Peter's guitars and gear over the years...

ictmanager · #1 06-09-2007, 02:39 PM

I was a little surprised when I looked on here, as a long term (from the beginning!) Mac and Greeny fan, not to spot any threads about Peter's guitars....so I thought I'd start one...
I guess if you're looking here, you have a certain level of awareness..

WELL, £2,000,000 is a little bit too much to pay for a guitar, even a 59er, as is Peter's/Gary Moore's....if you DON'T know about this, check out Maverick Music in New York, through Google, and you'll see what I mean...
But did you also know that the 1952 goldtop with 2 P90s and a long tailpiece was up for sale recently, and DID NOT SELL, at £15,000, which was a steal! Mind you it had a seventies neck put on it at one time (well, in the seventies....) as the original got damaged, which is a shame really cos Peter was given the guitar by Eric Clapton who had himself been given it by Muddy Waters who in turn had been given it by BB King.....WHAT?!!!!
Further to that, I have owned for some time a recent ebony Les Paul Standard which Peter gave away....
A friend who I met has a Matamp PGT Peter Green Tribute amp which apparently there are only 3 of...and I am told it is a pearl.
Anyway, lets have some more news from some of you!
David

michelle2677 · #2 06-09-2007, 02:49 PM

i'm sorry I don't have any input, but welcome to the ledge!

doodyhead · #3 06-09-2007, 09:05 PM

There have been several threads over the years regarding differen taspects of peter and his guitars.
check the archives back and there will be pleasant surprises. Not all of the PG fans are guitarists. I am and saw a thread before i officially joined regarding Gary Moore selling the 59 to Maveick. I, for one, was aghast that Gary did it in light of his testimonials to the contrary. Time heals all greed or something like that. In a perfect world I would have loved to see Gary sell it back to Peter for 120 pounds like he got it. or better still sell it to some promising musician just like he got it. He has more than enough guitars to go around. I suppose I am being too hard on Gary. He is a big toutgh guy so when he put it out there I guess he wanted the splash. The speculation was that Mr Ziff was going to buy it to add to his collection.
here have also been recent threads on Peters pickup modificaton on that same guitar. Its worth the look. As for the goldtop, When did Eric Clapton give it to him? That is quite a story I am interested. It seems Peter has had and lost and gotten many guitars over the years. I like many just hope that he continues to play, even if just for himself.

vinnie c

ictmanager · #4 06-10-2007, 01:44 AM

There have been a lot of 'experts' tell us how to get this sound over the years...
Some have recommended rewiring.
Peter never did this... He simply removed, disassembled and reassembled the neck pickup without removing or unsoldering any wiring.... What he did do was 2 things...he put the magnet in the wrong way round, which is the main change...and he put the whole pickup in facing the other way to how it had been originally....
There was NO change to the wiring. The nasal sound only appears in the centre switch position, and changing the controls does find you that 'sweet spot' I have read SO many conflicting articles on this, but I can categorically tell you that the above works! Peter's old ebony Les Paul that I now own had been set up for him like this!!!
There is even one company in the states, CVguitars, now actually taking Les Paul faded standards, and converting them to this format!
Gibson WILL eventually do a signature guitar, I would put money on it!!

doodyhead · #5 06-10-2007, 08:02 AM

technical correction

howard Roberts Fusion. It also comes in flavors. I played a few. They are like shrunken gibson birdlands. They have a warm acoustic tone and a comfortable neck.
The Gibson signature Guitar. We can only hope. You might want to read Martin Celmins biography on the debacle in Germanywhen they arranged a Gibson sponsored tribute concert for him to showcase the Les Paul and peter did not have one and was not interested in playing one. They wanted to make one then (1995?) but he blew them off. He said he would colabarate with gibson after he died....
So Gibson instead made a Jimmy Page Les Paul with a special B B King switch that puts the humbucher out of phase....hmmmm I wonder where they got that idea? If you want the official Peter Green Guitar you would have to settle for Jimmy Page and write peters name on it.

In "Strange Brew" a recent book about the british blues boom, iit says that Hamer guitar technicians actually looked at peter's guitar which was then in the hands of Gary Moore. Gary brought it in after he broke the neck of it in a car crash. They reafirmed what you said about the way peter put the pickup back together. It does have such a wonderful sound , doesn't it.

what is the setup on the thre of a kind amplifier?

vinnie

ictmanager · #6 06-11-2007, 05:15 PM

Flemings left and right hand rules are Basic physics...not kidding...check them easily on Wikipedia....any magnetic field, with any associated movement, will create an electric current. Reverse one of the variables, and another reverses. ie in the case of Peter's guitar, reversing the pickup wiring SHOULD have the same result as flipping the magnet. Having done both a few times over the years, it's a little more subtle than that! Putting a push-pull switch in the circuit is something I did many years ago, and it does the right kind of thing, but Peter did not change the wiring at all. In fact doing so actually means that you have a risk of the 2 pickup cables shorting out...not dangerous, just a short=no sound!!! Accidentally flippping the magnet is what Peter did, and that's what really does the trick. Peters ebony Les Paul which I now own, has just that 'Need your Love so bad' tone. It was done for him to reproduce the 59er. It's the most incredible honky sound. As for the Matamp PGT, I'll see if I can get my friend to post details of it...I don't know who owns the other two of these.

