SN: Schedule Horrific; Nearly Killed Them All

[DeeGeMe]

Originally Posted by Nico

Hejira, please don't think I'm trying to argue with you at all because you are totally entitled to your own opinion. You certainly don't have to like Bruce Springsteen, but some of the generalizations you are making I just can't agree with. Firstly, he has always made a concerted effort to keep his ticket prices lower than what would be expected for the show he puts on. I know for a fact that at some venues he has even bought out sections himself so that fans could get seats at lower prices, and he has been very vocal about scalpers and ticket vendors who scam people during online sales. He plays a very active role in all of that, and that kind of attention means something to his fans.

Also, I'm not sure we can say BS "dons blue collar drag" just to impress his "blue collar" image on everyone. How do we know how he dresses on his down time? Maybe he just likes wearing jeans and flannel shirts. It makes no difference because I'm sure most of his fans are there for the music, which is amazing. And the show, which is possibly the BEST live show I have ever seen in my life.

Call him a hypocrite or hate him as you wish, but no one can deny that Bruce Springsteen delivers in concert. And he plays straight through for hours, with enough energy and stamina as Mr. Buckingham himself. I, like you, never cared for Bruce for years...my dad was always pushing him on me, but I hated BITUSA and I didn't want to know. Until I saw him live. And heard the Rising. And now I'm in love.

OH yeah, Bruce is a blue-collar guy all the way. What with his rolling estate in Rumson, NJ, and the "second" house in Beverly Hills: he "gets" the struggles that us working stiffs have to go through on a daily basis. You know, like buying a $850,000 horse for our kids. http://www.celebitchy.com/6461/bruce..._850000_horse/

[LukeA]

Originally Posted by DeeGeMe

OH yeah, Bruce is a blue-collar guy all the way. What with his rolling estate in Rumson, NJ, and the "second" house in Beverly Hills: he "gets" the struggles that us working stiffs have to go through on a daily basis. You know, like buying a $850,000 horse for our kids. http://www.celebitchy.com/6461/bruce..._850000_horse/

So, you're saying that since Bruce has had a successful career, its impossible or intellectually dishonest for him to insinuate he has empathy for the common man?

Example. At every one of his shows for many years now, he goes out of his way to name-check and promote the local foodbank, giving prime real estate in the venue's concourse to the food bank for concert-goers to donate. You may believe this is all just to maintain his carefully cultivated image as a common man. The bottom line is that it makes a huge impact on cities across this country (especially now)- and he didn't/doesn't have to do it. The vast majority don't.

[Nico]

Originally Posted by DeeGeMe

OH yeah, Bruce is a blue-collar guy all the way. What with his rolling estate in Rumson, NJ, and the "second" house in Beverly Hills: he "gets" the struggles that us working stiffs have to go through on a daily basis. You know, like buying a $850,000 horse for our kids. http://www.celebitchy.com/6461/bruce..._850000_horse/

You are missing the point of what I am trying to say. Sure, Bruce Springsteen is going to have his houses and other luxuries. I am sorry but the man is stinking rich and it is expected. What shocks me here is that you and others are making it an issue- did you think the man was living in a small cottage somewhere in the wooded area of some forgotten town? I mean, really.

The point is that Bruce is a man who, although being wealthy and having a great deal of success, has not made a show of that in the way that he treats other people- especially his fans. In this way, he is humble. Humbleness is not a condition, it is a trait. Someone can be richer than Midas but know how to treat other people who many would label "lesser" due to economics, education, etc. However, a person could also have very little material wealth and still be condescending, uptight, a jerk.

You can go ahead and make a dated list of all of his purchases and items and this will not move me. I can see from witnessing the passion and love he puts into his performances, and the way he speaks, that he isn't someone who is putting on a front. I understand that some of you may be trying to argue a point about Stevie's excessive lifestyle and decadence...but let me remind you that I was never the one to critique that quality in her. It adds to her persona and, frankly, I am sure she's a nice lady. All I am saying is that to generalize someone who has money as not being "in touch" with others isn't right either.

