An informal survey

[BklynBlue]

Hi,
I was hoping for some help with an informal survey. I'm curious as to when most people, especially in the U.S., first became aware of the Peter Green era Fleetwood Mac.
My theory is that most listeners today found these recordings by working their way backwards from the Buckingham / Nicks LPs / CDs which most likely introduced them to the band.
I may be completely wrong in my thinking here (wouldn't be the first time, ask my wife) and I realize age would play a large part; though I was too young to purchase the records when they were released, my older brother was not and though he had Mayall and Cream and Hendrix, neither he nor the older brothers (or sisters) of any of my friends, who's record collections we would inherit as we got older, ever had any Fleetwood Mac.
I never heard the band on the radio, although I grew up in New York and most rock radio was "free format" (oh for those days once more!)
The first time I heard the Green era FM was on a "House of Blues" radio program promoting the re-issue of the "Blues Jam in Chicago" sessions on CD.
Growing up, I'd never seen any but the post Blue Horizon LPs in the stores - (the artwork on Mystery to Me and Heroes Are Hard To Find guaranteed I'd never pick those up!) -
but anyway, I discovered the Green years through my interest in The Blues - I'd love to know how others found their way to it -
thanks in advance

[chiliD]

The VERY short version:

An older cousin, who lived in Boston (I live in California), introduced me to John Mayall's Bluesbreakers back in 1966. Became a big Clapton fan (I hadn't known he was in one of my favorite bands, The Yardbirds then). When I read he left Mayall to co-form Cream, I didn't think there would be anyone who could step into his shoes. Enter Peter Green. Later, I read he'd left to form his own band. I DID hear "Black Magic Woman" early on...but then didn't hear anything by Fleetwood Mac again until "Oh Well". That hooked me; been a Mac fan ever since, through good times & bad, and all the personnel changes.

[greenfire]

"My theory is that most listeners today found these recordings by working their way backwards from the Buckingham / Nicks LPs / CDs which most likely introduced them to the band."

--BklynBlue


I do support your theory but thought I would add a different perspective on it. Strangely enough, I am a relatively new fan but I did start from the back and gradually worked my way forward, skipping around a bit. I still haven't gotten to Rumours!

When I first started with FM in Sept 1996. I had been reading about them in a Rolling Stone book. I was familiar with "Black Magic Woman" but associated it with Santana and didn't have a clue that it was a Peter Green FM original. I never knew FM existed prior to 1975. I read that they began as a trad. Blues band and about their #1 British hit in 68 with "Albatross". I was really curious what they sounded like...so I tried to investigate. I couldn't find the album with "Albatross". The only one the record store could get that had "Albatross" was The Chain box set. I think even on cassette it was $40 some dollars and on cd over $100. It was more than I could spend to just hear their sound. I found I could get Then Play On from 69 and figured this would be a good indicator of the early FM.

Upon first hearing, I didn't really like it. I really don't know what I expected but it really wasn't quite what I thought I would like. I had never really listened to Blues prior to this. I was a bit disappointed and just forgot about it for awhile. I then listened to it again a couple months later figuring there just had to be something to this stuff. I listened to it a few times and yeah, I was starting to get it. Ok, yeah, this is good,....wow, Hey...this is GREAT! I kept going from there. Bare Trees was the next one. I had heard what I would come to know as "Sentimental Lady" but had never heard this version. It was funny, I had always liked that song but never really knew who it was. I found out in a BIG way!

[BklynBlue]

thank you both for your replies -

Couple of questions:

1) ChiliD - Were you able to find the Blue Horizon LPs, FM's or other BH artists (Chicken Shack, Duster Bennett, Dave Kelly etc.)during the years the label was active?

2) Greenfire - did you find that the Internet was helpful in tracking down titles otherwise not available or in obtaining information to help in making a purchasing decision?

Greenfire, I know exactly what you're talking about - the first Fleetwood Mac I picked up was the "Live at the BBC" collection, having read a positive write up in a guitar magazine.
Like you, I didn't quite know what to make of it. It was all over the map. The only tracks I knew from this line up at the time, were "Black Magic Woman", "Albatross", "Watch Out" and "I Can't Hold Out". Which actually should have prepared me for the eclecticism found on the two BBC discs - but for some reason, I expected, and wanted just straight forward Blues - or maybe something closer to Cream :0!
I returned it, (there was a skip in "Jumping At Shadows") but over time, I found myself thinking a about the tracks on there that I really did like, and now I wanted them!
One day, (I remember becasuse it was one of the few times I was flush with cash) I spotted the Blue Horizon box, liked the price point and bought it. Only gamble I ever made that paid off like that!
Here's what I was looking for! And I've been building my collection since then.

