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  #1  
Old 09-19-2018, 10:59 AM
jbrownsjr jbrownsjr is online now
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Default The Chain (Who Wrote What)

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/m...t-know-121876/
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  #2  
Old 09-19-2018, 07:44 PM
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Well that seems to prove that the contribution ratios I suggested in a recent thread were in the right ballpark. And even 'The Chain' as a title might not have been written by Stevie after all.
The Chain -- yet another brilliant Christine and Lindsey collaboration!

Re Silver Springs
Quote:
Buckingham finally broke the news when it was time to record the vocals.
This is surely a journalistic error--not only is the story always that Mick is the one who took her into the parking lot to tell her, but it seems like asking for trouble for Lindsey to be the one to tell her.
I've always wondered though--why on earth did she need to be told in the carpark? Just how violent did she get with those tambourines in the studio confines?
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Old 09-20-2018, 12:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DownOnRodeo View Post
Well that seems to prove that the contribution ratios I suggested in a recent thread were in the right ballpark. And even 'The Chain' as a title might not have been written by Stevie after all.
The Chain -- yet another brilliant Christine and Lindsey collaboration!

Re Silver Springs

This is surely a journalistic error--not only is the story always that Mick is the one who took her into the parking lot to tell her, but it seems like asking for trouble for Lindsey to be the one to tell her.
I've always wondered though--why on earth did she need to be told in the carpark? Just how violent did she get with those tambourines in the studio confines?

Does it? Sorry- I still cant agree.

I recall there is a sizable thread about this subject somewhere.
If you haven't watched this Youtube clip- its worth a view;
How Fleetwood Mac Wrote The Chain
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RqTARzw7j_w
(Its best to skip the first 2 minutes)

Also, I'd suggest it well worth listening to Stevie's original composition;
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YNHbe0Q9UfI
-I have no reason to believe this is anything other than a full Stevie composition as a demo (as opposed to her singing a mish-mash of hers and Lindsey's lyrics).
Clearly the bare bones of the actual song are Stevie's.
Clearly the original foundations and feel are set by the original Christine track.
Obviously John contributed the killer iconic bassline.
Lindsey played around, added bits, cut bits and put all the individual bits together.
Clearly Mick....er...drummed
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  #4  
Old 09-20-2018, 01:00 PM
jbrownsjr jbrownsjr is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DownOnRodeo View Post
Well that seems to prove that the contribution ratios I suggested in a recent thread were in the right ballpark. And even 'The Chain' as a title might not have been written by Stevie after all.
The Chain -- yet another brilliant Christine and Lindsey collaboration!

Re Silver Springs

This is surely a journalistic error--not only is the story always that Mick is the one who took her into the parking lot to tell her, but it seems like asking for trouble for Lindsey to be the one to tell her.
I've always wondered though--why on earth did she need to be told in the carpark? Just how violent did she get with those tambourines in the studio confines?
You know, when reading Ken and Carol's books. I always thought $he put up with a lot of **** and didn't lose her cool as often as LB.

I know they would scream at each other on mic. And $he got bent out of shape over Everywhere. But really, $he didn't seem to be the diva $he is now.
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Last edited by jbrownsjr : 09-20-2018 at 01:10 PM.
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  #5  
Old 09-20-2018, 07:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DownOnRodeo View Post
Well that seems to prove that the contribution ratios I suggested in a recent thread were in the right ballpark.
Does it? I seem to your estimation was 10% SN. But the article says, “The lyrics would be the final link. “Originally we had no words to it,” Fleetwood later told Lucky 98 FM radio. “And it really only became a song when Stevie wrote some.“
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Old 09-20-2018, 07:39 PM
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Default Lindsey's song

Did we read the same article?
All that Stevie definitely contributed was the chorus lyrics (note: just the words, not the melody).

There's a studio session recording that used to be floating around, about 5 minutes long, with Lindsey introducing the guitar and verse lyrics to the other members, and they gradually join him on harmonies. The song literally builds up over the course of the 5 minutes. I couldn't find it on YouTube now. Can anyone make it available?


