Non-Album Survivor Rounds 4-5

[face of glass]

Originally Posted by Miss Vicky

And, for the record, although Lindsey Buckingham is a guitarist at heart, he has shown us the singer/songwriter side of him on more than just a few occasions. In fact, he seems to show this side on at least one song from every album he's released, both solo and with the band. The first and probably one of the best of which was Buckingham Nicks' "Without A Leg to Stand On."

When I referred to Lindsey Buckingham's singer-songwriter side, I was mainly thinking of albums like Plastic Ono Band and Blood On The Tracks, both albums that are considered the cream of the genre (and isn't POB considered to be one of those albums that initiated the whole wave of singer-songwriters? Not to mention Dylan's influence on the genre as a whole.) Both are very intimate albums where the singer's voices are close to the listener during the fragile moments. To me the only pieces in Lindsey's catalogue that remind me of such moments are "Save Me A Place", "Street Of Dreams" and "Someone's Gotta Change Your Mind". Although yes, something like "What Makes You Think You're The One" isn't far off from the harrowing screams of "Well Well Well" (but then I don't think either is necessarily a singer-songwriter piece anyway).

I'm also interested in which you think are Lindsey's singer-songwriter pieces on Law And Order and Go Insane, or Mirage and Tango In The Night for that matter. From OOTC onwards I can understand your statement, due to the increasing introspectiveness in his lyrics, but as for the earlier work I'm having difficulties with it. Personally I could call "Without A Leg To Stand On" a piece of Californian pop-rock, I do not see what makes it particularly singer-songwriterish.

[Miss Vicky]

Originally Posted by face of glass

I'm also interested in which you think are Lindsey's singer-songwriter pieces on Law And Order and Go Insane, or Mirage and Tango In The Night for that matter. From OOTC onwards I can understand your statement, due to the increasing introspectiveness in his lyrics, but as for the earlier work I'm having difficulties with it. Personally I could call "Without A Leg To Stand On" a piece of Californian pop-rock, I do not see what makes it particularly singer-songwriterish.

Singer songwriter probably wasn't the best choice of words. Okay, it was a bad choice of words. What I meant is that Lindsey has shown us the introspective and contemplative side of his lyrical talents since the beginning with "Without a Leg to Stand On."
On Law and Order he showed us this same side with "Shadow of the West" and on Go Insane with "D.W. Suite." And yes, he has brought this side of him much more to the forefront with his more recent offerings. Does that clarify?

Edit:
For Mirage, I'll give you that one. I pretty much try to forget that album even exists.
As for Tango, the title track.

[trackaghost]

Originally Posted by face of glass

I'd like to know where in my post I displayed such a notion. After all, I, too, am a person who appreciates his diversity with all my heart, moments like "You And I Part Two" or "It Was I" (representative of charming naivety) are no less dear to me than "D. W. Suite" or "Play In The Rain" (representative of Lindsey finally escaping the traditional song structure for a while, and acting like the Grande Artist).

Sorry I was referring to someone else's post when I wrote that, not you. (Was it Johnny Stew?)
I should have said.

Originally Posted by face of glass

People seem to assume that "Holiday Road" is a pure throwaway, something that Lindsey quickly threw together and gave away for a soundtrack of some movie. For me it is a perfect pop song, a collection of cliches that should not work when collected together but they somehow do work and create this magical state. It is difficult to make such cliches work, but somehow the song just manages to do that. And therefore I do not see it as any less worthy than anything else Lindsey has ever done. Doing something impressive and lightweight is difficult, just as difficult as baring your soul in an impressive manner. And that's why I can't see "Holiday Road" as a throwaway.

I don't think it's throwaway, I love it! But I think its power is in the fact that it's simple and not particularly deep.
I mean the Beatles, "She loves you, yeah, yeah, yeah" - classic!

Someone once asked Paul Simon what he thought the greatest lyrics in a pop song were and he replied: "Be bop a-lula, she's my baby", and he's right, sometimes those simple things are the most memorable and effective.

[Nico]

I think Holiday Road is an awesome song! I love it and it's repetitiveness. I think its fun. I'm known to love many fun songs. I enjoy Obla-Di Obla-Da and I admit to owning (and playing rather frequently) the original "Willy Wonka" soundtrack.

I think SGTCYM is a better song for me because it moves me more. The words and the emotion he puts into it, plus the music are SO beautiful. That's just my definition of what makes a song better, but there is nothing wrong with digging a nice, sweet, bouncy song like HR and if you like that kind of stuff, and prefer it, then it is better to you.

