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  #91  
Old 04-02-2014, 06:46 AM
dansven dansven is offline
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Originally Posted by Wendy Welch View Post
What's the point, Jeremy. Do you even talk to Mick. Is he trying to get you back in the band.
Mick has been pushing the idea of an "Original Fleetwood Mac" reunion ever since Peter and Jeremy did their "comebacks" in the late 1990s and 2000s. There are several interviews that can confirm that.
http://www.k-hits.com/musicnews/story.aspx?ID=1186831
The thing is that Jeremy and/or Peter didn't want to do it.
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  #92  
Old 04-02-2014, 06:54 AM
THD THD is offline
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Originally Posted by Wendy Welch View Post
He (Mick) always got more money than the other members of the band from Clifford Davis/Adams, saying it was because he had children and they didn't. Have you forgotten that?
Could you elaborate on this please Wendy ?

Mick surely didn't get any songwriting royalties (unless some exceptionally democratic special arrangemet was made **)He surely wouldn't have got a higher percentage than the others from record sales ,as royalties from these would be split equally and if they werent it would be very dodgy So was it the money from touring ? And I would say ,that seeing as McVie and Fleetwood were not composers, they would have earned far less money than the other members of the band -the songwriters (unless ,as I said, some exceptional arrangement was made )and therefore may have had a valid case that they needed more money ?

** I read somewherr that Brian Epstien arranged for George Harrison and Ringo Starr to Split 5% of Lennon and McCarney's 40% when they made the original deal with Northern songs (just to be clear independent of Harrison's own songwriting)

Last edited by THD : 04-03-2014 at 12:51 PM. Reason: spolling
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  #93  
Old 04-02-2014, 07:24 AM
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[quote=THD;1124577]touring ? And I would say ,that seeing as McVie and Fleetwood were not composers, they would have earned far less money than the other members of the band -the songwriters (unless ,as I said, some exceptional arragement was made )and therefore may have had a valid case that they needed more money ?

I forgot to add :

As we now know from the many documentaries about rock bands of the last forty years (Eagles ,Spandeau Ballet etc ), many bands split or continue struggling on, but with the band members hating each other , once it dawns on the non composing members just how much money the writers are getting in as a result of composing the songs - money from airplays round the world in addition to the performing on record money If the song is covered by another artist** that artists airplay and record sales all over the world can generate huge sums -other band members don't get that and it can be the root of great resentment !

** Santana band's coverage of Black magic Woman would be a classic example of this -Peter getting huge amounts of money as the writer -feeling very guilty about it (for his own reasons ) McVie , Spencer and Fleetwood, getting none of it (the Santana generated money ) unless Peter decided to privately give them some share of it !(Which he may have done for all I know !) That's the recipe for the break up of the original line up of this band but it broke up for possibly the antithesis of this, and not until they had reached (in my opinion )A great artistic peak prior to Peter's quiting !

Last edited by THD : 04-03-2014 at 12:53 PM.
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  #94  
Old 04-02-2014, 07:07 PM
Wendy Welch Wendy Welch is offline
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Bands would be nothing without good songs. Even Stevie and other greats pay writers for some of the songs they sing and gladly. The songs make the band. If the band or an artist wants to write a song, then write. But don't expect to get paid for another's work, but as a matter of fact on Heroes and certain other FM songs the band did share in the publishing at one time. Surprise! Prior to that the manager owned 1/2 of all the songs from each writer and still does with Bob's early Mac songs today.

Last edited by Wendy Welch : 04-02-2014 at 07:31 PM.
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  #95  
Old 04-07-2014, 09:42 PM
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Default Bob Welch should be in RRHOF

Bob Welch, a former member of Fleetwood Mac who also had a solo career, died Thursday of a self-inflicted gunshot wound, police said. He was 65.

Officers were called to Mr. Welch's home on West Oak Highland Drive at 12:18 p.m. after the musician's wife discovered his body, Metro police spokesman Don Aaron said.

"He died from an apparent self-inflicted gunshot wound to the chest," Aaron said. "A suicide note was found in the residence."

