them for a while now. as far as the band members, Stevie, i'm just sad for. she must be a very unhappy person. but mostly i'm disgusted with Mick. and his cold statement cements it and is lower than low.

from all the backlash, maybe their tour will bomb badly. wouldn't that be karmic considering that they fired him because of money, ie pretty rational calculation that FM minus Lindsey would make more money than FM minus Stevie? most general social media comments are laughing at the complete craziness and yet another post-success chimera version of the band. i think with this move they made sure there will be movies made about FM.

Now that the dust is beginning to settle, this is one of the most sensible observations I've read on this mess.Three random thoughts over the past few days:
1.You cannot compare this with 1987 - the 1987 tour was the first in five years and was a virtual comeback. It was successful because it was on the back of TITN and we had 4 tango songs/singles in the set.
2. I listened to the Toronto show from Unleashed tour 2009 yesterday (in 'memory'of LB) and was struck by how good it was with just him and SN.
3. When I first listened to the UK edition of 'The Very Best of Fleetwood Mac' from 2002 -which contained Peter Green era hits, I remember being struck by the sense of a common thread going through ALL of the songs on this collection, despite them being two very different incarnations of the band.

[elle]

and the muddying of the facts and speculations is successfully continuing..........

http://www.kansascity.com/entertainm...208690854.html

Fleetwood Mac's split with Lindsey Buckingham could be band's most damaging

BY TIMOTHY FINN

tfinn@kcstar.com
April 12, 2018 01:53 PM

Fleetwood Mac is waging a dicey bet that its beloved hit songs are more popular than its most vital member.

When the band hits the road later this year, Lindsey Buckingham will not be present. Monday, Fleetwood Mac bomb-shelled the music world by announcing it had parted ways with Buckingham, arguably the band’s centerpiece for the past 40-plus years. It wasn’t explicitly clear if Buckingham quit or was fired (although the consensus was that Buckingham was given his walking papers).

In his place, the band hired Mike Campbell, guitarists for Tom Petty’s Heartbreakers, and Neil Finn, instrumentalist and vocalist for Crowded House, Split Enz and the Finn Brothers.

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We’ve witnessed this scenario before with Fleetwood Mac. In 1987, Buckingham left the band (creative differences) and was replaced by sidemen Billy Burnette and Rick Vito. He returned 10 years later, for a reunion tour, and remained with the band until this week.

And even before Buckingham and Stevie Nicks joined the band in 1975, Fleetwood Mac went through several significant departures, including Jeremy Spencer and Bob Welch.

This puts Fleetwood Mac among a growing group of classic-rock bands touring with replacement members. The Eagles just visited the Sprint Center with their latest lineup, which includes only one founding member, Don Henley.

When co-founder Glenn Frey died in January 2016, it seemed likely that the Eagles were done as a touring band — until they announced in 2017 they’d enlisted Vince Gill and Frey’s son, Deacon Frey, to fill in alongside Joe Walsh, Timothy B. Schmit and several touring musicians.

Reviews of the Eagles’ tour have been glowing. Gill is a natural fit for the Eagles’ sound, and Frey resembles his father, vocally and physically.

Likewise, when Brian May and Roger Taylor of Queen hired former American Idol contestant Adam Lambert to fill in for the late Freddie Mercury (and tour as Queen + Adam Lambert), even skeptics were impressed with the results. Same with the Who: Roger Daltrey and Pete Townshend delivered a worthwhile show when they visited the Sprint Center in April 2016.

The list goes on: AC/DC is down to one founding member, lead guitarist Angus Young, and is now on its third lead singer, Axl Rose.

Donald Fagen is coming to Starlight Theatre later this year, touring as Steely Dan, though his co-founder, Walter Becker, died in September. The opener for that show: the Doobie Brothers, who are down to two founding members, Tom Johnston and Patrick Simmons.

There is plenty of precedent for Fleetwood Mac’s move, but Buckingham’s departure feels different. For one thing, he didn’t die. For another, he is the primary force behind the band’s live shows, as a vocalist, a guitarist and a stage presence.

He had a heavy influence on the band’s studio sound, especially on the “Tusk” album, which took the band’s sound away from the crisp, polished pop sounds of its blockbuster predecessor, “Rumours.” He also proved himself as a solo artist on his first two albums, “Law and Order” and the ecstatically unhinged “Go Insane.”

Lindsay B Fleetwood Mac.JPG
Lindsey Buckingham, a member of the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame band Fleetwood Mac, rehearses with band mate Christine McVie at Sony Studios in Culver City on Wednesday, May 17, 2017. Buckingham is leaving the band and won't be joining them on tour.

Campbell is as good a guitarist as any and should be able to approximate Buckingham’s playing, though they have distinctly different styles. As a friend put it: “(Buckingham) is a finger-picker. Good luck with ‘Big Love.’”

But Campbell alone could bring in some Petty fans in need of a Heartbreakers fix. Plus there is a connection between the two bands. Petty was Nicks’ duet partner on “Stop Dragging My Heart Around,” one of her biggest solo singles. And Buckingham sang background vocals on “Walls (Circus),” a track from Petty and the Heartbreakers’ “She’s The One” soundtrack.

Finn is a refined vocalist and musician who could elevate Fleetwood Mac’s sound much like Gill did the Eagles’, but he is not widely known among mainstream rock fans.

The new ensemble no doubt will faithfully re-create the hits and favorites. But some things can’t be replicated, starting with the history and chemistry between Buckingham and Nicks, an often tumultuous relationship that goes back to the early ’70s and their pre-Mac “Buckingham Nicks” album.

Nicks singing "Go Your Own Way," Buckingham's diatribe about the end of their romance, won't be the same with Finn on the other end.

Fleetwood Mac withstood Christine McVie's departure from the band from 1998 to 2014, but her absence altered their live shows. The band performed twice at the Sprint Center during her retirement, in May 2009 and April 2013. In that 2009 show, they performed two of McVie's songs, "Say You Love Me" and "Don't Stop," her duet with Buckingham.

In the 2013 show they performed only "Don't Stop." Will they cut most of Buckingham's songs from the upcoming tour? That seems unfathomable, nearly as unfathomable as watching someone else perform them.

In the wake of the split, stories have arisen about Buckingham and his behavior within the group and toward Nicks and other women. The Washington Post this week ran a story about Buckingham that asked if he was “rock’s biggest jerk or misunderstood genius?”

All seemed well earlier this year. In January the group convened in New York to perform after accepting the MusicCares Person of the Year.

During his speech, Buckingham told the audience why the band thrived despite all the turmoil: "Not very far below that level of dysfunction is what really exists, and what we are feeling even more now in our career, which is love. This has always been a group of chemistry."

That chemistry has been altered dramatically, and now the rest of the band is betting that it can go forward and thrive on their fans' love for those many great songs and the memories they arouse. At this point, the odds seem stacked against them.

Lindsey Buckingham, a member of the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame band Fleetwood Mac, rehearses with band mate Christine McVie at Sony Studios in Culver City on Wednesday, May 17, 2017. Buckingham is leaving the band and won't be joining them on tour. Tribune News Service

[Storms123]

I think this is an interesting perspective that will play itself out over the next few weeks/months. How are they going to roll this tour out? Full blown? I don't think they can. They need to test markets. This is an expensive mounting, and if it's going to "not be as robust" as OWTS, they need to be able to pivot/pull back/bail. They are all over 65 (may be not the new Neil) You never know when one of them will need a stent put in or hip replacement last minute. I don't mean to be flip, but I don't think the marketing around this one is going to be as cut and dry as previous tours.