Album Discussion: Lindsey songs on Mirage

wondergirl9847 · #1 10-09-2002, 03:31 PM

Well, this should be interesting! LOL

Can't Go Back: I love this cute little ditty. "melodies awaken sorrows from their sleep..." is an awesome lyric and I love "face as soft as a tear in a clown's eye..." I love the melody and the da-da-da-da-da sound.

Book of Love: I like this one too. Lindsey's songs/lyrics on Mirage are very 50's influences, and I like that. "...Surely He must know all the rules, knowledge not meant for mortal fools..", I LOVE that lyric, my favorite in the song!! I also love when he "laughs" "was it somebody from above...ha-ha-ha-ha..surely..." Cool song!!

Empire State: Dang, everyone HATES this song with a passion, it's not THAT bad.

I mean, it's not ISA or GYOW, but it's listenable. I love that plink-plink sound he does on the guitar in this song.

Oh Diane: Now, you talk about 50's influenced!! I love this one too, even his vocals are very 50's-ish. "Woah-oh, Diane..." I love the way he sings this one! I just have one question...Who the hell is Diane???

LMAO!!

Eyes of the World: We all know this is "Stephanie" sped up...and if you love "Stephanie", shouldn't you love EOTW too? I do, and I love on the Mirage video when he and Christine do that thing at the beginning and he does that little scream...so cool! LOL I think it's such an awesome melody.

BlueGrass · #2 10-09-2002, 06:11 PM

Can't Go Back :
Second fav of Lindsey's songs for this album. I love his vocals, they go right with the beat which sounds like it should be played in FAO Swartz. "Standin' in the shadow/Of the man I use to be/Wanna go back/Can't go back."

Book of Love :
Like this song as well, prolly my third favorite. I like how these songs are so rock and roll.

Empire State :
Another flat out average Lindsey song. I like the sound of his voice here.

Oh Diane :
Simple 50s influenced track. I like playing this for my mom, since her name is - Diane, lol.

Eyes of the World :
Fav Linds song on the album. I like the acoustic guitar and the chorus.

OVERALL:
All the songs on here are just good/average. Still good music which I enjoy.

DownOnRodeo · #3 10-10-2002, 07:19 AM

Can't Go Back

Meh!

Book of Love

I just don't really know why but this is one of my favourite all time songs - definitely in my Mac top ten. It's just Lindsey singing as this total love-lost wretch (me! lol), and its just classic!! Took me time to recognize what he was tring to do with it though, from that simplistic guitar intro onwards. Now I'm in love. "Walked out/Goodbye! .... She wants me to be her friend...." The chorus is bliss.

Empire State

Like CGB I can do with or without this, but I dig the outro heaps, and as Christy says the plik-plok sound is neat!

Oh Diane

OK this rather weird observation is proabbly worth another thread but I always thought when I hear this song that he is saying 'Talking bout dying'. and 'life is liek a grain of sand, slowly slippin through your hand.'
I think I came up with this crazy idea cause the song is so bizarrely 'sap' ... it would be more like Lindsey to give it an equivocal edge...would it..??????

Plus is it just me or does he speed up the track in the 'slowly slippin' part?? He's a joker.

Eyes of the World

One of my top 5 Mac ditties. I love it so. Especially the outro. But although there is some bits of Stephanie in the acoustic guitar part - I just don't see it as 'Stephanie on speed' ala Big Love -> Doing What I Can. I'm sure Stephanie played a part in EOTW's evolution, but a small part if you ask me, especially in light of what Les said about the left-field Bwana connection.

Les · #4 10-10-2002, 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DownOnRodeo
I'm sure Stephanie played a part in EOTW's evolution, but a small part if you ask me, especially in light of what Les said about the left-field Bwana connection.

I think I'm going to have to play them back to back to try to figure out that link. Those aren't two songs I would have thought had much of anything in common when I just think about them.

Eyes of the World is amongst my top favorites of Lindsey's FM work. It's a very good live song too.

Empire State - Really, I tended to skip it when I first got Mirage. After some time I began to listen to it again and then realized I didn't really dislike it. The vocals are sort of a different sound for him than his usual, which is maybe why I found it off-putting at one point. But I find it kind of refreshing and different now. Definitely have to appreciate the plink-plinks!

Can't Go Back - Musically, nothing extra special to me, but some really lovely lyrical gems, as Christy pointed out.

