Conspiracy Theory #101.

[Regina]

Originally Posted by Tusk!

Now, I have been keeping an eye on STUBHUB.com because I wanted to see what seats I could have got for certain with the same amount of money spent otherwise... That site has tickets front row for like $500-$1000... That is amazing! Great seats still available there for, what I consider, a reasonable price.





$500 to $1000 is a reasonable price?? It is attitudes like that for many fans that have created these inflated ticket prices for decent seats through Ticketmaster, StubHub, etc.

Too bad we can't return to the days of waiting in line for tickets and the best seats went to the true fans!

Exactly.
When I was a teenager (many moons ago), you stood on line in front of the venue the day the tickets went on sale and that's how you got front row.
Not this game playing of let's sell the worst tickets first, let's hold back the best for those who we can get to pay super-inflated prices, etc.
The most devoted fans are the ones who get screwed the most, IMO. Either by buying the packages, or buying insurance seats first and then attempting to get better seats as time goes by. If you put in one "floor" seat for Madison Square Garden on ticketmaster (and this has been the case since a couple of days after the seats went on sale), you get the "sold out" window. It's not sold out AT ALL. There are over 1000 tickets on the ticketbrokers sites for this concert. And front row seats are something like $1700 and only sold in pairs. It's crap!
If you want to hold back tickets for brokers or other things--keep back half and at least throw first 10 rows into the mix every day or so. It's still a crap shoot, but a bit more fair.

[kennation]

Originally Posted by Tusk!

Now, I have been keeping an eye on STUBHUB.com because I wanted to see what seats I could have got for certain with the same amount of money spent otherwise... That site has tickets front row for like $500-$1000... That is amazing! Great seats still available there for, what I consider, a reasonable price.





$500 to $1000 is a reasonable price?? It is attitudes like that for many fans that have created these inflated ticket prices for decent seats through Ticketmaster, StubHub, etc.

Too bad we can't return to the days of waiting in line for tickets and the best seats went to the true fans!

Maybe your idea of reasonable is different from mine? As a true fan, myself, I will pay anything. To be honest, I have waited my fair share of years to be able to do this. Now I can so... I don't feel bad about it. It's a shame that you had to say, "with attitudes like that..." What was that about? Seriously?

[kennation]

Originally Posted by Regina

Exactly.
When I was a teenager (many moons ago), you stood on line in front of the venue the day the tickets went on sale and that's how you got front row.
Not this game playing of let's sell the worst tickets first, let's hold back the best for those who we can get to pay super-inflated prices, etc.
The most devoted fans are the ones who get screwed the most, IMO. Either by buying the packages, or buying insurance seats first and then attempting to get better seats as time goes by. If you put in one "floor" seat for Madison Square Garden on ticketmaster (and this has been the case since a couple of days after the seats went on sale), you get the "sold out" window. It's not sold out AT ALL. There are over 1000 tickets on the ticketbrokers sites for this concert. And front row seats are something like $1700 and only sold in pairs. It's crap!
If you want to hold back tickets for brokers or other things--keep back half and at least throw first 10 rows into the mix every day or so. It's still a crap shoot, but a bit more fair.

This is true. I am a devoted fan, and I got screwed by an upcharge from an already HIGH package price just to meet Mick. We did it, because we can, but still it's not fair, but that is how the game is played. It's not the 80's anymore... times have changed. It's about money.

I must say: tickets are handled very poorly. Very poorly. That is a shame. I look at it this way: we paid over $700 to have madonna floor seats and I feel like I should have shelled out more for the Mac. These are living legends! So to our pocket, $1640 was steep, but worth it. We will see...

[carrie721]

Originally Posted by kennation

Maybe your idea of reasonable is different from mine? As a true fan, myself, I will pay anything. To be honest, I have waited my fair share of years to be able to do this. Now I can so... I don't feel bad about it. It's a shame that you had to say, "with attitudes like that..." What was that about? Seriously?

this statement alone undermines any credibility you may think you have in saying what prices are "reasonable."

what on earth makes a "true" fan anyway? are people not true fans if they aren't willing to pay any price for whatever scrap fleetwood mac & stevie throw their way?

maybe the "true" fans are the ones who know that at one point, FM and SN weren't completely artistically void and who aren't interested in digging into their checkbooks for one more jukebox tour. yes, it has always been about the money. but at least they used to have something to say.

