Are you over Stevie?

[Jondalar]

I finally feel that I’m over her. It’s the way she acted the last few years. I just don’t see her in the same way. Looking back, I just think that she is someone who got extremely lucky and was able to surround herself with truly talented people.

[mitzo]

I am not over her. I understand your feeling about her but I for one always saw her as a self absorbed weirdo. Her behavior over the past several years has not bothered me any more than in other time periods, I was never a worshipper of her as a person, but she attracted me as a songwriter and performer. The thing that will get me over her is a lack of new music, eventually. As for her success being based on the talents of others, yes, partly true, but her limitations as a musician and even as a vocalist have been a weird part of her appeal. Oddly, way back in the beginning, she showed us that you can make appealing music with oddball songs and limited vocal abilities. Even now, when lights are low and she croaks and moans a mysterious ballad in her raw voice it can be compelling as hell. You and I both loved 24kG, imagine if we got more of that!

[Netter75]

Originally Posted by Jondalar

I finally feel that I’m over her. It’s the way she acted the last few years. I just don’t see her in the same way. Looking back, I just think that she is someone who got extremely lucky and was able to surround herself with truly talented people.

This is true to some extent but also is unfair and doesn't give her enough credit.

Would she have been anything without Lindsey Buckingham and the rest of Fleetwood Mac? Highly unlikely. That band (as it existed in the late 70s) brings the absolute best out of her and compliments her strengths and weaknesses perfectly. Same goes for her first solo album, had it not been for the collarboation with Tom Petty and Jimmy Iovine and the other wonderful talent hired for Bella Donna, the album may never have seen the success it did.

That being said, how is that different from any other popular artist? Music is always a collaborative effort and all of the cogs have to be turning for it to work. She may have been nothing without Fleetwood Mac, but would Fleetwood Mac be what it is without her? HELL NO. Lindsey is an amazing guitarist but if the band had only taken him in 1975 the band would've lacked all of the factors that she brought to the table that McVie and Buckingham could never do. That star power that only she possessed, a unique writing style that provided a contrast between McVie's lighter content and Buckingham's more un-relateable content, a voice that (while not necessarily the best from a technical standpoint ala McVie) was incredibly distinctive and managed to emote to an incredible degree, and finally a stage presence that could captivate audiences with little more than some chiffon-laden outfits and twirls.

And also most importantly, her writing: She's a writer first and foremost, with her musicianship limited to being able to craft basic song structures for her lyrics. While that strength was certainly running dry by RAL, her songs on the White Ablum, Rumours, and Tusk are by far the most lyrically interesting of the three members imo. The balance between esoteric and relatable is hard to pull off and she did wonderfully with it (at least until RAL forward).

(examples: Beautiful Child, Dreams, Gypsy, Gold Dust Woman, Sara, Storms, Landslide are AMAZING from a musicianship standpoint, but the lyrics are what most people connect to)

Do I approve of any of her recent comments/actions? I don't think it's as black and white a situation as many of the more emotional fans seem to think (Stevie just hates Lindsey so she got him fired vs the band decided to tour and rudely moved on without Lindsey when he did not agree), but that doesn't mean I approve. I don't really approve of any of the bands behavior at any point in time, frankly. They consistently squandered opportunities at every turn since 1979 that could have made them even greater than they are if they had just acted like adults for 10 minutes. None of them are saints, now or then. It leads to the question why recent events caused you to lose respect when she's kind of always been like this. Please don't take this as an attack, but what was your image of her before? If it was anything besides an out of touch, self-indulgent person with a propensity for petty nonsense than you must never have seen an interview with her from literally any time period post 1976.

In conclusion: she's never been a great human being and has relied on the talent of others but that's a part of collaboration. She's not a producer or a musician, but she is a personality/performer and a lyricist. Combine that with some of the best talent in the industry at the time and you've got the Queen of Rock and Roll. That is why I am still a fan of her work.

[gldstwmn]

No but I'm over this line of discussion.

[mitzo]

Originally Posted by gldstwmn

No but I'm over this line of discussion.

I get that and feel a bit similar. But this thread gives us a chance to reflect a bit on what it is that draws us to Stevie.

[sodascouts]

I'm not over her as a musician and I never will be because I don't agree with the premise of the OP. If you listen to her demos, even before the help she received, there was a lot to work with there. Also, her lyrics and voice are emotive and striking. They affect people.

I am over her "persona" and the person she has become; I always knew she was a diva, but I thought she was cool, too. I had a lot of affection for her as a person. No longer. However, I am able to divorce that from her music.

[JohnL]

I realize I probably don't even need to answer this thread but I am absolutely not over Stevie. I think the one thing she has constantly done for me over the years is surprise me. Just when you think you have heard the last from her she will come back with something amazing! She did it with The Dance, TISL, and even a little bit with 24 Karat Gold. I believe she will make another solo album that will be her swan song and it will be excellent!!