Wouter Vuijk · #7 06-11-2007, 05:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ictmanager

There have been a lot of 'experts' tell us how to get this sound over the years...
Some have recommended rewiring.
Peter never did this... He simply removed, disassembled and reassembled the neck pickup without removing or unsoldering any wiring.... What he did do was 2 things...he put the magnet in the wrong way round, which is the main change...and he put the whole pickup in facing the other way to how it had been originally....
There was NO change to the wiring. The nasal sound only appears in the centre switch position, and changing the controls does find you that 'sweet spot' I have read SO many conflicting articles on this, but I can categorically tell you that the above works! Peter's old ebony Les Paul that I now own had been set up for him like this!!!
There is even one company in the states, CVguitars, now actually taking Les Paul faded standards, and converting them to this format!
Gibson WILL eventually do a signature guitar, I would put money on it!!

I'm into buying a Vintage copy of PG's LP.
Here's some info on the guitar:
http://www.omegamusic.nl/vintageelec...V100MRPGM).pdf

Also check out the Youtubes from Skydog.
For example:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F6qkF...elated&search=

doodyhead · #8 06-11-2007, 07:57 PM

I linked to the replica guitar site and heard a great tone coming from the guitar.
i looked at the next youtube listing and saw peter green with like it this way and several other things from the early years nad wished he was still playing out

I have a custon shop les paul custom of generalized 59 configuration
i am still conflicted about modifying it and i suspect it has to do with the aforementioned videos. like ghosts......

bill · #9 06-11-2007, 11:06 PM

To all those who are considering modifying their LP to get the out of phase sound I have the following information from personal experience. I have an old LP which I flipped the top magnet in many years ago - no change to the wiring. I just flipped the magnet in the top pickup.

I play it through an old 1959 Bassman, an old 1956 Princeton, and sometimes a 1978 Ampeg VT40. If you turn the top volume up slightly more than the bottom volume the "honk" appears - to get it warmer rather than very thin and cutting you need about 65/45 (volume top/bottom) or even 70/30. There is not doubt that the sound is distinctive and very lovely.

The problem is though that unless you are really driving the amps into overload the out of phase sound is very thin. Fleetwood Mac in PGs days were a very loud band and you have to really drive the volume to get the beautiful sound. I call this a problem because many of the rooms where I play and also modern audience tastes seem to want bands to play at lower volumes which means you are always compromising a bit on the "honk". These days I leave the LP behind more often than not and instead play with an ES-335. Sound is very different but still sweet and great for those jazzy blues.

So if you are contemplating the mod:

(a) unless you can play loud the modification will not deliver for you.

(b) if you take the magnet flipping option is requires some care (you can damage the tiny wires easily) and usually you need to rewax the pot. It is also a more permanent option meaning that you lose the normal sound your LP would deliver in the middle position. While the rewiring option (push-pull) is not "genuine" you can have the middle position as normal or out of phase.

best wishes
bill

doodyhead · #10 06-11-2007, 11:12 PM

I just woke up in the middle of the night, booted my computer and went to the ledge. As I saw what I had written just a few hours ago I realized what I was saying: that I was just being foolish in my fondness for Mr Green and his music. That reverence and appreciation for someone can lead to oddly religious like behavior.

doodyhead

ps: now I know how many posts it takes to become a senior ledgie

please dont mind this interjection and continue the discussion

vinnie

doodyhead · #11 06-11-2007, 11:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bill

The problem is though that unless you are really driving the amps into overload the out of phase sound is very thin. Fleetwood Mac in PGs days were a very loud band and you have to really drive the volume to get the beautiful sound. I call this a problem because many of the rooms where I play and also modern audience tastes seem to want bands to play at lower volumes which means you are always compromising a bit on the "honk". These days I leave the LP behind more often than not and instead play with an ES-335. Sound is very different but still sweet and great for those jazzy blues.

bill

As someone who also plays out occasionaly, I am also found to be playing in much lower volumes and even with modern technology you never sound the way you would at high volume. The warmth of an amplified hollowbody has some of that hornlike quality at low volumes. 54 years old and just a little ringing in the ears

zoork_1 · #12 06-12-2007, 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bill

[...]...unless you can play loud the modification will not deliver for you... [...]

You're right to some extent. However, the sample "pickup modification" on YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=apH_K6VWCPg) suggests that the modification will deliver enough...

/Zoork

Century · #13 07-02-2007, 04:57 AM

http://www.hamerfanclub.com/miller.html

Have a look at the second guitar down....

mzero · #14 07-05-2007, 05:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Century

http://www.hamerfanclub.com/miller.html

Have a look at the second guitar down....

century- that is a great peter green story. his favorite in the 90's, a miller beer hamer guitar. the mind boogles!

jol dantzig of hamer is a longstanding and huge peter green fan. there is an earlier interview with him here with his take and a long anecdote on the 'peter green' sound. involves gary moore and taking peter's guitar apart...

http://www.hamerfanclub.com/jolspeaks.html

zero

ps - welcome to the ledge century!

Wouter Vuijk · #15 08-01-2007, 06:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wouter Vuijk

I'm into buying a Vintage copy of PG's LP.
Here's some info on the guitar:
http://www.omegamusic.nl/vintageelec...V100MRPGM).pdf

Well, I just got the guitar today. and it sounds OK. Haven't tried it on high volumes yet, just a 10 watt living room amp. Hopefully rehearsing next monday where I can try out the full warmth of the guitar. The looks are great, though. Really worn out replica.