Intro music-LB
Verse music-LB
Verse lyrics-LB

Listen to the wind blow
Watch the sun rise
Run in the shadows
Damn your love, damn your lies

[Chorus music-CM]
[Chorus lyrics-SN]
And if, you don't love me now
You will never love me again
I can still hear you saying
You would never break the chain (Never break the chain)

x 2
Listen to the wind blow
Down comes the night
Run in the shadows
Damn your love, damn your lies
Break the silence,
Damn the dark, damn the light

And if, you don't love me now
You will never love me again
I can still hear you saying
You would never break the chain (Never break the chain)
x 3

[Bass solo-JM]
Outro solo-LB

Chain keep us together (running in the shadows)

Thanks a lot for making me listen yet again to Stevie's rambling demo track, which sounds nothing like The Chain.

But in a world where a track consists solely of its lyrics, then sure--let's give Stevie a 40-50% contribution.
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Old 09-20-2018, 08:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bombaysaffires View Post
according to Stevie, in an interview done around that time, they didn't have lyrics. Lindsey knew her song and, in her words, asked if they could use part of it. She said to him "you're ripping the chorus out". She said, "he didn't care that much". So they put her chorus into the song, but still didn't have verses. Ultimately Lindsey wrote the verses, the "listen to the wind blow"etc. then it blended into her chorus "And if you don't love me now...." and then into John's bass and the whole ending which was grafted on straight from Christine's song.
From this 2017 thread: http://ledge.fleetwoodmac.net/showth...80#post1210680
(Not sure if it's the one that FuzzzyPlum is referring to.)
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Old 09-20-2018, 08:58 PM
jbrownsjr jbrownsjr is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DownOnRodeo View Post
Did we read the same article?
All that Stevie definitely contributed was the chorus lyrics (note: just the words, not the melody).

There's a studio session recording that used to be floating around, about 5 minutes long, with Lindsey introducing the guitar and verse lyrics to the other members, and they gradually join him on harmonies. The song literally builds up over the course of the 5 minutes. I couldn't find it on YouTube now. Can anyone make it available?


Intro music-LB
Verse music-LB
Verse lyrics-LB

Listen to the wind blow
Watch the sun rise
Run in the shadows
Damn your love, damn your lies

[Chorus music-CM]
[Chorus lyrics-SN]
And if, you don't love me now
You will never love me again
I can still hear you saying
You would never break the chain (Never break the chain)

x 2
Listen to the wind blow
Down comes the night
Run in the shadows
Damn your love, damn your lies
Break the silence,
Damn the dark, damn the light

And if, you don't love me now
You will never love me again
I can still hear you saying
You would never break the chain (Never break the chain)
x 3

[Bass solo-JM]
Outro solo-LB

Chain keep us together (running in the shadows)

Thanks a lot for making me listen yet again to Stevie's rambling demo track, which sounds nothing like The Chain.

But in a world where a track consists solely of its lyrics, then sure--let's give Stevie a 40-50% contribution.
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  #9  
Old 09-20-2018, 09:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DownOnRodeo View Post
Did we read the same article?
All that Stevie definitely contributed was the chorus lyrics (note: just the words, not the melody).

There's a studio session recording that used to be floating around, about 5 minutes long, with Lindsey introducing the guitar and verse lyrics to the other members, and they gradually join him on harmonies. The song literally builds up over the course of the 5 minutes. I couldn't find it on YouTube now. Can anyone make it available?


Intro music-LB
Verse music-LB
Verse lyrics-LB

Listen to the wind blow
Watch the sun rise
Run in the shadows
Damn your love, damn your lies

[Chorus music-CM]
[Chorus lyrics-SN]
And if, you don't love me now
You will never love me again
I can still hear you saying
You would never break the chain (Never break the chain)

x 2
Listen to the wind blow
Down comes the night
Run in the shadows
Damn your love, damn your lies
Break the silence,
Damn the dark, damn the light

And if, you don't love me now
You will never love me again
I can still hear you saying
You would never break the chain (Never break the chain)
x 3

[Bass solo-JM]
Outro solo-LB

Chain keep us together (running in the shadows)

Thanks a lot for making me listen yet again to Stevie's rambling demo track, which sounds nothing like The Chain.