[kennation]

Originally Posted by carrie721

this statement alone undermines any credibility you may think you have in saying what prices are "reasonable."

what on earth makes a "true" fan anyway? are people not true fans if they aren't willing to pay any price for whatever scrap fleetwood mac & stevie throw their way?

maybe the "true" fans are the ones who know that at one point, FM and SN weren't completely artistically void and aren't interested in digging into their checkbooks for one more jukebox tour. yes, it has always been about the money. but at least they used to have something to say.

I wasn't attacking or defining, "true fans." The original response basically said that becuase we spent so much money on our tickets that we were causing this type of ticket/money mess... It pretty much said that true fans wouldn't pay this price... I was maintaining that I AM A TRUE FAN... To me, IMO- Me being a true fan means I pay what I have to get the best seat and package that is available. If that is not the way you view it, that is you. All I am stating is my view, FOR ME...

And to me- this band is NOT artistically void... AT ALL. They still have things to say and will. They just wanted to go back out there and play the songs that brought them to this point. If you don't like that then...

[carrie721]

Originally Posted by kennation

I wasn't attacking or defining, "true fans." The original response basically said that becuase we spent so much money on our tickets that we were causing this type of ticket/money mess... It pretty much said that true fans wouldn't pay this price... I was maintaining that I AM A TRUE FAN... To me, IMO- Me being a true fan means I pay what I have to get the best seat and package that is available. If that is not the way you view it, that is you. All I am stating is my view, FOR ME...

in your short tenure here, you have used the phrases "true fans" and "die hard fans" several times to mean people who ...

Originally Posted by kennation

would be happy to hear from their band in any way.

those are your words.

i don't care on which side of the divide i or anybody falls in your mind. it's just an interesting definition.

it's kind of like if you don't support the war, you don't support the troops! and if you don't support the president, you're not a true patriot! right?

And to me- this band is NOT artistically void... AT ALL. They still have things to say and will. They just wanted to go back out there and play the songs that brought them to this point.

dude, they haven't performed without an army of backup musicians and singers in years. they really don't give a sh*t about giving it their all. they are there to present the fleetwood mac product and pick up their paycheck. if it were something more than that, it would be the four of them with one keyboardist playing more modest venues that they actually have a prayer of filling. instead, they are taking the fleetwood mac orchestra on another arena tour. do they really think they have a chance of filling up those 20,000-seaters?

If you don't like that then...

then i won't go see them. trust me, i won't.

[kennation]

Originally Posted by carrie721

in your short tenure here, you have used the phrases "true fans" and "die hard fans" several times to mean people who ...



those are your words.

i don't care on which side of the divide i or anybody falls in your mind. it's just an interesting definition.

it's kind of like if you don't support the war, you don't support the troops! and if you don't support the president, you're not a true patriot! right?



dude, they haven't performed without an army of backup musicians and singers in years. they really don't give a sh*t about giving it their all. they are there to present the fleetwood mac product and pick up their paycheck. if it were something more than that, it would be the four of them with one keyboardist playing more modest venues that they actually have a prayer of filling. instead, they are taking the fleetwood mac orchestra on another arena tour. do they really think they have a chance of filling up those 20,000-seaters?



then i won't go see them. trust me, i won't.

Carrie,
I wasn't the first person to say, "TRUE FANS/DEVOTED FANS..." It was a comment made to me that I rebuddled about how I feel about ME being a TRUE/DEVOTED fan... It had nothing to do with you or anyone else. I do stand by my saying, "true fans are glad to hear from their band in any way..." I stand by that. I always will sorry if that offends you, but there it is...