Anyway, I pretty much love everything Lindsey does, to varying degrees. He's really a genius and I feel so lucky to be so acquainted with all this brilliant music.

[David]

Originally Posted by Miss Vicky

And in my opinion, Someone's Gotta Change Your Mind is superior to Holiday Road on both a lyrical and musical level.

Not mine, baby. Holiday Road is a whipcrack Tex-Mex fuzz-buzz motorbikin' overdriver with a chorus that is catchy & gear-fab frenetic.

The whole damn country was humming that chorus after seeing "Vacation." You'd never see anything similar with "Someone's Gotta Change," which sounds like a cross between Yoko Ono & James Taylor on a bender.

[Nico]

Originally Posted by David

You'd never see anything similar with "Someone's Gotta Change," which sounds like a cross between Yoko Ono & James Taylor on a bender.

Oh that's wicked.

[Miss Vicky]

Originally Posted by David

Not mine, baby. Holiday Road is a whipcrack Tex-Mex fuzz-buzz motorbikin' overdriver with a chorus that is catchy & gear-fab frenetic.

The whole damn country was humming that chorus after seeing "Vacation." You'd never see anything similar with "Someone's Gotta Change," which sounds like a cross between Yoko Ono & James Taylor on a bender.

That's nice, baby, but I was a whole two years old when that movie came out so what it did then means nothing to me now.

[shackin'up]

Originally Posted by David

You'd never see anything similar with "Someone's Gotta Change," which sounds like a cross between Yoko Ono & James Taylor on a bender.

I'd choose that anytime above the image of 150 million fat americans humming a flat repeater when they walk out of the movies with popcorn in the corner of their mouth. Hell, I even hum achy breaky heart for 3 days everytime I incidentally hear a snippet of it. And now are you going to defend THAT as a superior song too? Brrrrr. American culture.

[face of glass]

Originally Posted by trackaghost

I don't think it's throwaway, I love it!

Hmm, ok. I've just seen people generally assume that of songs that are just out there to "have fun".

[face of glass]

Originally Posted by Miss Vicky

On Law and Order he showed us this same side with "Shadow of the West" and on Go Insane with "D.W. Suite." And yes, he has brought this side of him much more to the forefront with his more recent offerings. Does that clarify?

Edit:
For Mirage, I'll give you that one. I pretty much try to forget that album even exists.
As for Tango, the title track.

In terms of lyrics I can understand that, but I tend to think of these songs in terms of general atmosphere and those deviate from the usual singer-songwriter one. Maybe "Shadow Of The West" is closer to that, but the Beach Boys tribute of "D.W. Suite" and the nutcracker-like "Tango In The Night" are very far away from that, IMO.
But bleh, we love it all and that's what matters.

[Miss Vicky]

Originally Posted by face of glass

In terms of lyrics I can understand that, but I tend to think of these songs in terms of general atmosphere and those deviate from the usual singer-songwriter one. Maybe "Shadow Of The West" is closer to that, but the Beach Boys tribute of "D.W. Suite" and the nutcracker-like "Tango In The Night" are very far away from that, IMO.
But bleh, we love it all and that's what matters.

I was speaking strictly in terms of lyrics.

But yes, we love it all... well I love it all except "Oh Diane" - probably the only Buckingham song that I can't stand - and that is what matters.

[David]

Originally Posted by Miss Vicky

For Mirage, I'll give you that one. I pretty much try to forget that album even exists.

Why? That represents some of the best engineering Lindsey's ever done. I also give props to the arrangements.

[Miss Vicky]

Originally Posted by David

Why? That represents some of the best engineering Lindsey's ever done. I also give props to the arrangements.

Because the whole album is fluff. It was the band regressing. In terms of pop accessibility it was the Rumours II that people had wanted Tusk to be. Just look at "Oh Diane" and that rip-off "Book of Love." I like "Eyes of the World," "Empire State," and "Can't Go Back," but this is probably the only album where I like some Christine and Stevie's contributions ("Gypsy," "Hold Me," "Wish You Were Here") more than Buckingham's. But as a whole, the album stinks. Just my opinion.

[ReFleetwoodMac]

Originally Posted by Miss Vicky

Because the whole album is fluff.

You have quite the fondness for that word, don't you?

You're saying that Empire state and Book of Love, and even Can't Go Back are typical pop songs?

[shackin'up]

Originally Posted by ReFleetwoodMac

You have quite the fondness for that word, don't you?

You're saying that Empire state and Book of Love, and even Can't Go Back are typical pop songs?

add Eyes of the world too.

That album is 10 times more daring than Tango.