Hillary Clinton vs. Barack Obama: Of the two, who do you like?

[HejiraNYC]

Originally Posted by dontlookdown

some fun facts:

Buckingham is more liberal than the rest of the band put together.
New Jersey may not have any big cities (unless you consider Trenton big), but the state is home to millions of people that work in New York and Philadelphia. All those commuter towns in the suburbs are filled with Obama loving educated white people.

Yes, that's why Clinton handed Obama's ass to him on Super Tuesday in New Jersey. NJ will definitely go blue no matter what in November, but Pennsylvania? Possibly-maybe-no.

Also, Frank Rich's column only validates my own feeling that Obama is an empty suit- that he has bamboozled the media and has used clever marketing and strategy to somehow get people to drink his brand of Kool Aid. If cult of personality and media manipulation are all it takes to become president, I think Oprah should be running instead of Obama.


[/QUOTE]

[strandinthewind]

Originally Posted by dontlookdown

I'm still not quite sure why people are interested in John McCain.
I find him to be incredibly unexceptional.

Are voters really going to turn out for Grampa Munster over Barack Obama?

Because he is intolerant of fags, hates baby killers, is far closer the christian right than any D, and fully supports keeping troops in Iraq Note - keeping troops in Iraq mostly supports the Christian right, who want an all out war in the Middle East so Christ will have His Second Coming.

Those are the only issues that matter to millions of voters. Sad - very true.

[HejiraNYC]

Originally Posted by strandinthewind

Poor Arianna - rhetoric as usual.

It pisses me off when people like her use inuendo to imply fact. Frankly, she is richly better than that

I can't believe that wart-faced hook-nose skank had the utter gall on CNN last week to say that she remains "undecided" on the Democratic nomination. Bitch, please.

[strandinthewind]

Originally Posted by HejiraNYC

I can't believe that skank had the utter gall on CNN last week to say that she remains "undecided" on the Democratic nomination. Bitch, please.

I know

I am no huge fan of Hillary Clinton. But, I call a spade a spade when I see someone use an invalid assertion as fact to make a non-sequitor point. People see that and they think it is true - both the incorrect legal assertion and the conclusion on which is it inappropraitely based and then covered in allegedly wry humor.

Ditto for people saying Hillary calling Obama an elitist. She never said that and, in fact, said the opposite. She said his comments came off that way and that it was a legitimate campaign issue to say they did. How is she wrong there?

[HejiraNYC]

[dontlookdown]

Ariana is a smart woman. I like hearing what she has to say, even if I don't agree with it.

I'm not sure I'd say Clinton handed Obama his ass in NJ. She beat him for sure there, with similar wins in CA and NY. But I can promise you the results would be quite different if those primaries were this month.

The White Guilt poster is really offensive.
It makes you seem like a suburban kid who doesn't get out enough.

[strandinthewind]

Originally Posted by dontlookdown

Ariana is a smart woman. I like hearing what she has to say, even if I don't agree with it.

I'm not sure I'd say Clinton handed Obama his ass in NJ. She beat him for sure there, with similar wins in CA and NY. But I can promise you the results would be quite different if those primaries were this month.

The White Guilt poster is really offensive.
It makes you seem like a suburban kid who doesn't get out enough.

Yes, esp. considering Rev. Wright's comments knowing how NJ, CA, and NY love a blindly religious leader protesting too much about how the law and not religion guides him

[dontlookdown]

I thought we had moved beyond the Fox News Wright sound bites. If you're not willing to hear Wright's comments in context, than what's the point of bringing him up? So you can sound like you're from West Virginia?

Separation of Church and State!

I vote for someone who can lead and govern. I don't care where or who they worship with.

Obama has more than a 12 point lead in current CA, NY and NJ polls. The Hillary signs are coming down in droves and being replaced by O's.

Trivial arguing aside, I think Hillary would have made a great president. She was poised to be our first truly progressive president.
But the tenor of her campaign has been so sour and negative, that I just don't see it translating into leadership for the whole country.
I think different advisors may have been able to get her to look at the country as it is today, rather than as it was in the 90's.
It seems as though the old Clinton sense of entitlement is finally backfiring on what looked like the Democratic party's strongest candidate in years.
Clearly Senator Clinton went into this primary season assuming she would clean up with nothing but wins. Instead she is facing a candidate that is gaining the kind of broad support this country has not seen since Ronald Reagan swept the country on the way to winning his first term.
Clinton is now firmly equated with the past, while Obama seems to be opening new doors and new eyes every day. The Bush administration planted the seeds for a big wake up call. Barack Obama was the only candidate politically astute enough to reap what's been sown. In my book, thats how you define judgement. In my book, that's leaps and bounds more "presidential" than anything we've seen or heard from Hillary Clinton this year.