I have things to say about you not going... However, I want to maintain a level approach to this discussion. So I will just say, I would rather not be seated next to someone who feels the way that you do about this band. I especially would hate for a new fan to set next to you, goodnesss knows how they would feel when they left the concert. That is about all I can say about that. If you feel they are "ARTISTICALLY VOID," and you refuse to go see them it doesn't mean that you think very highly of them.

As for my short tenure here... This is not a secret society or some senority issue. I could care less if you find my statements to your liking. My length of time here does not mean that my opinion will be quitened, kept to myself, or considered lower than your's...

[sodascouts]

In 2003, I got first row for Indianapolis the week before the show. In 2004, I got 2nd row tickets for Charlotte, NC the morning of the show. A couple months ago, at an Eagles show in Cincinnati, I got 5th row two hours before the show started. It's doesn't always happen, but it happens enough to be worth your while to check.

[carrie721]

Originally Posted by kennation

Carrie,
I wasn't the first person to say, "TRUE FANS/DEVOTED FANS..." It was a comment made to me that I rebuddled about how I feel about ME being a TRUE/DEVOTED fan... It had nothing to do with you or anyone else. I do stand by my saying, "true fans are glad to hear from their band in any way..." I stand by that. I always will sorry if that offends you, but there it is...

it so does not offend me. as i said, it is an interesting definition.

I have things to say about you not going... However, I want to maintain a level approach to this discussion. So I will just say, I would rather not be seated next to someone who feels the way that you do about this band. I especially would hate for a new fan to set next to you, goodnesss knows how they would feel when they left the concert. That is about all I can say about that. If you feel they are "ARTISTICALLY VOID," and you refuse to go see them it doesn't mean that you think very highly of them.

right.

if i did go, i really don't think any new fan would care what i did, as long as i wasn't screaming drunkenly and interrupting the show.

at lindsey's toronto show a couple years back, paula (skcin) and i were literally the only people in the audience standing up and dancing, and it certainly didn't affect our perception of the show or lindsey at all. so i'm not sure what you're trying to say.

As for my short tenure here... This is not a secret society or some senority issue. I could care less if you find my statements to your liking. My length of time here does not mean that my opinion will be quitened, kept to myself, or considered lower than your's...

where did i say that your opinion should be "quitened" (whatever that means)? all i said was that although you haven't been here very long, you've already used that phrase or its equivalent quite a bit.

and trust me, my opinion doesn't hold that much clout around here ...

[kennation]

Originally Posted by carrie721

if i did go, i really don't think any new fan would care what i did, as long as i wasn't screaming drunkenly and interrupting the show.

where did i say that your opinion should be "quitened" (whatever that means)? all i said was that although you haven't been here very long, you've already used that phrase or its equivalent quite a bit.

and trust me, my opinion doesn't hold that much clout around here ...

Honestly, when I am at a concert and I hear people say around me, "they are artistically void... they are all about their money... these tickets were overpriced..." It makes me want to scream. It brings me down. When I was new to Stevie I had people who said things like that behind me and it almost ruined my experience. I just think to myself, "WHY ARE YOU HERE? Stay the frap home!" LOL

I have used those terms a lot. I have. Because that is what I thought this site was about. It seems as though since I am still NEW to this site that my opinion shouldn't matter, or I shouldn't say what I would like. That I should, "quieten" down about how I feel as a true fan and devoted fan. That's just not the case.

So once again, sorry if my opinion doesn't match that of your own.

[carrie721]

Originally Posted by kennation

Honestly, when I am at a concert and I hear people say around me, "they are artistically void... they are all about their money... these tickets were overpriced..." It makes me want to scream. It brings me down. When I was new to Stevie I had people who said things like that behind me and it almost ruined my experience. I just think to myself, "WHY ARE YOU HERE? Stay the frap home!" LOL

I have used those terms a lot. I have. Because that is what I thought this site was about. It seems as though since I am still NEW to this site that my opinion shouldn't matter, or I shouldn't say what I would like. That I should, "quieten" down about how I feel as a true fan and devoted fan. That's just not the case.

