Importance of Stevie versus Lindsey

[bombaysaffires]

the difference between Stevie and Lindsey is that she desperately wanted fame and did what it took to get it and keep it-- and that included chasing trends in music rather than staying true to her muse. Lindsey "you're not like other people, you do what you want to" didn't get all worried about what everyone else was doing and trying to keep up with trends, he's always been more about making good art and 'if the right ears hear it' and all that. Not to say he wasn't on some level jealous of how successful her albums got and his didn't in the mass market, but he made his peace with it. He could get snotty about it, and mocking of her success, so you know it rankled as he thinks he's the true artist and she's not. Bottom line is that they took very different approaches and appeal to different audiences. That's why FM was better with both of them in it.

[jbrownsjr]

Originally Posted by bombaysaffires

the difference between Stevie and Lindsey is that she desperately wanted fame and did what it took to get it and keep it-- and that included chasing trends in music rather than staying true to her muse. Lindsey "you're not like other people, you do what you want to" didn't get all worried about what everyone else was doing and trying to keep up with trends, he's always been more about making good art and 'if the right ears hear it' and all that. Not to say he wasn't on some level jealous of how successful her albums got and his didn't in the mass market, but he made his peace with it. He could get snotty about it, and mocking of her success, so you know it rankled as he thinks he's the true artist and she's not. Bottom line is that they took very different approaches and appeal to different audiences. That's why FM was better with both of them in it.

He chased certain trends, too. But, I agree that he didn't care if it gave FAME or not. In fact, when he was chasing the CLASH sound he knew it would give him less FAME. So did Mick and Stevie and the board room.

Where Stevie (not really a music writer) (not really a producer) (not really a piano player) came up with melodies and poems/lyrics and gave them to musicians and producers to put in the work for her. And then she shaped it based on her ear and what Jimmy, Dave or Lindsey told her.

I think where she lost me was trying to be a legend, vs. just be yourself. She still twirls and it's so weird to me at her age to see that. The one positive I like is that we don't have to see the fake relationship she plays with Lindsey. She put her cards on the table at the 11th hour.

[FuzzyPlum]

The weird thing is Lindsey probably could have been a pretty successful solo artist if he'd really gone about it in the right way (against his better judgement). He's got a great ear for a hook and can write 'hooky' songs fairly easily. When he decided to steer Fleetwood Mac towards a 'Fleetwood Maccy' sound he came up with Sad Angel. That sort of song could have been a big hit years ago. If he'd banged that sort of thing out as a solo artist he'd have been much more commercially successful- he just didn't want to do that.

[Angel75]

Originally Posted by FuzzyPlum

The weird thing is Lindsey probably could have been a pretty successful solo artist if he'd really gone about it in the right way (against his better judgement). He's got a great ear for a hook and can write 'hooky' songs fairly easily. When he decided to steer Fleetwood Mac towards a 'Fleetwood Maccy' sound he came up with Sad Angel. That sort of song could have been a big hit years ago. If he'd banged that sort of thing out as a solo artist he'd have been much more commercially successful- he just didn't want to do that.

I totally agree....he had no desire to get that level of success personally because he had fame and commercial success already in one aspect of his career. I think initially it bothered him that Stevie had a successful solo career and he didn't have it to the same degree but I think with his last three albums he gave up caring about her and being competitive and focused solely on his own individual growth and fulfilment

[Macfan4life]

Originally Posted by Angel75

I totally agree....he had no desire to get that level of success personally because he had fame and commercial success already in one aspect of his career. I think initially it bothered him that Stevie had a successful solo career and he didn't have it to the same degree but I think with his last three albums he gave up caring about her and being competitive and focused solely on his own individual growth and fulfilment

I agree with your statements with his last 3 solo albums. I recently watched Lindsey's Behind the Music again which was filmed shortly after the Out of the Cradle tour. That album had some of the best reviews ever with some calling it possibly one of the best albums ever. There could have easily been 3 hit singles from that album. But it was sad to see him comment how he did not understand why his hit success with the Mac did not translate to his solo career. He joked at the concert for everyone not to yell out "Go your own way" right away. The album sales were very disappointing and the tour was even more disappointing. It was sad to see how sad and frustrated he was with so few recognizing his hard work and talent. I believe his lack of success of a solo artist is what made him go back to Fleetwood Mac. If he had a successful solo career, I don't think he would have went back.
In any event this is all water under the bridge now since clearly at this point in his life he is doing what pleases him only. He knows his solo albums are not commercially successful. He loves playing at small venues with hardcore fans rather than the huge arenas packed with casual or Stevie fans.