My father is my greatest example. He came from a very poor, working-class family and worked hard for the successes he achieved in life. Never once did he make a show of it, although we had always been comfortable and had everything we needed. Whenever anyone needs anything, or if he can add any civic duty to his community or the world, my father is one of the first to stand up. He is a wealthy man with humble origins yet he never let any of that get to his head. So in some ways, I could totally make out lists of the things he has purchased and vacations he has taken my mother on, but it's pointless because I know what a great, generous, and humble person he is. Money does not account for that, it's just who he is.

[steviefan59]

holy crap...this board has turned negativity into a credo...i'm on several boards and i have to say that if u dont like stevie thats fine but there are a lot of us who love her...ur all entitled to ur own opinions but sometimes ur opinions are just plain nasty...stevie nicks is fleetwood mac...lindsey buckingham is fleetwood mac...they've tried it with other members and it just didnt work...stevie has contributed some of the biggest hits to fleetwood mac...i know as a 62 year old woman that i am i have a bitch of a time some days doing the necessary things to make a household run...i can't fathom how stevie does what she does without using drugs or booze to prop herself up...u guys should be greatful that she and lindsey are able to get up there night after night and try to put on the best show they can...some days are harder and God forbid she should say anything or complain bc yall jump down her throat for every little fukking thing she says...all this crap makes me down right pissed...who are u going to complain about when stevies gone? have u ever heard the phrase "if u can't say something nice about someone don't say anything at all"? if u dont like her u'll never understand why so many of us do but please try to give her credit and not squash the part she's played in making this a band that is still popular 35 years after they joined...pat

[golddustdrummer]

I had read through this thread before I went to see them in STL. I was totally prepared to see her act tired or half-awake...but to be honest, she kicked A$$! she moved around and held her notes longer than I had previously seen in other shows on youtube from this tour. She didn't seem out of it at all. I was thoroughly impressed!! Of course Lindsey stole the show, running all over the stage and acting like a complete wildman! but thats never really been Stevie's thing. She twirls and dances around with her tambourine...same as she always has. Just a little slower.

and like someone already said...the "almost killed them all" quote could have been (and probably was) taken out of context. It was probably a joke.

[starshine]

I wasn't gonna say anymore in regards to Stevie or Mac about this thread. But......well.....I do have some feelings though. Personally, I think its sad when all of us here cannot just be aloud to 'express' our personal opinions without being blasted....for not being 'a true fan' ......heck really we all I'm sure have different definitions of what a true fan is. I also believe that it is healthy to be able to express those views amoung those people that do share those same interests. I also don't think others should be degraded or labeled not a fan because they express dislike because of something Stevie or the other members of Fmac have said or done. Personally , yes there is alot of what at least Stevie says now that I don't like much. I won't say its because of this or that. Honestly, I don't know why she says what she says. To just make some statement or make waves?? I do think being in the public eye that there is some responsiblity that does go with that whether any public figure has asked for it or not. Whether said figure acknowledges that or not.....(I'm not singling Stevie out here...I stated 'any' public figure)....Some people don't like the 'negative' vibe here. I don't see it all around just in the more important topics that mean something to all of us. Some state 'if you have nothing nice to say than don't say anything'.....well personally again this applies to public figures. 'If' someone doesn't understand the ramifications or the comments that they say in say interviews & such well than those public figures should also refrain from making such comments as well.(esp if they don't know what they are talking about ) Than yet ....we are fortunate that we(live in a country)that we can state how we feel and that we can express those said feelings.
I do not think that Stevie or Mac as some 'god' that is worth such praise....that 'they' do no wrong....that they are the end all be all of everything in music etc. I guess I'm in awe that some fans seem to feel this way. That we should all be happy that they are alive & still doing it. Well for there sakes 'yes' I am happy that they are doing 'it' whatever 'it' is for them. I for many reasons (the economy etc) don't feel the need to see them this yr or again 'live' same for Stevie......I think most of the ticket prices are outragous now. Yes probably most all music acts are out to make the 'buck' nowadays really.....lets not kid ourselves....but that doesn't mean I have to really contribute to that....but thats how I feel.....everyone is entitled to there own feelings....thats ok with me.
I just think we all need to let it go......it is what it is....life goes on no matter what....I may not agree with your comments about Stevie/Mac and you may not agree with me but you know you can have your opinion and I can have mine and let it be at that .....getting 'mad' at others isn't productive. Its really ok to agree to disagree and leave it at that......ok.......so lets all have a group hug or something........Have a really good and happy day everyone........Its all good really.......