[strandinthewind]

Originally Posted by dontlookdown

I thought we had moved beyond the Fox News Wright sound bites. If you're not willing to hear Wright's comments in context, than what's the point of bringing him up? So you can sound like you're from West Virginia?

Separation of Church and State!

I vote for someone who can lead and govern. I don't care where or who they worship with.

Obama has more than a 12 point lead in current CA, NY and NJ polls. The Hillary signs are coming down in droves and being replaced by O's.

There is no separation of Church and State and never really was. All there was ever supposed to be was that the govt. could not officially sanction one religion over another a la the Church of England - thus avoiding European esq religious prosecution. The problem come when establishing how far the govt. can go when legislating morality, or crimes. Are all so called victimless crimes, which are immoral unable to be prosecuted. Prostitution is a good example. Ignoring the spread of disease and the other criminal activity (mostly victimless I submit) that surrounds prostitution, it is okay to use religious immorality as a reason for calling it a crime. Same with suicide. The line is easier to draw in things that do not involve consenting adults, but even there, some religious aspect is part of the morality question. In other words, though it looks good on paper, it is all but impossible to sep. religion from the law, which as noted above, was never the framer's written intent, see the establishment clause. But, I digress.

Obama himself disowned Rev. Wright because of the comments by stating "After seeing Reverend Wright's performance, I felt there was a complete disregard for what the American people are going through and the need for them to rally together to solve these problems," he said. "What mattered to him was him commanding center stage." Obama said he was "particularly angered" by Wright's allegation that the candidate was engaging in political posturing when he denounced the minister's earlier remarks. "If Reverend Wright considers that political posturing, then he doesn't know me very well," Obama said. "Based on his comments yesterday, well, I may not know him as well as I thought, either." But, if you are implying that Rev. Wright's comments were taken out of context or that the news is giving them more incendiary value than Rev. Wright intended, I submit that is an implication unsupported by the facts.

[HejiraNYC]

Originally Posted by dontlookdown

I thought we had moved beyond the Fox News Wright sound bites. If you're not willing to hear Wright's comments in context, than what's the point of bringing him up? So you can sound like you're from West Virginia?

So what part of "g*****n America" and "the government created AIDS and infected black people" did I take out of context? And his recent performance before the Press Club pretty much confirmed what people had suspected all along- he's a hatemongering whack-a-doodle, and Obama is guilty by association.

I vote for someone who can lead and govern.

And give me one example where Obama has proven his mettle in this regard.

Obama has more than a 12 point lead in current CA, NY and NJ polls. The Hillary signs are coming down in droves and being replaced by O's.

I work in NJ and I live in NY. From all accounts, this is still solidly Clinton country.

Also, I have not seen any recent polls that would suggest that Obama is leading her in these states. Source, please?

[strandinthewind]

Originally Posted by HejiraNYC

. . . I work in NJ and I live in NY . . . .

I hear they make you alone pay an extra toll to get back into NYC - AND - they make you take the GW bridge

[strandinthewind]

Originally Posted by dontlookdown

. . . So you can sound like you're from West Virginia?

Actually, I minored in English and have doctorate degree

But, from what I have read in this thread and judging by that comment, you seem to look down on poor white Americans. Do you really think that way? if so, how is that better than me saying you sound like an ignorant ni**er from Alabama? To me, they are the same, though my comment in real life gets you in MUCH more trouble, thus the underlying reason Obama gets a race pass and Hillary does not.

[HejiraNYC]

Originally Posted by strandinthewind

I hear they make you alone pay an extra toll to get back into NYC - AND - they make you take the GW bridge

As if paying $8 for the Holland Tunnel wasn't enough, I have to pay a $3 Fabulosity surcharge.

[strandinthewind]

Originally Posted by HejiraNYC

. . . I have to pay a $3 Fabulosity surcharge.

Is that because the glare from your forehead provides blindness to the opposing drivers

[HejiraNYC]

Originally Posted by strandinthewind

Is that because the glare from your forehead provides blindness to the opposing drivers

The glare is from my halo, not my forehead.

Are you mocking my unnaturally wrinkle-free pate?