Her strength is definitely in her lyrics and poetry...but watching some of these documentaries has shown me how much she knows what she wants her songs to sound like and she fights for it until she gets it. No one person can be everything in the music business. I believe she knows what her strengths and weaknesses are...and she uses that to her advantage.

[WatchChain]

Originally Posted by Netter75

This is true to some extent but also is unfair and doesn't give her enough credit.

Would she have been anything without Lindsey Buckingham and the rest of Fleetwood Mac? Highly unlikely. That band (as it existed in the late 70s) brings the absolute best out of her and compliments her strengths and weaknesses perfectly. Same goes for her first solo album, had it not been for the collarboation with Tom Petty and Jimmy Iovine and the other wonderful talent hired for Bella Donna, the album may never have seen the success it did.

That being said, how is that different from any other popular artist? Music is always a collaborative effort and all of the cogs have to be turning for it to work. She may have been nothing without Fleetwood Mac, but would Fleetwood Mac be what it is without her? HELL NO. Lindsey is an amazing guitarist but if the band had only taken him in 1975 the band would've lacked all of the factors that she brought to the table that McVie and Buckingham could never do. That star power that only she possessed, a unique writing style that provided a contrast between McVie's lighter content and Buckingham's more un-relateable content, a voice that (while not necessarily the best from a technical standpoint ala McVie) was incredibly distinctive and managed to emote to an incredible degree, and finally a stage presence that could captivate audiences with little more than some chiffon-laden outfits and twirls.

And also most importantly, her writing: She's a writer first and foremost, with her musicianship limited to being able to craft basic song structures for her lyrics. While that strength was certainly running dry by RAL, her songs on the White Ablum, Rumours, and Tusk are by far the most lyrically interesting of the three members imo. The balance between esoteric and relatable is hard to pull off and she did wonderfully with it (at least until RAL forward).

(examples: Beautiful Child, Dreams, Gypsy, Gold Dust Woman, Sara, Storms, Landslide are AMAZING from a musicianship standpoint, but the lyrics are what most people connect to)

Do I approve of any of her recent comments/actions? I don't think it's as black and white a situation as many of the more emotional fans seem to think (Stevie just hates Lindsey so she got him fired vs the band decided to tour and rudely moved on without Lindsey when he did not agree), but that doesn't mean I approve. I don't really approve of any of the bands behavior at any point in time, frankly. They consistently squandered opportunities at every turn since 1979 that could have made them even greater than they are if they had just acted like adults for 10 minutes. None of them are saints, now or then. It leads to the question why recent events caused you to lose respect when she's kind of always been like this. Please don't take this as an attack, but what was your image of her before? If it was anything besides an out of touch, self-indulgent person with a propensity for petty nonsense than you must never have seen an interview with her from literally any time period post 1976.

In conclusion: she's never been a great human being and has relied on the talent of others but that's a part of collaboration. She's not a producer or a musician, but she is a personality/performer and a lyricist. Combine that with some of the best talent in the industry at the time and you've got the Queen of Rock and Roll. That is why I am still a fan of her work.

This is extremely well written and eloquently stated.

[Netter75]

Originally Posted by WatchChain

This is extremely well written and eloquently stated.

Thank you

[wondergirl9847]

Lindsey Fan in the Stevie Room. :wink:


Ok, I am primarily an LB fan, but I love this band. That doesn't mean I love every member, song or album, but overall, FM is my fave band ever. I love pre-SnL and some post SnL but I love the 5 Fireflies era the most. Lindsey may be #1 for me but Danny Kirwan is my 2nd fave. Stevie is third.

All that to preface my feelings on Stevie. She really disappoints me with how all of this has gone down. I find that when her songs come on the radio...I change the channel. I can't enjoy them right now and that upsets me because I love a lot of her music. Yes, I believe she had something to do with Lindsey's outster along with Mick. Thick as theves....those two.

As far as her legacy, away from the drama. It is fantastic, yes. She has written some of the most amazing, heart-wrenching songs that will forever be my favorites, no matter what. Gold Dust Woman was always my fave live SN song. It was magical. Beautiful Child, Storms, Landslide, all those touch my heart, especially as I have gotten older and experienced tremendous loss lately.

Her personality is a pill though. I know LB used to be a pill too but I think he is more chill today, whereas, Stevie has gotten more and more unlikable. She frustrates me. I wanna like her and her wierdness but cannot. Maybe I have changed too and don't want to put up with certain crap.

I think its best that Lindsey is doing his thing and the two of them get a FM tour break from each other. I will not be seeing this iteration on tour....got LB tickets.

It will be interesting to see what happens with FM and as more time passes from Tom Petty's loss.

[StreetAngel86]

yes. to the power of infinity.

[secondhandchain]

That’s a big fat yes. 2 years ago was a huge fan. Bye bye Felicia.

[StevieandChris]

Originally Posted by secondhandchain

That’s a big fat yes. 2 years ago was a huge fan. Bye bye Felicia.

I think you secretly want her to be your best friend.