So once again, sorry if my opinion doesn't match that of your own.

reality check: when people challenge your opinion, it doesn't mean that your opinion doesn't matter. it also doesn't mean that you've offended the tender sensibilities of whoever challenged you. you don't have to apologize for having a different opinion. that's ridiculous.

[Regina]

I think, most of us "oldies" on the board have spent thousands of dollars on FM. I know I have. All my debt is FM-related (and that's not an exaggeration). And, I personally have done it--mostly, without complaint.
But, that money paid for seeing FM, Stevie and/or Lindsey probably about 20 times (I never counted). Not for one concert.

And they were giving us new material and times were not as tough.
It's very difficult to not feel slighted by FM themselves when ticket prices are high to start out with and then they do things like the packages and ticketmaster's "premium tickets" (and I have no idea if this is a ticketmaster racket or something sanctioned by FM)--and making fans who really would like to see them as close as possible shell out MORE money than those casual fans who will pass by a venue and say, "oh, Fleetwood Mac. Yeah, I liked them back in the day. Let me get a ticket" and don't give a rat's behind where they sit.

I work. I'm single and don't have kids. But I can't shell out these huge amounts of money and don't think I would if I could. If you can, that's great. HOWEVER, it irritates me that the people with the packages are being sold a mystery prize of some sort. WHY can't they tell you--right now--that you have front row center seats? Or second row? For that money, those tickets should be in their hands and they should guarantee you an exact place in that venue without you having to wait until the day of the show. Ticket brokers are selling front row tickets for these shows. Why do they know the exact location of the tickets they are selling, and FM--who is selling them for, in some cases, even MORE than the brokers, not telling you until the day of the show? It's just not right.

They did the whole FM fanclub thing where you could buy tickets, during the SYW tour. If I'm not mistaken (I just don't remember this exactly anymore), they weren't that much more than the value of the ticket. And they were also mystery tickets until a week (or maybe a few days?) before the concert. And then they emailed you your seat numbers. But, you had an option to cancel. I don't even know if this All Access thing gives you that option. And, how many people can afford to dump it at that late date, if they really have their hearts set on it?

I don't know. It really doesn't affect me because I'm not doing it, but I get annoyed at the concept. You want to believe in the integrity of the people you admire most, and this sort of chips away at all of that.

And, FWIW, Lindsey is sort of excluded in this. Is he in it for the money? Yes. But, he's sort of stated that he is. But, he gave us two wonderful, inventive, creative tours and didn't rob us blind. If anything, he robbed himself (money-wise). That counts for a lot in my book. And, the two times I've spent a few minutes with him off-stage--he was beyond nice. (And didn't reach for my pocketbook for some extra dough!)

[shebop]

I completely agree with the two posts above this!

Perhaps the label should not be "true fans" - but - "experienced fans".

Those of us who have been following this band, and its members on solo ventures for many, many, years (more than 30 for me) have seen many changes and know the difference between tours that have artistic merit
and tours that are for the almighty dollar.

Does anyone truly believe that a "Greatest Hits" tour is invigorating for the band?

[michelej1]

Originally Posted by shebop

Does anyone truly believe that a "Greatest Hits" tour is invigorating for the band?

I think it makes them feel unleashed.

Michele

[kennation]

Originally Posted by shebop

I completely agree with the two posts above this!

Perhaps the label should not be "true fans" - but - "experienced fans".

Those of us who have been following this band, and its members on solo ventures for many, many, years (more than 30 for me) have seen many changes and know the difference between tours that have artistic merit
and tours that are for the almighty dollar.

Does anyone truly believe that a "Greatest Hits" tour is invigorating for the band?

Honestly, I do... I know that sounds naive, but I do. I mean, they are working, of course it's about money, just like us... We go on the road nearly everyday to make the money, right?! I just think that they will have a better time doing this tour because they know these songs will please the crowd and don't have to worry about the new material. I know that's not the popular opinion, but that's how I look at it.