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  #91  
Old 12-05-2018, 09:48 AM
jmn3 jmn3 is offline
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Originally Posted by secondhandchain View Post
The whole Tom Petty thing is cringe worthy. The only reason this is happening is old goat breath has all the power now. LB would have NEVER let that happen. Stevie saying a quick thing about it before a song? maybe. Oh and I never answered the question of this whole thread. My answer? Can't.Stand.Her.
Lindsey absolutely would've never allowed such nonsense, nor SHOULD he nor Mick nor anyone else. I'm sorry, but Tom Petty (whose music I mostly love) has nothing to do with Fleetwood Mac. Mike Campbell being in the band for a few months, and Stevie's obsession with and handful of collaborations with him over 40 years does not justify this. And please, Tom playing Oh Well in concert is also not a legitimate tie-in that should have Free Fallin' in the setlist. Tom played Oh Well as a tribute to Peter and old school Fleetwood Mac due to their influence on him. When, at any point did Tom Petty influence Fleetwood mac in any way? But, Stevie can have her "moment" with the audience. Gag me. It's stuff like this that has soured me unbelievably on her (and the rest of what remains of this band).
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  #92  
Old 12-05-2018, 09:49 AM
jmn3 jmn3 is offline
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Originally Posted by On Ice View Post
Five hugely popular songs does not a legend make. I am also against her solo career being a catalyst for the rock and roll hall of fame- the glory ended after the Wild Heart and its been really spotty at best. So yes, I still love the 25-33 version of Stevie but the rest of it in hindsight, was a steady decline to the low she's at now.
This right here. I'm not sure why her solo career justifies the RRHOF nod? But, I also don't understand half of the artists who are in the RRHOF already so I guess there's that. Her 'rock and roll' songs, especially post 1983, are few and far between.
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  #93  
Old 12-05-2018, 09:59 AM
On Ice On Ice is offline
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Agreed on the Free Falling being in the set list thing. A song dedication such as "this is for you Tom" would've sufficed- how about Storms, (although terribly sung) arguably her second to Silver Springs as her best ever song? An entire song in the set though is uncalled for and an insult to the early talent who deserved more than a nod. Dropping the only Bob Welch song and keeping this is absurd.
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  #94  
Old 12-05-2018, 10:06 AM
jmn3 jmn3 is offline
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Originally Posted by On Ice View Post
Agreed on the Free Falling being in the set list thing. A song dedication such as "this is for you Tom" would've sufficed- how about Storms, (although terribly sung) arguably her second to Silver Springs as her best ever song? An entire song in the set though is uncalled for and an insult to the early talent who deserved more than a nod. Dropping the only Bob Welch song and keeping this is absurd.
When several reviews highlighted Don't Dream It's Over and Free Fallin' as pivotal moments during the shows, that's when I knew the wheels were completely off the cart.

Storms and Hypnotized (which Neal actually sounded good on TBH) were some of the most interesting aspects of this set. Having them both dropped while two non-Fleetwood Mac songs remain is appalling. They finally recognize Bob Welch after how many years of ignoring him, and then drop it altogether. Idiots.
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  #95  
Old 12-05-2018, 11:17 AM
wilsonmac wilsonmac is offline
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Originally Posted by secondhandchain View Post
The whole Tom Petty thing is cringe worthy. The only reason this is happening is old goat breath has all the power now. LB would have NEVER let that happen. Stevie saying a quick thing about it before a song? maybe. Oh and I never answered the question of this whole thread. My answer? Can't.Stand.Her.
I agree. Makes my skin crawl. Artists (in this case a former one who has turned into a Vegas performer) who use the death of someone to promote themselves is the bottom for me. I am still months later struggling to see how anyone is behind this garbage.
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  #96  
Old 12-05-2018, 12:15 PM
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There is a photo making the rounds on Social Media that someone created where it shows every single member of Fleetwood Mac including the new members and some people are using that photo to justify Lindsey's firing by pointing out the many members who have come and gone from FM. Yes FM has a long history of lineup changes but name anyone outside the 75-87 era that was either in the band for a substantial amount of time and or brought them success equal to or greater then the Rumors era.

