peter green and michael bloomfield

[bjornense]

I believe Bloomfield's playing peaked between 1965–1970, just as Green's. In his most inspired moments he was up there with the best. Listen to his solo on I Got A Mind To Give Up Living from Butterfields second LP. I think it's in the same league as Green's solos on that song if you are talking feel and emotion (I don't care if it´s kosher or not;-) And who can deny the importance of "East-West", he practically invented improvised Eastern influenced psychedelic guitar on that song.

His playing on Super Session is unbeliavable tight and "story-telling", no noodling in sight. He considered the album a scam, not musically as I understand, but he resented the "Super" marketing. Sure he was uneven, but so was Hendrix, both could be sloppy and brilliant the same night.

He's also on top in "Mary-Ann" and "Green Onions" from Live Adventures of MB and Al Kooper and in "Carmelita Shuffle" from Live at Bill Grahams Fillmore West.

[Mrpeabody]

Originally Posted by bjornense

I believe Bloomfield's playing peaked between 1965–1970, just as Green's. In his most inspired moments he was up there with the best. Listen to his solo on I Got A Mind To Give Up Living from Butterfields second LP. I think it's in the same league as Green's solos on that song if you are talking feel and emotion (I don't care if it´s kosher or not;-) And who can deny the importance of "East-West", he practically invented improvised Eastern influenced psychedelic guitar on that song.

His playing on Super Session is unbeliavable tight and "story-telling", no noodling in sight. He considered the album a scam, not musically as I understand, but he resented the "Super" marketing. Sure he was uneven, but so was Hendrix, both could be sloppy and brilliant the same night.

He's also on top in "Mary-Ann" and "Green Onions" from Live Adventures of MB and Al Kooper and in "Carmelita Shuffle" from Live at Bill Grahams Fillmore West.

All very solid performances, and taken with his contributions to Dylan's sound, his impact on other American guitarists of the era is unmistakable -- moreso than Green's at that time. These days, it's a different story.

[slipkid]

Originally Posted by greenmanastrat

I think thats it for me with svr the lack of song writing skills has always probably unjustly made me not judge him to kindly...he did however play the blues authewntic style like, when it was completely un fashionable with complete and utter conviction...have to give him total dues for that. So i´m glad he moves people, his heart was without doubt on his sleeve and in the right place as far as im concerned.

Recently saw a few clips of the kid john mayer, hate is voice but the kid plays good. Saw a clip with him and clappo was well impressed, singing sucked i may add again though by mayer.

Hmm, the reason I never liked Phish (or countless other modern jam bands) that much is that they can't write songs (compared to Allmans and Dead). I never thought that SRV was deficient in the songwriting dept. I think 'Lenny' is one of the best guitar instrumentals ever written (and one of the prettiest). I have SRV's "Live at El Mocambo" DVD and it's just jaw-dropping good. He brought Texas blues to the forefront of the genre where so many only dabbled with it (Billy Gibbons, BTW a Peter Green fan so I've read).


As for Mayer, it seems he's mastered that Hendrix/SRV "Little Wing" style of playing and that's it. His influences were far more multi-faceted. I think he's had it removed but he used to have a huge SRV tattoo on one of his upper arms. As if we couldn't tell.

[Mrpeabody]

Originally Posted by snoot

When you bite the hands of the hapless goyim, what do you expect? (Next best thing to a dog I suppose)

On behalf of Jewish guitar players everywhere, I apologize that he offended you so.

You mean by ducking trading chops with them at nearly every opportunity that presented itself? Is that the mark of a grade A performer, let alone axe slinger? He couldn't even hang with Kooper during the so called Super Session, so Stills had to be called in to finish the project. The story of his life in so many ways.

Yeah, damn him for staying up 3 days straight and collapsing before finishing an album. Chronic insomnia is SO unprofessional

When you kneel at their feet like he did, you can come off as something of a junior. That's cool if he wanted to mimic the Stax swing of things when the crowds had largely taken to different pastures, but to curse others for not "getting it" hahaha. Is that my misperception? Oh yeah, must be that damn goy thinking getting in the way again! [*slaps forehead for not knowing better*]

What does learning from Chicago blues players have to do with mimicing Stax? Or with cursing his audiences? You make no sense, unless you were the Flag's agent.

Try this. He couldn't retain the reins of his Flag when a young cat named Miles was overtaking them. Not that it didn't needle him a plenty.

Yeah, nothing to do with the fact that half the band was on heroin and the other half on acid. The Flag kicked HIM out and kept going, remember?

Respectful to those he felt were kosher enough, ergo, those who were mostly walking on his side of the musical tracks.

Who exactly was he disrespectful to? You? Name three, and where he said it. Instead, listen to that song I named and tell me who he leaves out.

... if he isn't a case of the under-realized considering the original potential, I don't know who is. When others, for whom he took jabs at, were stepping up to the plate, he made a career of largely ducking things, wasting time in low budget Hollywood tub thump productions, decrying why his Flagship and that "American music" panacea he was pushing wasn't sweeping the masses, and laying low enough to effectively dodge the radar, that one called reality. The times largely passed him by imo, even if the hype machine never let go.

Under-realized talent? Missed opportunities? Lack of ambition? Poorly conceived projects? Absolutely. He alone blew up his career, and he knew it. One could also say that about Greenie during many parts of his life. Was Greenie more consistent with his output? Yes. Was he more talented? Who cares? When both were "on", there were few better. Sadly in their prime, both fell victim to various substances and situations of the time. Bloomers was much more easily led astray than Green, which is what ultimately killed him. And since this is a Peter Green forum, that's all I've got to say about Bloomfield here. PM me if you want.