[louielouie2000]

What I don't understand is why people keep hollering that the Ledge is so negative. I personally think it's simply balanced. We have some people that think Fleetwood Mac only sh!ts out platinum and diamonds, and others who think think it's time for them to throw in the tambourine (hehe). I think most people here lie somewhere in between the two. We're not brainwashed fans who think the band can do no wrong, but we're also not so jaded that we can't appreciate the good things too. To me, that shows the intelligence of the people here. Some boards are all about adulation. Honestly, where's the fun in that if we all agree? Wouldn't be very interesting to me. I for one LOVE a good debate. I like to play Devil's Advocate, say provocative things, and really see how people tick, what their thought processes are, and why. That's the purpose of these boards after all, isn't it? To throw around ideas, express opinions, etc.

The one constant we can say is this: when it comes to Stevie Nicks, people have very strong opinions of her, for better or worse, the past 35 years. Stevie is my absolute all time fav celebrity, vocalist, songwriter, and style icon, period. I adore the woman, no matter how nutty and annoying she can be. I do have to admit, her attitude and performances as of late have certainly muddied some of that for me. If Fleetwood Mac is going to charge $170+ for tickets (including fees) during a recession, they had better blow everyone's socks off. Stevie is phoning in her performances, refusing to interact with the audience or the rest of the band, and badmouthing the band, touring, and the record buying public every chance she gets. If she's gonna act this way, she should at least be touring behind some new music to offset those points some. But she's not. She just seems like she's cashing in on her loyal fanbase yet again, with a loaded gun up to her head. It's just unfortunate, because I think the rest of the band is more "on" than they've ever been, and happier than they've ever been. Stevie's dragging the show down, and for that, I cannot be grateful.

[sywlindseyfan]

umm I didn't want to get back into this. But Maybe it was my Tina Turner comment that also set off some people. I seriously don't think i need to do this....because this is a freakin forum online, but i feel as if there may be people on this ledge that now think I am not a stevie fan now becuase of my earlier post.


So I love Stevie nicks, she is amazing I love her. i am soo grateful. There are countless times when her music and concert DVDs just get me through the day.....which is eveyrday. and I am a guy, and I am in Love with Freakin Lindsey Buckingham and Fleetwood Mac to a point where it's obsessive....but the comment that I made I felt was healthy because no matter How obsessd I get I know it's not healthy so i have been working on being on the opposing side of being a fan as well. Stevie does kick anyones butt and i am in love with her. So there...no harm done

[DeeGeMe]

Originally Posted by Nico

You are missing the point of what I am trying to say. Sure, Bruce Springsteen is going to have his houses and other luxuries. I am sorry but the man is stinking rich and it is expected. What shocks me here is that you and others are making it an issue- did you think the man was living in a small cottage somewhere in the wooded area of some forgotten town? I mean, really.

The point is that Bruce is a man who, although being wealthy and having a great deal of success, has not made a show of that in the way that he treats other people- especially his fans. In this way, he is humble. Humbleness is not a condition, it is a trait. Someone can be richer than Midas but know how to treat other people who many would label "lesser" due to economics, education, etc. However, a person could also have very little material wealth and still be condescending, uptight, a jerk.