To try to put Bob Brunning, Dave Walker, Bob Weston, etc in the same category as anyone from the 75-87 lineup is laughable. None of those guys contributed anything of real substance to the band as their time in the band was so brief. Who besides us die hard fans even knows anyone outside of the Rumours era (Peter Green and Bob Welch being the exception).

SN was the one who said Lindsey didn't want to play anything pre 75 and yet the ONLY Bob Welch song they were doing has since been dropped. Yet they have kept cover songs in and a very tacky tribute to Tom Petty when FM lost one of their own members (Danny Kirwan) just recently. You can't share a poster and go on and on about the various members and then turn around and accept a tribute to someone who was never a member of FM while ignoring someone who was a member.

The fact that people think it is ok that are doing this is pretty insulting.

As for SN being inducted in the RRHOF. I voted for her to get in but I will say that as a whole RRHOF is a joke. Many people are in there who have no business being in there when they are more deserving people who haven't been inducted (Pate Benetar, Tina Turner come to mind). SN solo career is is interesting to say the least. On one hand I do think she deserves to be there because she has allot of influence on some of today's stars and did have some big success in the 80's as a solo artist. I can see some people's point though regarding her actual sales and overall success when compared to other artists not inducted.

She had 1 number album and after that her albums continued to sell less and less. Yes she still had top 10 albums and successful tours but by 1991 her albums stopped selling big numbers. If it wasn't for the FM reunion in 97 I think none of her 90's work would have gone gold. She was headed for the state fair circuit until the big reunion. That isn't a dig just a fact.

I have always felt her solo albums were a mixed bag. Some truly fantastic music but then on the same CD some real duds. I think RAL has a lot of very cheesy 80's production on it but yet some of her songs on there are very good. My favorite album is TISL because allot of things were going on in my life at that time and I related to the music.

My least favorite album is her last CD as her voice was too nasal and I was disappointed that of all the demos she has out there that she chose to include another version of Twisted and a cover song by Vanessa Carlton.

Lindsey may not be a big name compared to her but at least he has something to say and isn't content to rest on the GH like she is doing with FM. They made such a big deal about honoring more then just the Rumors era and they have kept just 1 song in the set list from the pre 75 era that is actually a rare cut. Oh Well doesn't count because it has been done often enough since 75 that it isn't really an obscure song.

To me the band has ruined their legacy and whether they sell tickets or not the brand is tarnished and at the end of the day when all is said and done what people will remember is how it ended and not the great music that was made for 50 plus years.
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  #97  
Old 12-05-2018, 12:32 PM
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Jondalar Jondalar is offline
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Originally Posted by Nicks Fan View Post
There is a photo making the rounds on Social Media that someone created where it shows every single member of Fleetwood Mac including the new members and some people are using that photo to justify Lindsey's firing by pointing out the many members who have come and gone from FM. Yes FM has a long history of lineup changes but name anyone outside the 75-87 era that was either in the band for a substantial amount of time and or brought them success equal to or greater then the Rumors era.

To try to put Bob Brunning, Dave Walker, Bob Weston, etc in the same category as anyone from the 75-87 lineup is laughable. None of those guys contributed anything of real substance to the band as their time in the band was so brief. Who besides us die hard fans even knows anyone outside of the Rumours era (Peter Green and Bob Welch being the exception).

SN was the one who said Lindsey didn't want to play anything pre 75 and yet the ONLY Bob Welch song they were doing has since been dropped. Yet they have kept cover songs in and a very tacky tribute to Tom Petty when FM lost one of their own members (Danny Kirwan) just recently. You can't share a poster and go on and on about the various members and then turn around and accept a tribute to someone who was never a member of FM while ignoring someone who was a member.

The fact that people think it is ok that are doing this is pretty insulting.

As for SN being inducted in the RRHOF. I voted for her to get in but I will say that as a whole RRHOF is a joke. Many people are in there who have no business being in there when they are more deserving people who haven't been inducted (Pate Benetar, Tina Turner come to mind). SN solo career is is interesting to say the least. On one hand I do think she deserves to be there because she has allot of influence on some of today's stars and did have some big success in the 80's as a solo artist. I can see some people's point though regarding her actual sales and overall success when compared to other artists not inducted.