[Storms123]

Originally Posted by Macfan4life

I agree with your statements with his last 3 solo albums. I recently watched Lindsey's Behind the Music again which was filmed shortly after the Out of the Cradle tour. That album had some of the best reviews ever with some calling it possibly one of the best albums ever. There could have easily been 3 hit singles from that album. But it was sad to see him comment how he did not understand why his hit success with the Mac did not translate to his solo career. He joked at the concert for everyone not to yell out "Go your own way" right away. The album sales were very disappointing and the tour was even more disappointing. It was sad to see how sad and frustrated he was with so few recognizing his hard work and talent. I believe his lack of success of a solo artist is what made him go back to Fleetwood Mac. If he had a successful solo career, I don't think he would have went back.
In any event this is all water under the bridge now since clearly at this point in his life he is doing what pleases him only. He knows his solo albums are not commercially successful. He loves playing at small venues with hardcore fans rather than the huge arenas packed with casual or Stevie fans.

I think he's very aware of who he is and very comfortable in his own skin. Christine is very similar (from my observation)

[sleepless child]

So on Jan. 28th, Stevie had Lindsey over to her house to fire him? And Mick was in New York? We know Chris was in London, was John in the basement too? I guess I'm trying to find out, how can Stevie fire Lindsey? The band except for Chris must have been at Stevie's house. Maybe not John, but Stevie and Mick fired Lindsey then? I'm sorry to be obtuse, just looking for some clarification from an earlier post that said Mick was in New York on Jan. 28th. If Stevie was able to fire Lindsey, then she has more power in the band than anyone realized.

[elle]

Originally Posted by sleepless child

So on Jan. 28th, Stevie had Lindsey over to her house to fire him? And Mick was in New York? We know Chris was in London, was John in the basement too? I guess I'm trying to find out, how can Stevie fire Lindsey? The band except for Chris must have been at Stevie's house. Maybe not John, but Stevie and Mick fired Lindsey then? I'm sorry to be obtuse, just looking for some clarification from an earlier post that said Mick was in New York on Jan. 28th. If Stevie was able to fire Lindsey, then she has more power in the band than anyone realized.

Lol you are taking some metaphors too literally. Band’s loyalty to LB was not literally tourturrd by SN in her basement, while appeased by Mick. One of the versions I heard was that LB was fired by the phone call. So if that’s true, sounds like that phone call happened on 28th.

[jwd]

Originally Posted by sleepless child

So on Jan. 28th, Stevie had Lindsey over to her house to fire him? And Mick was in New York? We know Chris was in London, was John in the basement too? I guess I'm trying to find out, how can Stevie fire Lindsey? The band except for Chris must have been at Stevie's house. Maybe not John, but Stevie and Mick fired Lindsey then? I'm sorry to be obtuse, just looking for some clarification from an earlier post that said Mick was in New York on Jan. 28th. If Stevie was able to fire Lindsey, then she has more power in the band than anyone realized.

Stevie Nicks DOES NOT HAVE A BASEMENT!

[bombaysaffires]

Stevie has always wanted fame, and she has always been good at getting people to like her. Even Lindsey has acknowledged this, and attributes it, I think correctly, to the fact that she moved around so much as a kid and was always having to jump in somewhere new and make new friends all the time. She learned quickly how to make friends. (I have friends who moved around a lot because their parents were in the military and they are genius at being super personable and being able to walk into any group of people and make instant friends. You learn how to do that out of necessity when you move a lot). So Stevie has an instant friendliness and likability that draws people to her. That's important in attracting fans in this business.

She's also very attractive, and she became very good very quickly at realizing how to take captivating photos. She became friends with Herbie (always good at becoming friends with people who can help her) and learned a lot from him how to craft a visual image for herself with her costumes and her poses and all that. She did a zillion photo shoots with him and then countless coked up nights taking photos of herself.

Now think about Lindsey-- gorgeous, definitely, but not exactly warm and fuzzy. He isn't someone that people warm to (maybe more now but not back in the day). Maybe that's part of his childhood of growing up in the same small community all his life, who knows? He's very competitive -- likely part of growing up in with all brothers who were athletes and driven and competitive. You don't get to be an Olympic silver medalist by being a slacker. He may think he was a a slacker compared to his brother but he shows the same drive of long hours perfecting his talent as any athlete.