Again, thanks for taking the time, look forward to hearing from you again

[ShamHy89]

"My theory is that most listeners today found these recordings by working their way backwards from the Buckingham / Nicks LPs / CDs which most likely introduced them to the band."

Well, I am certainly living proof of your theory. I began with the Rumours Era and worked my way backwards. I find that I like the pre-BN era better, and that was judging by the Bob Welch period in the band. Now, I am finally discovering Peter Green, as I just bought Then Play On and the Blue Horizon Set about a month ago. (Both of which i am still listening through and appreciating *slowly*) I had KNOWN of PG, but it is just now that I am becoming familiar with his work in FM.

[greenfire]

BlkynBlue,

I like that Eddie Vetter quote:

"All the rusted signs we ignore throughout our lives, choosing the shiny ones instead"

There is so much fantastic music out there which are hidden gems. You can apply some of that to the Peter Green and 71-74 Fleetwood Mac and not hearing much of it on the radio. I have to admit though, we did get a new radio station here and in recent years I have heard "Oh Well", "Black Magic Woman" (PG's not Santana), "Bare Trees", "Emerald Eyes", "Bright Fire" & "Hypnotized" or "World Turning" & "Monday Morning" from the 'white album'. I know "Hypnotized" is a common track in some areas of the country but before 1996 I had never heard it.

I've only been on the internet since 2001, so I didn't have that as a resource until the last few years, but your right, it has been of immense help finding these "rusted signs". I did find some good music encyclopedias and discographies which were really helpful. Like I said, if I hadn't seen that reference in that one Rolling Stone book, I may never have discovered FM. At one time, I used a music finder over the telephone to locate hard to find cds. I remember trying to get "dog & dustbin" & Mr. Wonderful. I remember the guy told me he found cd copies of each for $60...wayyyy too much! I couldn't afford that. This was back around 2000 and I think they have been re-issued since, but like you, I found the Blue Horizon Box and that covered those and more.

Your right though, the Internet has been a big help in tracking down hard to find music. Sometimes you can get some great bargains on eBay but you have to really watch what your bidding on and the terms. The Internet has been a big help connecting with fellow fans and being able to bounce ideas off one another like we do here! You might also like that 1971 CBS Greatest Hits. I'm sure your aware of it, I don't have it either, but it has "Green Manalishi", "Man of the World" and Danny's "Dragon Fly". I remember reading in that box set, Peter Green's comment that "Dragon Fly" was his favorite Danny Kirwan song. I'm sure you've seen that comment if you read the booklet within your box. There is another Jermey Spencer song which I think was released on the b-side, can't remember which, maybe I heard it was "Dragon Fly", but it's called "The Purple Dancer".

I know I started from the back, but I have a new found appreciation for the latter music. Those "shiny signs" were right in front of me all along and yet they might just have well been the rusted ones. All in all, it's been a lot fun!

[macfan 57]

It's been the same for me. I first became aware of Fleetwood Mac in 1975 with Christine & the Rumours line-up. But, it wasn't until around the early 1990's, I think, that I started getting interested in the 1971-1974 years. It was around the time that these albums were first released on CD. As soon as I heard these albums, then I wished that I hadn't waited so long to get them. Mystery To Me is now my favorite Fleetwood Mac album, period.

I first got on the internet in 1999. Sometime later, I got Then Play One, the Blue Horizon box set, English Rose, Pious Bird Of Good Omen, the Original Fleetwood Mac & then finally the Live at the BBC set. But, my favorite album from this era is the 1971 Greatest Hits CD, since my favorite songs from this era are really the Peter Green songs. At this time, I also got Christine's Chicken Shack albums-2 studio albums & 2 live albums plus her Christine Perfect album(I've got 3 copies of that on vinyl & CD). I used the discography section here on this website and I got all of this stuff online, mostly eBay & Amazon. I even got all of the albums from 1970-1974 on vinyl, all on eBay. If it hadn't been for the internet, I probably wouldn't have gotten any of this stuff. I live in a small town and I just had no way of finding any of this stuff or even knowing that it existed.

[chiliD]

Originally posted by BklynBlue
1) ChiliD - Were you able to find the Blue Horizon LPs, FM's or other BH artists (Chicken Shack, Duster Bennett, Dave Kelly etc.)during the years the label was active?

I remember seeing both the first album AND English Rose in a store, but didn't have the $$ to buy them at the time...but, by the time I DID, they were out of print. HOWEVER, CBS had released them as their double-LP set Black Magic Woman. I later went back & got the original US albums (AND the original UK Mr Wonderful & Pious Bird Of Good Omen), all at the same time when I found them in a used record store a few years later. Additionally, I found one Duster Bennett album on BH the same time.