She had 1 number album and after that her albums continued to sell less and less. Yes she still had top 10 albums and successful tours but by 1991 her albums stopped selling big numbers. If it wasn't for the FM reunion in 97 I think none of her 90's work would have gone gold. She was headed for the state fair circuit until the big reunion. That isn't a dig just a fact.

I have always felt her solo albums were a mixed bag. Some truly fantastic music but then on the same CD some real duds. I think RAL has a lot of very cheesy 80's production on it but yet some of her songs on there are very good. My favorite album is TISL because allot of things were going on in my life at that time and I related to the music.

My least favorite album is her last CD as her voice was too nasal and I was disappointed that of all the demos she has out there that she chose to include another version of Twisted and a cover song by Vanessa Carlton.

Lindsey may not be a big name compared to her but at least he has something to say and isn't content to rest on the GH like she is doing with FM. They made such a big deal about honoring more then just the Rumors era and they have kept just 1 song in the set list from the pre 75 era that is actually a rare cut. Oh Well doesn't count because it has been done often enough since 75 that it isn't really an obscure song.

To me the band has ruined their legacy and whether they sell tickets or not the brand is tarnished and at the end of the day when all is said and done what people will remember is how it ended and not the great music that was made for 50 plus years.
Stevie screwed up royally. You can't put lipstick on a pig. It's still a pig. That's what a lot of fans are trying to do. I think what has been done has caused more damage than people want to admit.
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  #98  
Old 12-05-2018, 12:35 PM
jbrownsjr jbrownsjr is offline
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Originally Posted by wilsonmac View Post
I agree. Makes my skin crawl. Artists (in this case a former one who has turned into a Vegas performer) who use the death of someone to promote themselves is the bottom for me. I am still months later struggling to see how anyone is behind this garbage.
She has always used someone's death to promote herself or make these kinds of situations about her. She's a complete narcissist, in this regard.

She hung out with Prince for a few hours and acted like they were friends for years and years and years...
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  #99  
Old 12-05-2018, 06:49 PM
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This tour could quite possibly be the last tour for Fleetwood Mac. That's what bothers me. This could have been a big sendoff and a positive end for a band that's notorious for drama. It would have been a storybook ending. Instead we have this. It's quite sad and pretty insulting for the band to add two new members in its twilight. Mick has always been a money mark so it's not surprising that he didn't have a backbone when it came to Stevie.

I don't really have any other feelings that haven't already been said in this thread. It just makes me sad. Fleetwood Mac has been and always be a huge part of my life. This isn't the ending that should have happened.
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  #100  
Old 12-05-2018, 07:50 PM
luminol luminol is offline
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Originally Posted by cbBen View Post
I do, however, take issue with the band for carrying on without Lindsey. After 1997, the band had no business excluding any Rumours member willing and able to participate.
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Originally Posted by Street_Dreamer View Post
This tour could quite possibly be the last tour for Fleetwood Mac. That's what bothers me. This could have been a big sendoff and a positive end for a band that's notorious for drama. It would have been a storybook ending. Instead we have this. It's quite sad and pretty insulting for the band to add two new members in its twilight. Mick has always been a money mark so it's not surprising that he didn't have a backbone when it came to Stevie.

I don't really have any other feelings that haven't already been said in this thread. It just makes me sad. Fleetwood Mac has been and always be a huge part of my life. This isn't the ending that should have happened.
I agree with all of this 100%.

It's really deplorable how she acted and that the others allowed it.

I will never listen to their music with the same enjoyment again.

It's a tragic ending to what should have been a magical final tour for THE FANS with the most successful lineup in their history. Instead they're a joke. And I feel sorry for Mike Campbell being dragged into it because of Stevie's inability to deal with grief and obsession with Tom Petty and his band.

It's all pretty pathetic. Shame on her (and Mick, John, and Chris).
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  #101  
Old 12-05-2018, 10:51 PM
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For me it is the hypocrisy of the fans that has really pissed me off. SN delays tours and albums or decides not to participate and it is fine. Then when they allege Lindsey wanted a delay oh no we can't have that. The way they make excuses for her is pretty ridiculous.