You can go ahead and make a dated list of all of his purchases and items and this will not move me. I can see from witnessing the passion and love he puts into his performances, and the way he speaks, that he isn't someone who is putting on a front. I understand that some of you may be trying to argue a point about Stevie's excessive lifestyle and decadence...but let me remind you that I was never the one to critique that quality in her. It adds to her persona and, frankly, I am sure she's a nice lady. All I am saying is that to generalize someone who has money as not being "in touch" with others isn't right either.

Wow, that's quite the pedestal you have ole' Bruce on. So he's done charity drives--so has Stevie. Neither of 'em still has a clue as to how much a loaf of bread costs. Rock stars don't: they are filthy rich and spoiled to death and that's the best of them. But from that post you made listing all of Bruce's virtues, it's very clear you've made him into some sort of living saint. He's not, he's human just like the rest of us except his bank account is many sizes larger and quite frankly, a good argument could be made that he's slipped a bit in his game over the past 10-15 years. Personally his later work sounds very repetitive to me and have for quite a while now. I know for a fact that the last time I saw him live he was no where near as he was when I first saw him on the Darkness on the Edge of Town tour. But I'm not going to spend my time on one of his fan boards bitching about it. I just don't buy his albums anymore (although I'll still go see a show).

Here's the thing: there's an inherent danger in building up idols so impossibly high. One day they fall from that pedestal because there is no way in hell that anyone could possibly live up to the expectations that some of their most ardent fans have for them. Obviously Stevie has disappointed some here and they have become quite angry and embittered about it for whatever reason. Perhaps the blame doesn't lie with her as much as it should with some of you--in other words, instead of trying to attack her constantly as some here are now doing, maybe some of all that energy could be more constructively spent trying to figure out just why you feel so cheated and angry? Or better yet, in pursuing another hobby or interest?

But from the length of this thread and some of the innane comments I've read, it's just really obvious that there are some people here who have some weird agenda where Stevie is concerned. I've always thought the Ledge was really well-balanced in their gentle kidding and humor about the band and its members. I always liked it because it wasn't a "We love them 100%, 24/7" kind of fan forum. But lately there seems to be a cetain faction that seems determined to end Stevie's career by bitching about her endlessly. I have a suggestion for you: don't go to the shows. Don't buy the albums or the DVD's and don't post on the board if you don't like the band anymore. Go find another band or artist to project your whatever on. For people who claim not to like her or the band anymore, some of you seem to spend an unhealthy chunk of time here making sure that the rest of us don't forget how you feel.

And before anyone pigeon-holes me as some kind of "Stevie is Perfect" fan, I've got years of posts here that will prove I've never held back criticisim when it was justified.

Beyond that, so big deal if Stevie has given a lackluster show or two here or there (and even that is highly subjective as some of you whining about a performance at some shows have been countered by those who thought she was great or by reviews that stated otherwise). I'll give you this comparison: some days I don't give 100% at work because I don't feel 100%. I'm not 20 anymore. I'm not even 30 anymore. And the older I get, the more of those non-100% days I have. It does not mean that I don't still love my job passionately. It just means that there are days when I am physically unable to be there as much as I'd like to be due to health issues. But then there are the days that I am able to give 1000% percent. Hopefully the two balance one another out. So far my employer certainly seems to think so anyway--LOL. I imagine any musician has those same kinds of days: good and bad.

Anyway, all that I know is that everytime I've been lucky enough to see her over the years she's seemed into what she was doing. No, she's not the 20-or 30-something whirling dervish she was back in the day but she's decades older now then she was then (and not drugged out of her mind either). And I've seen some shows that were better than others. I don't expect a band to sound the exact same evey single time I see them nor do I expect them to sound the same way they did 30 years ago. Some shows are better than others. Some are worse. That's just the way that it is. You pay your money and you takes your chances as the saying goes. I just don't go expecting super-human performance from them 100% of the time because they're human. And time moves on. I just wish a few of the most strident voices in this thread would move on too.

