Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows Pt. 1

[daniellaaarisen]

Hey Harry Potter nerds, I have a theory for you. I think it's pretty obvious that these references exist in the novels, but I'm just starting to realize how widespread these supremacist criticisms are in the novel.

Harry Potter (specifically the 6th and 7th books) reflects the problems of national socialism and, more specifically, Nazi rule. Think about it-- the emphasis on pureblood wizarding families is just the beginning. Dolores Umbridge, by no means a Death Eater, was notorious for her prejudices towards "half breeds" such as Hagrid (part giant) and the centaurs. In the 7th book, Harry discovered that Dumbledore was very close friends with an aspiring dark wizard when he was younger. That wizard, who was coincidentally a German named Grindelwald, justified his terrorization of half-blood and "mudblood" individuals by the slogan "For the Greater Good." He had created a prison during his life that held all of his enemies and those he wished to isolate-- this prison was called Nurmengard. Sounds an awful lot like "Nuremberg", as in the Nuremberg trials that decided the fates of the caught Nazi leaders.

So eventually, Grindelwald is killed by Dumbledore, who is considered the most avid Muggle rights activist in the wizarding community. Then Voldemort comes along and essentially continues Grindelwald's process of eradicating half-blood and Muggle-born witches and wizards. The wizarding community didn't do a whole lot to top him despite his 30+ year "reign of terror," simply because they were petrified of his power and significance; they wouldn't even speak his name, let alone band together to support their family and friends who would be targeted by Voldemort and the Death Eaters. Many people, even those who far from supported Voldemort, began to believe that pure blood was better blood.

In the 7th book, Voldemort took over the Ministry of Magic and changed the Ministry's slogan to "Magic is Might." The new regime took all half-blood and Muggle-born witches and wizards and gave them a completely unfair trial that always ended in getting their wands destroyed. The chairs at these hearings for those Muggle-borns were made of bones, like the stacks of bones found at concentration camps. Holocaust: Wizarding Style. And Dumbledore beat Grindelwald in 1945, the same year that Hitler was defeated.

Crazy.

[louielouie2000]

Originally Posted by daniellaaarisen

Harry Potter (specifically the 6th and 7th books) reflects the problems of national socialism and, more specifically, Fascist and Nazi rule.

I'm no Potter scholar, but you do understand Socialism and Fascism are on the complete opposite ends of the political spectrum, right? Of course, extremism of either political ideal equals loss of individual liberty.

I definitely see shades of Fascism in the movies, with Voldemort being the strong central leader who smites any opposition to his ideals. He also strongly believes in the ethnic purification of magic. There are definitely parallels to be made between Voldemort and Hitler, in that manner. I don't know Voldemort's lineage, but if he were to have some muggle blood in his past, that would be the key giveaway that he is supposed to be representative of Hitler (as Hitler very likely had a Jewish Grandfather, yet he exterminated 6 million Jews).

If anyone were to be labeled a Socialist in the movies, I'd have to go with Dumbledore... he seems to believe in making an equal playing field for all who possess magical talents, regardless of their lineage or economic status. He definitely eschews the Feudalistic ideals held by people like the Malfoys, and believes everyone has a right the the same education in magic under the same roof, and in turn, does not believe in class stratification either.

Taking those things into account, the movies seem to warn against Fascism while uplifting Socialism. That's an incredibly simplistic way of painting the movies, but that's the way I'd sum them up regardless.

[GypsySorcerer]

Originally Posted by louielouie2000

I definitely see shades of Fascism in the movies, with Voldemort being the strong central leader who smites any opposition to his ideals. He also strongly believes in the ethnic purification of magic. There are definitely parallels to be made between Voldemort and Hitler, in that manner. I don't know Voldemort's lineage, but if he were to have some muggle blood in his past, that would be the key giveaway that he is supposed to be representative of Hitler (as Hitler very likely had a Jewish Grandfather, yet he exterminated 6 million Jews).

Voldemort is a "half-blood," from his muggle father....so yes, quite parallel to Hitler in that respect.

[Silver Springs]

It actually really surprised me how much I enjoyed this film. Harry didn't even annoy me and he's my least favourite character (aside from Umbridge and her f******* Barbie Pink aura). Despite some of the complaints regarding the slow pace of the plot, I feel it helped instill a sense of tension and anticipation in the audience, almost to put them in the mindset of the trio themselves. And I must admit, although I very much loathe to admit it, I was one of the few who cried when Dobby died. That's right. I hold my hands up to it. But he had a Hero's death, just like Hedwig in a way, so that was somewhat comforting. I gave up long ago on the notion of the films being true to the books, because I've begun to believe that only in rare cases this is possible, and so I didn't have my Nerdish "but that's not right! So and so did that when he did whatchamacallit" head on, and thus I was more able to enjoy the film for what it was aside from its obviously superior roots.

[LikeAWillow]

Originally Posted by louielouie2000

I'm no Potter scholar, but you do understand Socialism and Fascism are on the complete opposite ends of the political spectrum, right? Of course, extremism of either political ideal equals loss of individual liberty.

