Quote:
Originally Posted by slipkid
You're related to him in some way, aren't you?
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lol no, no, trust me, I'm not. Short of perhaps in a "kindred spirits" way. Danny has always held a special soft spot for me, I suppose because he has forever been relegated to taking up ground in Green's shadow - and like Peter, had a rather sad demise. Pete's still a legend to a legion of fans. What's Danny got?
Also I was a pretty early fan of the band, yes back when most were saying "Fleetwood Who?" [and if you go back far enough you know this was not merely a humorous cliché once upon a time]. It wasn't always easy watching the band go thru its growing pains. I was as blown away as anyone else when they hit the stratosphere with Buckingham & Nicks, after watching Bob Welch throw in the towel. I also hated to see Bob Weston go, another great Mac axe. But when I first heard Over My Head all over the radio waves in late '75, I knew something big was in the air. Then came Rhiannon, and Say You Love Me, and the third wave was on!
"If you couldn't see or appreciate...tough"!?!? How many times do I have to say how great a songwriter Kirwan was?? I was only pointing out Kirwan's skills as a guitarist weren't on Green's level.
And I keep saying WRONG WRONG WRONG. Why ? Because 1) On the songwriting front, they had become near equals. Green's light shone a bit brighter mostly because his hand at it started earlier, and his style was more unconventional and gripping (again, like the Lennon to McCartney analogy I tried to draw, in a somewhat diminished way). But any way you look at it, Kirwan was quickly catching up. And 2) On the guitar playing front, Kirwan was neck and neck with Green in the end, though you refuse to have it.
Now I'm gonna let you in on a little secret here: the majority of those great licks you hear on Then Play On were Danny's, not Pete's. The only reason I give Green the "ace's nod" on that project is because he brought such soulful compositions to the table, his best ever (though he produced plenty of memorable stuff earlier). But as I keep stating, by that point it is really difficult to separate the two, in both arenas! It would have been interesting to think of what TPO 2 might have sounded like!
From what I've read (which I take as fact), Green's biggest problem was that he was sick of being a celebrity. The drugs only made it worse.
That was a big part of it for sure. Those mind-blowing drug indulgences were unfortunately making him increasingly neurotic. What you probably don't fully appreciate is that he was flipping the band out too. It was not a happy or harmonious unit by 1970, trust me. Those nutty robes he donned, the crucifix, the radical change of appearance, the mindless philanthropy he was pushing when the group wasn't even living luxurious lives as it was! He was turning off the world, and dropping out big time. In fact, as we came to see, to a point of no return. It was reminiscent of one * Jim Morrison* roughly a year later!
How much Peter was a victim of others (the doping incident), or himself and his heady appetite for riding high, or the world at large as it was then framed in his mind, is anyone's guess. But please remember, it was he who went south by 1970, and not Danny. All he left Danny and the others was basically high and dry - a flock without it's shepherd.
I can see your point if Green left FM, and became a successful solo artist (ala Clapton), but that wasn't the case. Danny Kirwan didn't drive Peter Green into a life of menial jobs, and mental institutions.
Well you're losing me here now. I have never stated or implied Danny drove Peter over the edge if that's what you mean. Not in any way. But did Kirwan represent one more "threat" of sorts to Green's increasingly insecure world? Yes, in the end anyway. He could see his young colleague rising to the occasion where he was beginning to stall and falter, and before long, irreparably so. And yet paradoxically, he was pretty much at the height of his artistic powers when the self-destruction set in! Reality was slipping from his grasp rapidly, and I'm sure he knew it, or at least sensed it. With it went his cutting edge prowess, and the requisite energy to drive himself forward.
You said it, this started with your post about a blog on Peter Green, complaining that Danny Kirwan didn't get enough credit.
Which he still doesn't, neither for TPO, nor from a total FM perspective. *Except* for those who know the more complete story.
Since you weren't going to point out Kirwan's shortcomings, someone needed to.
Please, I have never glossed over Danny's shortcomings with anything I've presented here. Go back and read what I wrote. Besides, the main thrust of this discussion has mostly been centered around PG, starting with that article presented by the OP. You're just more sensitive to anything I spell out regarding your guitar hero, one we both admire (and yes, I know you appreciate Kirwan too, but in a sort of deprecating, "in the shadow of Greenie" way. At least that's how I see it).
I don't need to be lectured about the sad end of this era, I think I know enough.
No lectures here. I'm just putting the cards on the table as non-selectively as I can, and filling in certain things you may not be familiar with. No one - not you, not me, not even Jeremy - can claim to know the whole story.
Now if Jeremy Spencer cares to correct me, I will take his word as gospel.
Well Jeremy could certainly answer a lot of questions, so could Bob Welch who is seen here at times. But let's keep in mind even Jeremy wasn't around that much during the TPO sessions -- IIRC he was off making his own solo project tapes. And of course Bob had yet to arrive on the scene, though I'm sure he heard lots of stories about the early period while he was a member of the band. John McVie would be great to hear from too, as he is always rather candid in his interviews when he does choose to speak out. Whether any of them would be willing to open up too much on this subject I can't say.
Aside from that, yes this has been a great discussion. You have brought life back to this board, I'll say that. 
You're good too, mostly cuz you fight back and don't mind sparring a bit. That's a compliment btw.
And yes you said it, from lazy, hazy, crazy SoCal.
Circling the wagons, just in case. Jb