[Nico]

Originally Posted by DeeGeMe

Wow, that's quite the pedestal you have ole' Bruce on. So he's done charity drives--so has Stevie. Neither of 'em still has a clue as to how much a loaf of bread costs. Rock stars don't: they are filthy rich and spoiled to death and that's the best of them. But from that post you made listing all of Bruce's virtues, it's very clear you've made him into some sort of living saint. He's not, he's human just like the rest of us except his bank account is many sizes larger and quite frankly, a good argument could be made that he's slipped a bit in his game over the past 10-15 years. Personally his later work sounds very repetitive to me and have for quite a while now. I know for a fact that the last time I saw him live he was no where near as he was when I first saw him on the Darkness on the Edge of Town tour. But I'm not going to spend my time on one of his fan boards bitching about it. I just don't buy his albums anymore (although I'll still go see a show).

Here's the thing: there's an inherent danger in building up idols so impossibly high. One day they fall from that pedestal because there is no way in hell that anyone could possibly live up to the expectations that some of their most ardent fans have for them. Obviously Stevie has disappointed some here and they have become quite angry and embittered about it for whatever reason. Perhaps the blame doesn't lie with her as much as it should with some of you--in other words, instead of trying to attack her constantly as some here are now doing, maybe some of all that energy could be more constructively spent trying to figure out just why you feel so cheated and angry? Or better yet, in pursuing another hobby or interest?

But from the length of this thread and some of the innane comments I've read, it's just really obvious that there are some people here who have some weird agenda where Stevie is concerned. I've always thought the Ledge was really well-balanced in their gentle kidding and humor about the band and its members. I always liked it because it wasn't a "We love them 100%, 24/7" kind of fan forum. But lately there seems to be a cetain faction that seems determined to end Stevie's career by bitching about her endlessly. I have a suggestion for you: don't go to the shows. Don't buy the albums or the DVD's and don't post on the board if you don't like the band anymore. Go find another band or artist to project your whatever on. For people who claim not to like her or the band anymore, some of you seem to spend an unhealthy chunk of time here making sure that the rest of us don't forget how you feel.

And before anyone pigeon-holes me as some kind of "Stevie is Perfect" fan, I've got years of posts here that will prove I've never held back criticisim when it was justified.

Beyond that, so big deal if Stevie has given a lackluster show or two here or there (and even that is highly subjective as some of you whining about a performance at some shows have been countered by those who thought she was great or by reviews that stated otherwise). I'll give you this comparison: some days I don't give 100% at work because I don't feel 100%. I'm not 20 anymore. I'm not even 30 anymore. And the older I get, the more of those non-100% days I have. It does not mean that I don't still love my job passionately. It just means that there are days when I am physically unable to be there as much as I'd like to be due to health issues. But then there are the days that I am able to give 1000% percent. Hopefully the two balance one another out. So far my employer certainly seems to think so anyway--LOL. I imagine any musician has those same kinds of days: good and bad.

Anyway, all that I know is that everytime I've been lucky enough to see her over the years she's seemed into what she was doing. No, she's not the 20-or 30-something whirling dervish she was back in the day but she's decades older now then she was then (and not drugged out of her mind either). And I've seen some shows that were better than others. I don't expect a band to sound the exact same evey single time I see them nor do I expect them to sound the same way they did 30 years ago. Some shows are better than others. Some are worse. That's just the way that it is. You pay your money and you takes your chances as the saying goes. I just don't go expecting super-human performance from them 100% of the time because they're human. And time moves on. I just wish a few of the most strident voices in this thread would move on too.

Um, if this is directed all at me I'm very confused. I don't have Bruce Springsteen on a pedestal. I don't even idolize him. Rock stars, actors, etc. are just creative people who's art we enjoy. Which is what I was getting at. It was so important for you to clarify your agenda but you totally misinterpreted what I said and warped it into something entirely different. By all means believe what you want to. I'm really not trying to argue with you or anyone. I was simply stating my opinion of artists/musicians who sing about subjects that some people feel they shouldn't because they're being hypocritical. I was using Bruce as one example of many. Yes, I think he's a cool humble guy...but that is it.