[doodyhead]

when I started to learn the guitar, my first influence to learn to play was lightning hopkins. i then confronted bb king. who even was close. eric clapton was an instruction manual. alvin lee ;s motto was repitition. bloomie was like silk he learned from so many. he had more styles of blues than any of these guys. he learned where to shut up. hendrix was inapprachable. Taylor was Eric's cloneat first. Albert King was a wondement. Then I heard Peter and Otis Rush at the same time. Then Freddy K brought me back to Earth. He had fire.


Peter has much for posterity

[sharksfan2000]

Originally Posted by doodyhead

bloomie was like silk he learned from so many. he had more styles of blues than any of these guys.

Someplace I have a disc that's got Bloomfield playing different blues styles - impressive breadth of knowledge and ability.

Originally Posted by doodyhead

Then Freddy K brought me back to Earth. He had fire.

I love Freddy King (or is it Freddie?) I've seen it spelled both ways, more often as Freddie, actually. Great fusion of Texas and Chicago styles and a huge influence on so many.

Albert Collins is another favorite of mine - any comments on his playing, doodyhead? I may be wrong, but it doesn't seem like he's been as much as influence on other players as most of the other guitarists who have been mentioned, not sure why.

[doodyhead]

his tele just singes the air

there are many great players with distintive styles
I like robert cray too


tough to imitate

[snoot]

Originally Posted by Mrpeabody

On behalf of Jewish guitar players everywhere, I apologize that he offended you so.

Now don't go getting your Jewish dandruff up. You don't owe me an apology, and neither does Bloomfield. You are what you are, I am what I am, and Bloomfield is what he was. In heaven - or hell perhaps - the 'twain may someday meet. In the meantime, we're left on Terra Mater to slug it out.

Yeah, damn him for staying up 3 days straight and collapsing before finishing an album. Chronic insomnia is SO unprofessional.

His form of treatment to address it didn't come from a licensed M.D., that's for sure. It came from a strap and junkie mainline. Not the wisest approach or solution for the rich and would-be famous. It was that chronic condition that often depleted him, and made itself manifest at the worst times. I still can't figure out how he couldn't figure it out. There were/are ways to treat such things, especially when so much is riding on the line. Others have burrowed for air and light from far deeper in the hole.

What does learning from Chicago blues players have to do with mimicing Stax? Or with cursing his audiences? You make no sense, unless you were the Flag's agent.

You obviously don't know much of the story, and I know you weren't his agent or you'd know I make more sense than you're attempting to insinuate. If you can't see and appreciate the Stax influence in a lot of what he was trying to push and expand on, I don't know what to say. As for his angst with much of his anglo audience, aye yea yea. I'll leave it at that.

Yeah, nothing to do with the fact that half the band was on heroin and the other half on acid. The Flag kicked HIM out and kept going, remember?

That was part of it for sure. But the other half of the story is that he had become marginalized within the unit, due to him not offering the kind of leadership, drive and even direction the guys were counting on. Who else had the name and musical pedigree to match? Young Miles was just an up-and-comer. Why did he keep ducking the big guns on stage? So what does that say in the end? Doesn't surprise me they began to question his leadership and standing as time went on, whether they were ****ed up to boot or not.

Under-realized talent? Missed opportunities? Lack of ambition? Poorly conceived projects? Absolutely. He alone blew up his career, and he knew it. One could also say that about Greenie during many parts of his life. Was Greenie more consistent with his output? Yes. Was he more talented? Who cares? When both were "on", there were few better. Sadly in their prime, both fell victim to various substances and situations of the time. Bloomers was much more easily led astray than Green, which is what ultimately killed him. And since this is a Peter Green forum, that's all I've got to say about Bloomfield here. PM me if you want.

Here's the thing. There are a ton of great riffers and pickers and reed men out there, but only a few are ever going to get a crack at the big time. Some that get the shot deserve it, and some don't quite frankly. Not many have a say in the matter so what counts is if you do get a break, for whatever reason or by whatever means, you had damn better make the most of it. Your livelihood - and legacy as an artist - are going to depend on it. When I attend local festivals or smaller club venues, I'm not going to such places to judge the players in any intense manner. I'm there to temporarily soak up their world and enjoy myself. Many may be but one big break away from fame and wealth, but few will ever see it. So why should I cast harsh or dissenting glances upon the hopeful and under-acknowledged, regardless of the level of their prowess. As I'm sure you know, a lot of the cats out there are pretty damn talented in their own right, and are every bit as hungry and played out in the name of dues as those rolling in dough, or fortunate enough to find themselves under recording contracts. That includes a lot of gifted session men.

Which brings me to the point, to Bloomfield and beyond. When you get your chance you take it, and run it out for all its worth. If you can't measure up to the mark, well so be it. But once you get your place in the limelight, you're fair game for any praise and criticism that follows. You owe your audience, as well as your legacy, nothing but full measure once you make it to that rarified air. Anything less and you basically amount to a slacker, a wannabe, or second rate material running on more hype than mettle. And that's just the way it is! In Bloomfield's case, he had it all - the name, the connections, the promotion money, pretty much the full enchilada. And what did he do with it? He largely whittled it away, boxed himself in a corner, and damn near threw away the key. If he was the guy on the corner singing his lungs out for little more than pocket change, few other than those closest to him, to his limited following, would shed tears. Sad but true.

But when you get a shot at center stage, when so many other deserving candidates never shall, and then basically piss it away, I feel little sympathy for the almost-ran's and crash-n-burn types. I'm judging his career and legacy at the top grade level, not his ability to cut a few chops. That's mid or lower level at best. Now some care, and some don't -- and that's cool. I just happen to be one of those types that does, whether I come off as a prick or not.