But in a world where a track consists solely of its lyrics, then sure--let's give Stevie a 40-50% contribution.
is right.

There’s an interview that you can search for (and it would appear that you’re inclined to do so) where SN says that LB’s contribution to the lyrics was “listen to the wind blow.” Just those five words - not “listen to the wind blow,” and then the rest of the verses...literally, just, “listen to the wind blow.” Hard stop.

And I never said that a “track consists solely of its lyrics.” All I said was that...

“The lyrics would be the final link. “Originally we had no words to it,” Fleetwood later told Lucky 98 FM radio. “And it really only became a song when Stevie wrote some.”

...sounds to me like a little more than 10%. Just my interpretation though. Sometimes people hear what they want to hear.

I don’t know for certain who wrote or contribute what. I wasn’t there.
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Old 09-20-2018, 09:50 PM
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So Stevie and Christine wrote "damn your love, damn your lies"?

Quote:
a little more than 10%
I'm totally fine with "a little more than 10%"--by all means, suggest your own ballpark figures. Wait, what's that? You weren't present during the recording process and neither was I so we must only limit ourselves to what Stevie and Mick say? I see. My bad.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stevie Nicks Special with Denny Somack 1981
Stevie talks how Lindsey wrote "Listen to the wind blow" on "The Chain" and she wrote "if you don't love me now, you will never love me again" for another song.
(I found this. Don't know if it's the article that you referred to, and which I am apparently inclined to search for but you apparently are not..?)

In the context of what we know, here she is clearly saying that Lindsey wrote the verse and he took the words for the chorus from her other demo. While I gather that in your literalistic way of thinking there isn't much room for the likes of metonymy(--> edit: synecdoche), I think you'll find that by quoting the first lines of the verse and chorus, respectively, she is referring to the whole verses and chorus.
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Last edited by DownOnRodeo : 09-20-2018 at 09:53 PM.
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Old 09-21-2018, 11:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DownOnRodeo View Post
All that Stevie definitely contributed was the chorus lyrics (note: just the words, not the melody).
Isn't the chorus melody on Stevie's demo essentially the same as the chorus melody on the finished version of "The Chain"?
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Old 09-21-2018, 11:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kyle View Post
Isn't the chorus melody on Stevie's demo essentially the same as the chorus melody on the finished version of "The Chain"?
It's very similar. I think we can give her most of the credit for the chorus.

It appears to me, based on all of this, that Lindsey did indeed write the verses, though. Joe makes a good point about the cussing and aggression of the verses. Not very Stevie / Christine. I'm not saying they'd never curse, but to make it a central part of the lyric, repeated again and again? No, I don't see that as their style.

Of course, length-wise, the verses are quite short; I'd say if you give LB the verses and SN the chorus, you've got 50/50 lyrically. Musically, the percentage is more lopsided even with the chorus, but I do think the chorus is largely hers.
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Last edited by sodascouts : 09-21-2018 at 11:38 AM.
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Old 09-21-2018, 12:01 PM
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The most iconic part of the song is the bass solo, so I'll give John McVie the lion's share of the credit for creating this great song.
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Old 09-21-2018, 12:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sodascouts View Post
It's very similar. I think we can give her most of the credit for the chorus.

It appears to me, based on all of this, that Lindsey did indeed write the verses, though. Joe makes a good point about the cussing and aggression of the verses. Not very Stevie / Christine. I'm not saying they'd never curse, but to make it a central part of the lyric, repeated again and again? No, I don't see that as their style.

Of course, length-wise, the verses are quite short; I'd say if you give LB the verses and SN the chorus, you've got 50/50 lyrically. Musically, the percentage is more lopsided even with the chorus, but I do think the chorus is largely hers.
I don't think there is any doubt that Lindsey wrote the verses. I don't remember hearing anyone else claim to have written any of those words.
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Old 09-21-2018, 01:13 PM
jbrownsjr jbrownsjr is online now
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So basically, Christine wrote most of it.
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