To be quite honest DeeGeMe, the only person I would ever hold on a pedestal is my dad. I'm sorry if my opinions offended you and got you irked enough to write such a response to me, if it was directed only at me. I'm not even sure. But really, I'm so over this. Can we agree to disagree?

And re: this thread...I forgot what it was even about. I also want to clarify to everyone here that I like Stevie Nicks as well. I think she's great and always have. So I hope people aren't thinking that, because I raved about Tina or defended Bruce Springsteen's image, that I am some anti-Stevie, materialistic-hating, pedestal-placing Lindsey fan I just want to assure (even if you do not need it) that I have nothing but utmost respect for her talent and have always liked her. May not agree with things she does, says, or enjoy all of her solo music, but she is still a legend and absolutely a star. And she still rocks. So just in case any of this thread may have gotten twisted to appear that I was bashing her, I never did.

[Hawkeye]

Can I just say something thatnot one person has addressed. Stevie is absolutly. right about the schedule being intense. I was thinking that and was radalmost going to make a thread shortly before this article was posted. Just look at it. They played 5 shows in a one week period. The dates are way more crammed then the Say You Will Tour.

[mylittledemon]

Originally Posted by Hawkeye

Can I just say something thatnot one person has addressed. Stevie is absolutly. right about the schedule being intense. I was thinking that and was radalmost going to make a thread shortly before this article was posted. Just look at it. They played 5 shows in a one week period. The dates are way more crammed then the Say You Will Tour.

True true. That would be a busy week for a 20-something-year-old band.

[Steviefan49]

Originally Posted by Hawkeye

Can I just say something thatnot one person has addressed. Stevie is absolutly. right about the schedule being intense. I was thinking that and was radalmost going to make a thread shortly before this article was posted. Just look at it. They played 5 shows in a one week period. The dates are way more crammed then the Say You Will Tour.

Thank you! And thanks to all that have mentioned the fact that these people AREN'T in their friggen 30's anymore! It's hard enough just to travel from place to place and bounce back- and then go into a show every other night! I don't know how they do it! And RIGHT ON- to Steviefan59! I, too can't believe the negativity on this board- and it's SOOO embarrassing to know that it's SOOO noticable- it's being mentioned on the other boards! How embarrassing!

[Steviefan49]

Originally Posted by DeeGeMe

Wow, that's quite the pedestal you have ole' Bruce on. So he's done charity drives--so has Stevie. Neither of 'em still has a clue as to how much a loaf of bread costs. Rock stars don't: they are filthy rich and spoiled to death and that's the best of them. But from that post you made listing all of Bruce's virtues, it's very clear you've made him into some sort of living saint. He's not, he's human just like the rest of us except his bank account is many sizes larger and quite frankly, a good argument could be made that he's slipped a bit in his game over the past 10-15 years. Personally his later work sounds very repetitive to me and have for quite a while now. I know for a fact that the last time I saw him live he was no where near as he was when I first saw him on the Darkness on the Edge of Town tour. But I'm not going to spend my time on one of his fan boards bitching about it. I just don't buy his albums anymore (although I'll still go see a show).

Here's the thing: there's an inherent danger in building up idols so impossibly high. One day they fall from that pedestal because there is no way in hell that anyone could possibly live up to the expectations that some of their most ardent fans have for them. Obviously Stevie has disappointed some here and they have become quite angry and embittered about it for whatever reason. Perhaps the blame doesn't lie with her as much as it should with some of you--in other words, instead of trying to attack her constantly as some here are now doing, maybe some of all that energy could be more constructively spent trying to figure out just why you feel so cheated and angry? Or better yet, in pursuing another hobby or interest?