[HomerMcvie]

For me, I was SO into FM around the Tusk tour, that I traced the FM discography in the Tusk Tour book, wanting anything with Chris on it. Luckily, I started with Mystery To Me, which is still my favorite album.

[chiliD]

Originally posted by greenfire
... and Danny's "Dragon Fly". I remember reading in that box set, Peter Green's comment that "Dragon Fly" was his favorite Danny Kirwan song. I'm sure you've seen that comment if you read the booklet within your box. There is another Jermey Spencer song which I think was released on the b-side, can't remember which, maybe I heard it was "Dragon Fly", but it's called "The Purple Dancer".

Yep, "Purple Dancer" was the B-side to "Dragonfly". Although, it is CO-written by Danny & Jeremy. Plus, Christine plays keyboards and sings, too. It's obvious who wrote which part as they share lead vocals on the song, too...they each sing their own written part (like back in the early days of the Beatles when the lead vocal would shift from John to Paul or vice versa). It is really the "missing" link song between the sound that was Kiln House and the sound that became Future Games...it has various parts that are very reminicent of "Station Man", "Dragonfly", "One Together" & "Morning Rain".

[greenfire]

In the Penguin Fleetwood Mac discography, under other albums, I noticed the Reprise - The Best of Fleetwood Mac LP. It's on page 3 and is album #140. This appears to be the only full length album with The Purple Dancer. It looks like a great selection of songs, but unfortunately as John pointed out in his review, Searching For Madge is edited down to five minutes and then just abruptly ending it. It looks like an interesting set of songs!

Oh Well
Dragonfly
Rattlesnake Shake
World In Harmony
The Green Manalishi
Searching For Madge [instrumental]
Before The Beginning
The Purple Dancer
Fighting For Madge [instrumental]
Coming Your Way

Let's hope for a cd re-issue someday with the unedited version of Searching For Madge!

[chiliD]

That Best Of Fleetwood Mac LP was released in Germany only.

If you want an unedited "Searching For Madge" get the Vaudeville Years, Volume 1 set. It has the entire 16+ minutes under the title "The Madge Sessions". Also, has the full 16+ minute version of "Underway" (of which only the first 2 or 3 minutes comprises what was released on Then Play On)

[sharksfan2000]

I returned it, (there was a skip in "Jumping At Shadows") but over time, I found myself thinking a about the tracks on there that I really did like, and now I wanted them!

BklynBlue, you mentioned the skip in "Jumping at Shadows" on the Live at the BBC double CD - as far as I know this skip is on the master recording since it appears on every CD I've heard with that particular track. Too bad about the skip, but I still love this version of "Jumping at Shadows" - it's so different from any of the other live versions out there.

[BklynBlue]

When I did repurchase the CD, the skip was no longer on there. Now I do have a bootleg, which has some other, unreleased BBC tracks, with "Jumping At Shadows" and yes, the skip is still there!
Not sure what they did, or if Castle got a "cleaner" master for subsequent repressings -
I agree, that's one of the best versions of one of my favorite recordings with Green -
The version from the Boston Tea Party stand (not released on the three CDs) that appears on both the Castle "Jumping At Shadows" and the second disc of Reciever's "Show-Biz Blues" is also highly recommended

[sharksfan2000]

Wow, that's really interesting. I have the original import Live at the BBC CDs - is your "clean" version of Jumping at Shadows on the more recent US release? I'd repurchase it just to get that.

I agree, all of the live versions of Jumping at Shadows are terrific, some of Peter's best work. Other live favorites are All Over Again (Got a Mind to Give Up Living), Worried Dream, and of course the epic Rattlesnake Shake / Madge / Underway medleys.

I'm new to the forum here, and since I didn't answer your original question...
My first exposure to Fleetwood Mac was my freshman year in college in fall '75. My dorm roommate was a fan and he had most of their US-released records up to that point. Songs from Heroes are Hard to Find were still on the local FM radio station (Silver Heels was getting a fair amount of airplay), so the Bob Welch version of the band was the first one I was really familiar with.

As I started listening to my roommates records, I was blown away by the guitar playing on Then Play On. I recall that it took a little while for the songs themselves to sink in - they were pretty different from Bob Welch era Mac, or anything else on the radio for that matter. From that point, I was hooked on Peter Green. I've never really gotten into the Buckingham-Nicks Mac - although I enjoy some of it, their style of music is just not my favorite, although there's no denying they were very good at it.

Although I've looked at the Penguin website in the past for its great discography and I've checked out some of the Q&A sessions, I've just recently looked at the Ledge forums, mainly because I'd heard that the latest info on Peter's split from the Splinter Group could be found here. Although I'm not as big a fan of his Splinter Group work as I am of his Mac days, I hope that he continues to make music, and obviously I hope his health is ok.