So a bit of a loner, driven, very critical of himself and others.... not easy to get to know. Very, very different than Stevie. And he didn't spend a lot of time thinking about his outfits and his poses and learning how to take just the right intriguing pics of himself. Instead he spent those hours perfecting his guitar playing and in the studio etc.

So it makes a lot of sense that Stevie captured the public's attention and imagination in ways that Lindsey did not. And that's a big part of success-- which irked Lindsey to no end because he grew up in the athlete model where success comes to those who practice, practice, practice and put the hours and hard work into their talent. And he did that, but in entertainment it's a lot about people liking you. It's like with presidential candidates, where people vote for the person who they most want to go drink a beer with rather than the person who's smart enough to run the country. Most people would say they'd rather go have a beer, or hang out with, Stevie than Lindsey over most of the years of FM.

She also doesn't drone on in the same way in interviews as he has done. I mean, she drones, but she tells stories and is dramatic and gives them good sound bytes. His droning is very dry and pedantic. In other words, she understood how to play the fame game better than he did much earlier in their careers. It matters more than talent often. Just look at the Kardashians.

[DownOnRodeo]

In addition to the personality traits mentioned by bombaysaffires (Stevie as quite extroverted, Lindsey as quite introverted),
I think it's very relevant to their relationship dynamic and differing personalities/careers that Stevie is an eldest child and Lindsey a youngest.

As an eldest child, Stevie feels comfortable calling the shots. She's even the one who insisted they join Fleetwood Mac. And in interviews (particularly post-Rumours), she feels comfortable leading the discourse. It just comes naturally to her. To answer her own rhetorical question from Sorcerer: "Who is the master?" She is. Even when the content of what she's saying is more deferential, like the recent remark "I'm not the boss in FM," the way she says it is very declarative and absolute. It doesn't so much matter what she says ("Station Man is a Christine song" etc.), it's the confidence she embodies when she says it that makes her so appealing and makes her a 'star' (of course in addition to great songs and great looks). Also she's not afraid of self-branding--"queen of rock" "welsh witch" "the gypsy urchin look."

Lindsey on the other hand, as a youngest child, while super articulate of course, is often smiling sheepishly to the camera as if seeking approval, his eyes downcast (compare Stevie's steely, almost hypnotizing focus on her interviewers), and whereas throughout much of his career he ultimately ended up relying on his "big brothers" and "big sisters," he comes across as neurotic about it, i.e. needing them around him but resenting it at the same time. And unless I'm mistaken, he never allowed himself to be incarnated as a metaphor--like Stevie as the queen of rock or the white-winged dove or whatever other thousand names she's been labelled as, or like Springsteen being 'the Boss', Billy Joel 'the Piano Man', and Elton John 'Rocket Man.' It's like that line in Batman Begins:

People need dramatic examples to shake them out of apathy and I can't do that as Bruce Wayne [Read: Lindsey Buckingham]. As a man, I'm flesh and blood, I can be ignored, I can be destroyed; but as a symbol... as a symbol I can be incorruptible, I can be everlasting.

I agree with everything in bombaysaffires post, but just wanted to add the 'eldest/youngest child' aspect.

[g. fish]

I won't miss the fake romance on stage between Lindsey and Stevie. It was kind of creepy knowing that Lindsey was happily married with three kids at home. I often wondered what Kristen thought of their fake charade. From my perspective, it distracted from the credibility of their music and performance.

[jwd]

Originally Posted by g. fish

I won't miss the fake romance on stage between Lindsey and Stevie. It was kind of creepy knowing that Lindsey was happily married with three kids at home. I often wondered what Kristen thought of their fake charade. From my perspective, it distracted from the credibility of their music and performance.

I think Stevie thrived on it more than anyone. She lives in the past. Once Lindsey started paying more attention to Christine, ala BuckVie and the way he reacted more with Chris on stage, it shattered the fake world she was living in. Then only way for her to crawl back in to her pretentious space was to get rid of Lindsey.

[mitzo]

Originally Posted by g. fish

I won't miss the fake romance on stage between Lindsey and Stevie. It was kind of creepy knowing that Lindsey was happily married with three kids at home. I often wondered what Kristen thought of their fake charade. From my perspective, it distracted from the credibility of their music and performance.

Kristin cashed in on it. Now the gravy train has stopped for her.

[jwd]

Originally Posted by mitzo

Kristin cashed in on it. Now the gravy train has stopped for her.

They'll be just fine. It's called royalties. You ever heard of an album called Rumours and other numerous best selling FM albums which Lindsey was a MAJOR part of? Gravy train isn't stopping anytime soon for the Buckinghams. Sorry to burst your bubble.