Mr. Welch was a guitarist and vocalist for Fleetwood Mac from 1971 to 1974. He formed the British rock group Paris in 1976 and had hits including Sentimental Lady in 1977 and Ebony Eyes in 1978. Fleetwood Mac's Christine McVie and Lindsey Buckingham did backing vocals on Sentimental Lady.

According to Aaron, family members told investigators that Mr. Welch had been dealing with health issues in recent months.

Family friend Bart Herbison, executive director of the National Songwriters Association, which includes the California Songwriters Association, the Nashville Songwriters Association International and the Texas Songwriters Association, said the musician had been through spinal surgery about three months ago.

"It had become apparent to Bob that he was not going to recover, that he was going to become an invalid," Herbison said. "He had seen his father become an invalid and watched his mother care for him for many years. In the letter he left, he told (his wife) Wendy, 'I'm not going to do this to you.' "

Herbison went on to say he'd never seen a couple more in love than Bob and Wendy Welch. He'd known them for about 15 years, he said.

"I've been privileged to meet a lot of famous musicians throughout the years," Herbison said. "Your fame and notoriety will take you to a lot of places where you have to go by yourself, but not Bob. He never went anywhere without Wendy."

Left band in 1970s

Fleetwood Mac's career took off in the mid-1970s after Mr. Welch left the band. "Dreams" was a No. 1 hit in 1977 and Don't Stop the same year. It later became the anthem for Bill Clinton's presidential campaign. "Hold Me" was a hit in 1982 and "Little Lies" in 1987.

Mr. Welch, a native of Los Angeles, scored his biggest hit with Sentimental Lady, which reached No. 8 on the Billboard chart. His other singles included Precious Love in 1979 and Hot Love, Cold World in 1978.

When Fleetwood Mac was inducted into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame in 1998, Mr. Welch was not included in the group.

"It basically comes down to the fact that they don't like me anymore," he told The Plain Dealer of Cleveland at the time. "I guess they can do what they want. I could understand it if I had been a sideman for a year. But I was an integral part of that band. I put more of myself into that band than anything else I've ever done."

Longtime Fleetwood Mac singer Stevie Nicks told The Associated Press that Mr. Welch's death hit her hard.

"The death of Bob Welch is devastating. I had many great times with him after Lindsey and I joined Fleetwood Mac. He was an amazing guitar player he was funny, sweet and he was smart. I am so very sorry for his family and for the family of Fleetwood Mac so, so sad. "

Founding member Mick Fleetwood did not immediately respond to emails for comment Thursday.

As a songwriter, Mr. Welch had his songs recorded by Kenny Rogers, Sammy Hagar, The Pointer Sisters and others.

In 1999 he released a CD, Bob Welch Looks at Bop, a salute to bebop music in the 1940s.

In an interview with The Tennessean in 2003, Mr. Welch said he never dreamed he'd be remembered for much.

"I just wanted to play guitar in a good band," he said. "I wanted to make the music I love. I wanted to travel the world and have adventures."

Mr. Welch also said "music is disposable now. It doesn't have the emotional impact anymore. That's sad."

He had lived in Nashville since the 1990s.
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  #96  
Old 04-08-2014, 12:03 AM
iamnotafraid iamnotafraid is offline
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An article from USA Today online might be of interest.

How The Rock Hall Decides Which Bandmates Get In
by Brian Mansfield. It's in the "Life" section of the website
www.usatoday.com .
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  #97  
Old 04-08-2014, 03:13 AM
michelej1 michelej1 is online now
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Originally Posted by iamnotafraid View Post
An article from USA Today online might be of interest.

.
[^That's interesting that they said they would change their handling of the announcement going forward because of the KISS controversy. I also read an article about the Rolling Stones manager Andrew Loog Oldham boycotting the ceremony. He was inducted, but he doesn't like the way they showcase the "stars" and then treat the contributions of others as if they aren't important at all. http://www.latimes.com/entertainment...axzz2yHQOQVhB]

Brian Mansfield, Special for USA TODAY 6:12 p.m. EDT April 7, 2014


http://www.usatoday.com/story/life/m...et-in/7210431/

Paul Stanley and Gene Simmons haven't hidden their displeasure that the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame chose not to induct Kiss' current members along with its original ones.

When Simmons told USA TODAY, "This organization decided to honor only a part of our history," he raised a question about how the hall decides which individuals to include when it ushers in a group.

