John--

You seem to be taking the voting here *very* personally and you really shouldn't. We are just trying for a consensus of what those who are participating in this discussion would like to see and we'll use that for the wishlist. From reading your posts I get the impression that you feel you are really fighting for your choices and it represents what the majority of the petitioners want while the rest of us here simply don't have a clue. That is why we are having this poll-- to find out what the poll participants would like to see. I've made a very strong effort to let the petitioners know about the polling here and have mentioned it in at least 150 emails over the weekend alone.

I cannot extract the information you are suggesting (cutting up of live performances) from the petitions collected. It simply was not a question while the format (DVD versus VHS) was. Some people added comments while most have not. It is an optional field.

If you feel that you were hornswoggled into signing for a release that you wouldn't purchase because of how this voting is going, I'll certainly remove your name from the petition. Those that signed for the petition are stating that they would buy it if 10-12 videos were on it-- clearly we are shooting for quite a lot more and I don't think those that signed for it would have any regrets. It looks like they would get music videos as well as live performances in pristine conditions through the years. If there is one particular song out of thirty that someone is not happy with, they can always use the skip button on the remote.

As you are giving a lot of thought to the variations in List 1 that would go up for vote later in the week, please keep in mind that we don't want to make all of these substitutions from List 2. From reading the posts you made here, it looks like that is what you are arguing for and List 2 looks like it is being voted down in this first poll, no? Maybe one or two songs I guess but we are looking for the final vote to be between 2, and at most 3, different setlists (with one of them being list 1 as it is posted right now).

We really have to move forward on this and please just don't take it all so personally. I think everyone wants to have as much released as possible but we'll have to take it one step at a time. I'm still most concerned about getting *anything* released-- we still need 8,000 signatures you know!

And as John mentioned, this release is not by Warner Brothers-- it is being done by 5.1 Entertainment; they don't have the distribution capabilities that Warner Brothers has access to I'm assuming so that is why the release would happen here.

- Marty

Marty,

Admittedly, I've been upset at times doing some of these posts but I was honestly only (in the last couple posts anyways) attempting to refer to three possible replacements for the Dance clips (as there are three of them and from what Les said, this seems to be what is up for discussion on Tuesday & Wednesday) so I am by no means trying to "hold things up" I'm all for getting this going and I was trying to discuss those three items in order to get things going. I just had to backtrack a little there and cover all the bases in regards to "defending myself" (for lack of a better expression) when some people had decided that I was going to "freak out" if I didn't "get my way" and that's not what I meant. Naturally as I was under the understanding that I thought people wanted a "through the years" collection here, I thought "what better clips to replace Dance stuff (if that was voted as being the decision) with then the Green & Burnette things?" as these seem to be the few ones on the vault list that would touch on Pre & Post BN era Mac without overdoing it (or so I thought anyways as there is only one of each) and I did suggest having the brits "Go your own way" in place of the "Rosebud" version (since Rosebud is still represented on the existing list 1) because I do understand that the 1997 fans may feel a little snubbed if the dance stuff is replaced and I also said that if something was to stay on from The Dance then it should be "Silver springs" (for reasons stated in earlier post which I won't go into again) I don't mean to "reword" here but I just want to make it clear that I'm not saying there shouldn't be any BN by any means or anything. I'm not saying "my word is law" at all. I just find it very surprising that:

1. People seem (and if I'm wrong then I'll be the first to admit it when the vote proves me so) against the idea of having one singular song from the Post and Pre BN eras each (if we are suppossedly "compromising" as there are fans of those eras too)and...

2. That (given that this is going to be released solely on this site through Ken's people and there isn't "that" much of a need to impress the general public with what we think they want and what would sell to them) finally after all these years and wishing the vault stuff would be released and we can choose what we want on there, that the fans would rather (for the most part) ignore this footage now available to them and instead choose to put Dance stuff (let alone Tusk doc/Mirage tape stuff) on this disc.