I definitely see shades of Fascism in the movies, with Voldemort being the strong central leader who smites any opposition to his ideals. He also strongly believes in the ethnic purification of magic. There are definitely parallels to be made between Voldemort and Hitler, in that manner. I don't know Voldemort's lineage, but if he were to have some muggle blood in his past, that would be the key giveaway that he is supposed to be representative of Hitler (as Hitler very likely had a Jewish Grandfather, yet he exterminated 6 million Jews).

If anyone were to be labeled a Socialist in the movies, I'd have to go with Dumbledore... he seems to believe in making an equal playing field for all who possess magical talents, regardless of their lineage or economic status. He definitely eschews the Feudalistic ideals held by people like the Malfoys, and believes everyone has a right the the same education in magic under the same roof, and in turn, does not believe in class stratification either.

Taking those things into account, the movies seem to warn against Fascism while uplifting Socialism. That's an incredibly simplistic way of painting the movies, but that's the way I'd sum them up regardless.

Jesus Christ, Louie, this was exactly the response I was crafting in my head when I read Dani's post.

[daniellaaarisen]

Originally Posted by louielouie2000

I'm no Potter scholar, but you do understand Socialism and Fascism are on the complete opposite ends of the political spectrum, right? Of course, extremism of either political ideal equals loss of individual liberty.

I definitely see shades of Fascism in the movies, with Voldemort being the strong central leader who smites any opposition to his ideals. He also strongly believes in the ethnic purification of magic. There are definitely parallels to be made between Voldemort and Hitler, in that manner. I don't know Voldemort's lineage, but if he were to have some muggle blood in his past, that would be the key giveaway that he is supposed to be representative of Hitler (as Hitler very likely had a Jewish Grandfather, yet he exterminated 6 million Jews).

If anyone were to be labeled a Socialist in the movies, I'd have to go with Dumbledore... he seems to believe in making an equal playing field for all who possess magical talents, regardless of their lineage or economic status. He definitely eschews the Feudalistic ideals held by people like the Malfoys, and believes everyone has a right the the same education in magic under the same roof, and in turn, does not believe in class stratification either.

Taking those things into account, the movies seem to warn against Fascism while uplifting Socialism. That's an incredibly simplistic way of painting the movies, but that's the way I'd sum them up regardless.

Yeah, I know they're completely different. I kinda phrased that first sentence in a weird way, but you still understood what I meant-- how both are in there. Completely agree with you.

[Erin]

If you remember the first book, on Dumbledore's wizard card it stated he defeated Grundelwald in 1945. Before the last book was published someone asked Rowling if the date was significant and she said yes. So she was obviously going with the Nazi parallels from the beginning. I thought it was interesting that it insinuates that Grundlewald was somehow effecting what was going on in WWII.

[daniellaaarisen]

[mylittledemon]

Hot!

Now all you need is this...

[daniellaaarisen]

My hair was higher, you just can't see it in this picture because the background is so dark

and I know! I chiseled my own wand (literally.... from a log.... and sandpapered/painted it) but I wanna have the Bellatrix wand by the July premiere.

[tilthefirefades]

Did Dobby really have to die?? I hadn't seen a HP movie since Azkaban, but this onewas really good even though I had absolutely no idea what was going on.

[Dodfather]

Originally Posted by daniellaaarisen

Dani - you look HOT! Hell yeah...

Ok, so now I'm dragging my thoughts back to the film.... it was incredible. By far the best film of the series and, being a huge fan of the books, it was incredibly faithful and yet very much its own entity as a "film", so not slavishly shackled to the novel.

Nothing was really cut, just some scenes were condensed (the bequests from Dumbledore, the first few minutes in the Muggle world) and that got things going very well. I had been wondering for ages about where they were going to split the film and, of course, I was wrong with my guess! They went much further into the book than I thought but actually split it at the perfect place.

It made perfect sense to cut where they did, since now the next film can have only two main settings as opposed to the various in this one and of course the return of so many characters that just wouldn't have fit in this film.

Visually, the closest I can compare it to is the split in Back to the Future II and III - which were filmed back to back but if were released as one long film the differences in setting etc may have been very jarring to see (this does not count for the plot of course).

One tiny thing could have been better (isn't there always, haha) and that was just that Hermione could have gone far more nuts when Ron returns! That part is excellently written in the books and although Emma Watson is great at it, it's severely toned down from what's on the page! Also, Emma Watson continues to be the best actor of the 3 leads, she is just great and, has to be said....looks awesome.

I can't wait to see the final duel between Bellatrix and Molly in the the next film, that should be great!

Overall - 5/5 - by far the best film out of what has been a patchy series so far.

[bucklind17]

OMG this.

I Am Harry Potter from Daniel Radcliffe

[Erin]

^^
Very funny. I hope he has a chance to have a career, and doesn't turn into Mark Hamill part 2.

[bucklind17]

Originally Posted by Erin

^^
Very funny. I hope he has a chance to have a career, and doesn't turn into Mark Hamill part 2.

I think he will. He's turned into quite the strong actor. I saw the first preview of Equus in London and then saw it again when it came to Broadway and he improved so much even there, and I thought he was really quite good for his stage debut even that early in the West End run. It's going to be interesting to see how he does with a musical this season, but he's clearly game for anything and definitely has a versatility that I think some people are surprised by. Even now, his performance in Equus is one of my favorite things I've seen on a stage, SO different from Harry but so well done and thrilling to watch.