Kiss will have its most famous faces inducted Simmons, Stanley, Ace Frehley and Peter Criss when the band joins the hall's ranks April 10 in a ceremony at Barclays Center in Brooklyn. But two who now wear the signature makeup (Eric Singer and Tommy Thayer), plus four other former members (drummer Eric Carr and guitarists Bruce Kulick, Vinnie Vincent and Mark St. John), won't get in.

EARLIER: Kiss feels dissed by the Rock Hall of Fame

Nirvana's former drummer Chad Channing, who played on 1988 single Love Buzz, the recording that made the group eligible for Rock Hall induction this year, will be left out, too.

Bruce Springsteen's E Street Band, on the other hand, will be welcomed in with a roster that encompasses early drummer Vini Lopez and keyboardist David Sancious, as well as its eight better-known members.

Groups get picked for induction for different reasons, says Rock and Roll Hall of Fame Foundation president and CEO Joel Peresman, which means the hall's nominating committee will use different standards when deciding which bandmates to include. "Sometimes, it's the overall body of work; sometimes, it's a specific period in time and the people who comprised the band that put them on the map and gave them that influence and created that legacy," he says.

Historically, the Rock Hall has tended to choose a band's "classic" lineup for induction. For groups like The Beatles or U2, the choice is fairly simple. For others, it's more complicated. Practically everyone who ever played with the Grateful Dead was included when the group went into the hall in 1994. Metallica and the Red Hot Chili Peppers also have relatively inclusive hall memberships. Other induction lineups like those for Lynyrd Skynyrd, The Temptations and Kiss left out members who sang or played with the group for many years.

"The only rule they have is that they make their own rule with each band," Stanley says.

Peresman acknowledges that the Rock Hall's nominating committee, which consists of about 40 music industry executives, musicians and journalists, handles each decision about group membership on a case-by-case basis, in consultation with outside scholars.

"It's a little bit of opinion, but you have to go with the opinion of people who know these genres of music and can form a truly educated opinion," he says.

"The inconsistencies are there, and the hall has to live with them," says Neil Walls, who runs the Future Rock Legends website, which tracks artists' eligibility for the Rock Hall and determines their chances of induction."This is only going to come up again in the future," he says, pointing to Pearl Jam, which will be eligible for 2017 induction and is on its fifth, and longest-tenured, drummer. "They've got exceptions they've already put in, like the Chili Peppers, which will come back to haunt them."

The hall plans to change the way it announces group nominations as a result of the uproar over the Kiss exclusions, which led to the group refusing to play at the induction ceremony, and the confusion over Channing's, which Peresman says he learned of from a secondhand text message from Nirvana's management.

"Going forward, we'll be more clear-cut from the beginning and more public about who's being inducted," Peresman says. "(The next time) we announce the nominees, we'll make sure to say, 'Here are the people being nominated.' "

Contributing: Edna Gundersen
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  #98  
Old 04-08-2014, 07:50 AM
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I'm not sure why it affects the RRHOF whether they induct just a classic lineup or whether they induct a whole band. I can't see the logic. In FM's case the founding bassist was excluded, two long serving vocalist/guitarists in Welch and Burnette, and five others just didn't fit in with whatever criteria they judged the band against. Personally I think they should have all been in. You are a member of a band, you are in.
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  #99  
Old 04-08-2014, 12:48 PM
michelej1 michelej1 is online now
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Originally Posted by chriskisn View Post
I'm not sure why it affects the RRHOF whether they induct just a classic lineup or whether they induct a whole band. I can't see the logic. In FM's case the founding bassist was excluded, two long serving vocalist/guitarists in Welch and Burnette, and five others just didn't fit in with whatever criteria they judged the band against. Personally I think they should have all been in. You are a member of a band, you are in.
Maybe the RRHOF tries to control who is present at the ceremony by who they induct. As Oldham pointed out, the ceremony is about television and publicity, not about music and rock and roll. Maybe the RRHOF only wants to induct people that will give their ceremony the most mass appeal.