Book of Love - Very nice solo in there that I forget about because I don't really think of it as a guitar song. I think the vocals pack a unexpected emotional whallop. I like the really torn up bitter-sweetness of it all.

Oh Diane - When I listen to it now, I can only laugh because of Lindsey saying how much he hates it!

jeffles · #5 10-10-2002, 01:24 PM

Eyes of the World, I like this song, but i like his live version from OOTC Tour better.

Empire State-I liked it from first listen, but everytime i listen to it, i tend to like it even better.

Can't go back-eh, nothing special. its ok.

oh diane- This is a simple, but good song. Good melodies, vocals, but the lyrics aren't anything great. I think this was a top 10 hit in England.

Book of Love- Among the top 5 favorite songs of his from any album. its not that the song is a masterpiece, it just resonates with me. I love the guitar solo at the end.

Overall, these songs don't stand up to most of the songs on Tusk, nor do they sound fresh. But i still like 'em.

DownOnRodeo · #6 10-11-2002, 01:52 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Les

Oh Diane - When I listen to it now, I can only laugh because of Lindsey saying how much he hates it!

lol So he said that in an interview? I knew it was just a bit too sappy and hacked. In fact I still maintain my equivocation theory - he just didn't consciously know he was doing it lol!

Yes, join the Book of Love fan club!! I forgot to mention another reason I'm such a big fan - when you really raise the volume on the fade-out, you hear this special vocal arrangement along the lines of
C#minor triad, Amajor, Bmajor. with a treble line of G#, A, F#.
It just sound so good, I always wonder why it didnt make it mor into the actual song.

As for Stephanie, same as you les I never saw the connection nor believe it's warrented. When it kept coming up I listends to them and fair enough, there are a couple of notes which are extracted from Stephanie into EOTW, but the rhythm is different to begin with - it's not a substantive correlation; unless Lindsey ever said anything on the subject (?) then I'd say different

lol

seteca · #7 10-11-2002, 06:59 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DownOnRodeo
As for Stephanie, same as you les I never saw the connection nor believe it's warrented. When it kept coming up I listends to them and fair enough, there are a couple of notes which are extracted from Stephanie into EOTW, but the rhythm is different to begin with - it's not a substantive correlation; unless Lindsey ever said anything on the subject (?) then I'd say different lol

It's not just "a couple of notes" Joe, the main riff of Eyes Of The World (0:28 to 0:34 on the Mirage Video mp3..[sorry I don't have my Mirage CD on hand to give you timings for the original]) is practically identical to the intro./famous riff of Stephanie (0:00 to 0:07).......check it out...

Christy...did you know that "the thing Lindsey and Christine do at the beginning" is based on Johann Pachelbel's "Canon"...?

...Sweet little piece.

Gotta go, will write my opinions of the songs later tonight.

DownOnRodeo · #8 10-11-2002, 07:16 AM

Seteca you got me good! I was thrown by the complete bass difference. But after some concerted listeneing (I even warped the key of my EOTW mp3 so it was the same key as Stephanie) and playing on my synth, I recognize that that whole segment has been lifted. Thanks!

Sorceress · #9 10-11-2002, 09:16 AM

I gushed all over the place in my comments on the Tusk album discussion thread, so now let me take the opportunity to wipe the drool off my chin and compose myself as I talk about Mirage!
While I think Lindsey's Mirage songs are the weakest of his contributions to any Mac album, I don't feel completely negatively.

I have a really hard time with the retro-poppy ones like Book of Love and Oh Diane. And Empire State--well, that's not even accessible to me in that sugary retro way the other two could be. Someone commented earlier on its different vocal style, which does make it interesting. Maybe I'll have to give it another few listens.

As for Can't Go Back, it is very catchy. It's been in my head since I pulled out Mirage to relisten to Lindsey's stuff for this thread. I really like the lyrics too, especially "Melodies awaken sorrows from their sleep." Sweetly regretful, in the vein of his nicer sentiments on Tusk, and beautifully worded. I don't like "face as soft as a tear in a clown's eye," however. I have that spooky clown association, which kind of confuses me about the point he's trying to make. You know, clowns kind of scare me. I don't like the blank expressions on their face--you can't tell what's going beneath the make-up. Hmm, maybe that line is much more complex than I thought... Is it as deep as I'm thinking it could be?