But from the length of this thread and some of the innane comments I've read, it's just really obvious that there are some people here who have some weird agenda where Stevie is concerned. I've always thought the Ledge was really well-balanced in their gentle kidding and humor about the band and its members. I always liked it because it wasn't a "We love them 100%, 24/7" kind of fan forum. But lately there seems to be a cetain faction that seems determined to end Stevie's career by bitching about her endlessly. I have a suggestion for you: don't go to the shows. Don't buy the albums or the DVD's and don't post on the board if you don't like the band anymore. Go find another band or artist to project your whatever on. For people who claim not to like her or the band anymore, some of you seem to spend an unhealthy chunk of time here making sure that the rest of us don't forget how you feel.

And before anyone pigeon-holes me as some kind of "Stevie is Perfect" fan, I've got years of posts here that will prove I've never held back criticisim when it was justified.

Beyond that, so big deal if Stevie has given a lackluster show or two here or there (and even that is highly subjective as some of you whining about a performance at some shows have been countered by those who thought she was great or by reviews that stated otherwise). I'll give you this comparison: some days I don't give 100% at work because I don't feel 100%. I'm not 20 anymore. I'm not even 30 anymore. And the older I get, the more of those non-100% days I have. It does not mean that I don't still love my job passionately. It just means that there are days when I am physically unable to be there as much as I'd like to be due to health issues. But then there are the days that I am able to give 1000% percent. Hopefully the two balance one another out. So far my employer certainly seems to think so anyway--LOL. I imagine any musician has those same kinds of days: good and bad.

Anyway, all that I know is that everytime I've been lucky enough to see her over the years she's seemed into what she was doing. No, she's not the 20-or 30-something whirling dervish she was back in the day but she's decades older now then she was then (and not drugged out of her mind either). And I've seen some shows that were better than others. I don't expect a band to sound the exact same evey single time I see them nor do I expect them to sound the same way they did 30 years ago. Some shows are better than others. Some are worse. That's just the way that it is. You pay your money and you takes your chances as the saying goes. I just don't go expecting super-human performance from them 100% of the time because they're human. And time moves on. I just wish a few of the most strident voices in this thread would move on too.

GREAT post, and thanks!! I can't agree more on everything you said here!

[louielouie2000]

Originally Posted by Steviefan49

I, too can't believe the negativity on this board- and it's SOOO embarrassing to know that it's SOOO noticable- it's being mentioned on the other boards! How embarrassing!

And I just can't wrap my mind around the logic that we're all supposed to always agree, and blindly love and accept all things Mac around here . I also can't understand why you're embarassed about a message board? I don't really think that message board activity has much to do with the person you are in your daily, REAL life. And if it's such an "embarassment" in your 'online life,' why waste time here? I'm not trying to be nasty at all, or suggest you go elsewhere (who am I to do that?). I'm just trying to understand your (and other similar people's) thought processes. Do you not want there to be healthy, intelligent discussion and debate about very real Mac topics? The things we discuss and debate are real, factual issues. Most people for this tour are complaining about Stevie's performance quality. Obviously that's highly subjective, but if people go to concerts, or watch vids on youtube, it's not blind speculation or unfounded rumor starting. We're just discussing tangible stuff, stuff that can physically be seen by ever last one of our eyes. It's not like I'm making up that Stevie probably has cottage cheese thighs, and that MUST be what's causing her perfomance slips! Or that her magical witchery and satanic cult following has clearly built up in her bloodstream over time, poisoning her performances .

I think at this point in the game, the closest thing we can compare the Mac/Stevie to are pro athletes. The thing is, when runners, basketball players, golfers, etc get to a point where they can no longer be physically competitive, then they get out of the professional game, period. They may transfer their careers into related arenas (being a commentator, doing the occasional charity sporting event, etc), but the point is, they throw in the towel professionally when it's time. Even their biggest fans will admit when that time has come. I just don't see how it's sacrilige if someone feels that Stevie has clearly slipped, and it might be time for her to consider moving on. Or, that if Stevie is so miserable in the Mac, then she might want to consider keeping it solo, or focus on her Rhiannoning . It's just an opinion, and opinions never hurt anybody... . Mind expansion, debate, and hearing opposite opinions certainly never hurt anybody either.