Michele
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  #100  
Old 04-08-2014, 06:00 PM
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Originally Posted by chriskisn View Post
I'm not sure why it affects the RRHOF whether they induct just a classic lineup or whether they induct a whole band. I can't see the logic. In FM's case the founding bassist was excluded, two long serving vocalist/guitarists in Welch and Burnette, and five others just didn't fit in with whatever criteria they judged the band against. Personally I think they should have all been in. You are a member of a band, you are in.
Only in the most technical sense could John McVie not be considered a founding member. By all accounts, Brunning's hiring was purely temporary, and everyone knew it. Even if all the other members of FM, including Walker and Mason, were inducted, I still would not have included Brunning.

If you include Brunning, then you have to include Nigel Watson, Doug Graves, and other temporary members.
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  #101  
Old 04-08-2014, 11:39 PM
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Originally Posted by aleuzzi View Post
O
If you include Brunning, then you have to include Nigel Watson, Doug Graves, and other temporary members.
It's a little different with Brunning, he may have only been a "placeholder" in retrospect, but at the time it really WASN'T a "given" that John would join. Glad he did, but it wasn't set in stone at the time.

Watson was there because Peter dragged him along. Doug Graves (as well as Bobby Hunt) was on par with current/recent touring additions like Neale Haywood, Carlos Rios & Brett Tuggle et.al, plus Stevie's "girls"....hired hands for tour purposes only. (and Steve Thoma, keyboardist during the '94/'95 tours) There wasn't any pretense of band "membership" at all in their hirings. Even the same could be said for Christine during the Kiln House album sessions & subsequent tour...I don't think she really was officially a member until after the tour & the Future Games sessions began.
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Last edited by chiliD : 04-08-2014 at 11:44 PM.
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  #102  
Old 04-08-2014, 11:42 PM
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Originally Posted by aleuzzi View Post
Only in the most technical sense could John McVie not be considered a founding member. By all accounts, Brunning's hiring was purely temporary, and everyone knew it. Even if all the other members of FM, including Walker and Mason, were inducted, I still would not have included Brunning.

If you include Brunning, then you have to include Nigel Watson, Doug Graves, and other temporary members.
We are never going to agree on this issue sadly Brunning was a member hired with the understanding that if and when McVie left Mayall that he was out the door. That issue could have gone on for 3 months or 3 years.

As for Doug Graves, well we've been over this ground in another thread. Was he a temporary member, was he (at least by his own understanding) a permanent one.

Watson was hired solo for the tour (hell he wasn't even hired he kind of just tagged along with Peter)
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  #103  
Old 04-09-2014, 02:56 PM
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Originally Posted by chriskisn View Post
We are never going to agree on this issue sadly Brunning was a member hired with the understanding that if and when McVie left Mayall that he was out the door. That issue could have gone on for 3 months or 3 years.

As for Doug Graves, well we've been over this ground in another thread. Was he a temporary member, was he (at least by his own understanding) a permanent one.

Watson was hired solo for the tour (hell he wasn't even hired he kind of just tagged along with Peter)
Question is was Brunning a member of the band OR was he a temporary employee of the band???
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  #104  
Old 04-09-2014, 03:03 PM
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Originally Posted by BlueDenimLamp View Post
Question is was Brunning a member of the band OR was he a temporary employee of the band???
Simplest question...if Brunning wasn't on stage at the Windsor Jazz Festival, who would've been Fleetwood Mac's bass player?

John McVie was still a member of the Bluesbreakers, so, yeah, Brunning was a member. It wasn't a given that McVie would ever leave Mayall.

Was Pete Best a member of the Beatles? Yes. Was he replaced? Yes. So, he was a temporary member. Yes.

Hell, were Peter Green, Jeremy Spencer, Danny Kirwan replaced? Yes. So, you can call them temporary members, too....but, while they WERE in the band, they were viewed as permanent members. End of argument. Next topic.
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  #105  
Old 04-09-2014, 04:48 PM
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This article made me think of the Fleetwood Mac RRHOF drama when I read it:

http://www.austin360.com/ap/ap/ohio/...iss-off/nfWfF/

Sounds like Bob Welch is far from the only one jilted/displeased with the RRHOF. I take the RRHOF about as seriously as I do the Grammy's... which is about the lowest insult I can sling. It might almost be a badge of honor that Bob isn't included in the dretch that is the RRHOF.
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