And last but not least, Eyes of the World . I love the connection to Stephanie, and I love Lindsey and Christine's Pachelbel thing. Sure, it's cutesy, but in a good way--and then we move on to the angry sentiment behind the song. I don't think the Stephanie connection combined with the anger is a coincidence. I do wonder what being "full of face" means, though. Any ideas?

Overall, I guess I think Lindsey's Mirage stuff is a mixed bag. But, his brilliant work on Gypsy more than makes up for it for the low points.

chiliD · #10 10-11-2002, 11:50 AM

Book Of Love: Lindsey crosses the line of plagiarism on this one. Compare this to the lyrics of The Monotones 1960 song of the same title. "Why didn't Lindsey get sued, then?" you ask? Well, why sue somebody if the payoff isn't going to be that big? If this song was released as a single, got massive airplay, the album & single sold extremely well (Line the whole "My Sweet Lord"/"He's So Fine" debacle with George Harrison), THEN Lindsey probably would've gotten sued...as a obscure album track, there's no need. That said, it makes me mad that the guitar solo is just starting to really cook at the end as it fades...might've been a good live cut to stretch out to hear how Lindsey would expand on the solo at the end.

Can't Go Back: My favorite part of this song is Mick's drumming. The main riffs on a Nashville tuned guitar is a nice catchy touch...still, though, just a so-so tune.

Empire State: Yeah, I don't know why this track gets so trashed...it's a good song (compared to the rest of the songs on this album). Again, Lindsey let's us down by not expanding on the guitar solo. The "Brian Wilson" bass/organ sound is a great touch.

Eyes Of The World: After this, Lindsey uses the same "Stephanie" riff on "Bang The Drum" on his GO INSANE album, too. I originally thought this was a so-so song until I saw FMac do it live...changing how I listened to the studio track.

And, the song that SHOULD'VE made the album but didn't...

Goodbye Angel: Just proved way too late that Lindsey DID have good material, but for some reason unbeknownst to us, didn't use it for the album.

wondergirl9847 · #11 10-11-2002, 03:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by seteca
Christy...did you know that "the thing Lindsey and Christine do at the beginning" is based on Johann Pachelbel's "Canon". Sweet little piece.

OMG, no, I am not good at catching stuff, I had to read the Ledge just to catch the Stephanie/EOTW comparison! LOL I love Canon, that is really coolness!

sodascouts · #12 10-11-2002, 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Les

Oh Diane - When I listen to it now, I can only laugh because of Lindsey saying how much he hates it!

Aw, he said that? I like that song! It's fun. Why doesn't he apologize for Empire State instead?

But I don't like it when performers diss their own songs anyway. Like Stevie and Street Angel - yeah, it wasn't her best, but she acts like it was totally wretched and that's not true either.

Don't make one of your "children" feel bad, Lindsey! lol

Amy Y · #13 10-11-2002, 11:39 PM

The first time I ever heard Mirage was December 31, 1999 and I found it to be a very modern sound.

Can't Go Back: It's catchy, definately not bad, but not absolute greatness either. It's good for slapping tables to while singing the lyrics.

Book of Love: I love the background vocals in this song. That's about it.

Empire State:

Quote:

Originally posted by sodascouts

Why doesn't he apologize for Empire State instead?

Maybe because it's the best song on this album.

Well, that's how I feel. Perhaps the lyrics have some CHEESE to them, but I can't find anything else undesirable about the song, especially the bass. Empire State is my favorite FM song.

Oh Diane: This song is the reason why I wanted Mirage in the first place. I had only heard a tidbit of it, and I liked it immediately. It was the guitar and the gentleness of the vocals that did it for me.

Eyes of the World: I don't like this song at all, but I love it live. Go figure.

chiliD · #14 10-12-2002, 02:14 PM

Quote:

Eyes of the World: I don't like this song at all, but I love it live. Go figure.

That's exactly how I feel about "Not That Funny"...hate the studio version, love the live version.

DownOnRodeo · #15 10-13-2002, 06:52 AM

There was a whole article in my local paper today about how Pachobel's Canon is the 'grand-daddy' of pop songs! No mention of EOTW; it was an interview with Waterman, that English pop mogul who writes Kylie's songs. He says how he just rips them off classical works! lol.

But we all know FM are the Patron Saints of pop