Facebook is really bad too. SN worshipers keep posting pictures or videos saying things like "She finally had enough" or saying things about her performing so well given what she is going through. With all due respect to the victims in the #metoo movement SN is not nor was ever a battered or beaten woman. I do not like this idea that she is anyway a victim in the me too movement. Not to say Lindsey is blameless for things said and done in their relationship but it was two way street in that they both antagonized each other over the years and pushed each other buttons.

IMO I think she is just bitter that others from her past have moved on and have a wife and or kids and she has none of that. I also think she is bitter that she isn't selling millions of albums anymore and Lindsey is making music and having a good time. He may not be selling millions but he is certainly not hurting. She seems angry that her last two albums came and went and were not big sellers. I also still think she has lost her creativity and doesn't want to make a new CD because Chris and Lindsey would have brought something new and she likely would have had to mine her demos instead of writing anything new.

He deserves more credit for saving this band on more then one occasion. Tango was their biggest seller since Rumors and he is the reason for that. SN was barely there so it isn't like she can claim she contributed countless hours in the studio to help arrange and or produce the tracks.

At the end of the day real fans know the truth about who put in the most work and time on their most successful albums even if some people want to claim otherwise.

I can't wait to see his interview on Saturday. Then I will sit back and watch his haters try to spin whatever he might say re his firing. No matter what he says or does I have accepted that they won't change their opinions of him or his wife. They badmouthed him for not speaking re what happened and then when he did say what was what they still were not happy.
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  #102  
Old 12-05-2018, 11:03 PM
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I like Stevie and I like Lindsey. I don't obsess about their personal lives or disagreements with each other.
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  #103  
Old 12-05-2018, 11:20 PM
jbrownsjr jbrownsjr is offline
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I like Stevie and I like Lindsey. I don't obsess about their personal lives or disagreements with each other.
Well, I agree with that. However, this became a HUGE business disagreement. I have never bought the love affair between them. It's been BS for years. And the people that feel that FMac is SN/LB, have no clue what Fleetwood Mac is all about.

Having said that, holy cow what a nasty, disgusting thing to do to someone. The part that bothers me the most is: The Ghosting.

That actually hurt me to hear it. Because I put myself in his shoes and thought wow. How hurtful that must have been. What those first few weeks or even months were like. Knowing people you have spent 40 years with .. icing you.

And to top it off, the person you elevated to stardom, shoves it in your face and gets you fired with the promoter. That just utterly disgusts me. If she has a soul at all she should be ashamed.
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  #104  
Old 12-05-2018, 11:44 PM
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Well, I agree with that. However, this became a HUGE business disagreement. I have never bought the love affair between them. It's been BS for years. And the people that feel that FMac is SN/LB, have no clue what Fleetwood Mac is all about.

Having said that, holy cow what a nasty, disgusting thing to do to someone. The part that bothers me the most is: The Ghosting.

That actually hurt me to hear it. Because I put myself in his shoes and thought wow. How hurtful that must have been. What those first few weeks or even months were like. Knowing people you have spent 40 years with .. icing you.

And to top it off, the person you elevated to stardom, shoves it in your face and gets you fired with the promoter. That just utterly disgusts me. If she has a soul at all she should be ashamed.
I don't care if people go to the shows. I am just annoyed at people who went on and on about the pre 75 material when in the past they were the same ones saying no one wants to hear that stuff as it isn't well known. I suspect allot the vicious fans on social media don't even own any albums pre 75, have never bought a FM album or any band solo stuff unless SN was on it. If you are only going to see FM because of SN (Not saying everyone is but allot of people are) then in my opinion it shows such disrespect for the other members past and present and their music.

Last edited by Nicks Fan; 12-06-2018 at 11:30 PM..
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  #105  
Old 12-06-2018, 01:06 AM
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The first 3-4 minutes or so of this interview with Tom himself gives a clear sense of what he would think about this tour... Wish Stevie had listened to him more.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I4B3tivQqGs
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