but anyways, I guess I'll see when the final set list is decided on if I want my name taken off the list or not but as I stated earlier, I quickly signed up because it seemed a given that (under these circumstances) that we the fans would choose more "useful" footage than what it looks like it may end up being. I know list one has won (or will win as of a few hours from now) and I never said the replacements would have to come from list two. Once again (and as I told you in a private message) I'm for "any" footage being on there as long as it isn't on any of the previously commercially released, already owned (by most people), factory made, items unless they are in full (but it seems as though this option has been struck off very quickly). I'll certainly hang in there though and see what turns up on there. If I am so wrong about what I've said then everyone can "prove me wrong" in the voting. As you say, it's a democratic way to decide so we will see what people really want and given the circumstances I'll just be surprised if this is the chance all of us have waited for and instead we make a compilation of what we already have (when none of us have needed to wait for years to do that, if you've got two VCR's you can compile anything you want for free right now), that's all. As for the databases, I was purposely asking a "loaded question" in the sense that I KNOW that you can't extract data for reporting purposes when it comes to people using different phrases (i.e. "only want parts/pieces/(this song) from "Mirage" tape/video/In concert/HBO special" or "Tusk doc" etc.) as opposed to something more straightforward such as wanting to find out if people say anything about wanting "DVD" or "VHS" like you had done previously and as you say, since it is an optional field, many others could've very well thought what I had been expressing but chose not to add it so all of this database/reports stuff conveniently works against my theory as well. I myself wasn't sure what KIND of comments were to go in that field (as it had never been explained anywhere) so I left mine blank but if only I had known at the time what it might have meant... Anyways, Ken's company wants money and we want alot of good product. Let's not make it easy for them to "milk" all of the footage for every penny. I'll just be very surprised more than anything else if this is really what the majority of fans want to do. So we'll see what happens.

John

___________________________________________________

He really has a good point.
It makes the most since to get all we can off this Vaults list before they lock the Vaults up again....................for another 30 years.

John,

If I didn't know better whilst reading your posts in this thread, I'd be thinking that I was reading posts of my own (defending all the non-Buckingham Nicks incarnations) from a few years ago. (Right, Marty?) :nod:

Yes, I agree that its kind of flogging a dead horse to keep releasing the same stuff when there is other avenues to get that material. What intrigues me is the stuff that, other than this opportunity, will never see light of day (regardless of incarnation), to the public, to the fans, to really ANYBODY (even Warner Bros & possibly even the members of Fleetwood Mac themselves probably don't care about 'em).

But, if the "Run of the mill" what the majority of the people want in lieu of really VALUABLE footage, then so be it...like Marty posted, if we still need 8,000 people to sign up, then we're really in trouble. At this point, I'd just like to see that we CAN get 10,000 people to sign up this time, to get ANYTHING released...once THAT happens (IF it happens) we might be more selective (ok, I WAS going to say "nit-picky" :) next time around (IF there IS a "next time") :shrug:

[QUOTE]Originally posted by wetcamelfood
. . . three possible replacements for the Dance clips (as there are three of them and from what Les said, this seems to be what is up for discussion on Tuesday & Wednesday . . .

I don't think I indicated that those were the only clips for which replacements could be suggested. If I left that impression, I didn't mean to. Anyone is welcome to make suggestions for different songs or different performances for any of the segments in the current Option 1.

I just want folks to know that this second vote is to finalize content for the format selected in this first vote; it's not a time to suggest documentaries or something that didn't get a lot of vote support the first time around.

1. We WOULD be up for putting stuff from the vault list on the video, but we don't know what the quality of that stuff is or what it contains. Someone would really have to watch that to let us know and we don't have time for that. What if we ask for something from the vault and it turns out to be poor. :confused:

2. If Rick and Billy are to be represented, we would just recommend putting on something other than "In the Back of My Mind" because we don't think it really represents the best of that era. Is there another performace that can be put on the video. ;)

3. This is an argument for clips of shows like The Dance and Mirage...When we first saw FM's Behind the Music and that clip from the Mirage video of Stevie yelling "The Chain" at Lindsey and vice versa, we got excited and said: "We want to see that whole concert!" When we were finally able to locate a copy of FM in LA from 1982, it was a fabulous experience to get to see that concert we dreamed about. Maybe some clips of the Tusk concert or even Tango for Rick and Billy material will open people's eyes. If people get this, or see this DVD through a friend, then that could spark an interest. :eek:

4. Clips of these shows on this DVD or video would be remarkably better in quality than what most of us have now. And that is a PLUS all its own. :)

Hello! We were looking at the Option #1. And this is what we would do if it was in our hands. Good or no? What do you think?
*** Asteriks represent changes (songs that were added). We removed some to make room: The Everywhere Video, Bleed to Love Her and Landslide from The Dance, and Save Me video.

1. Albatross (or) Oh Well (?) *******
2. Why (Capital Center ‘75 Concert) ~3:45
3. Station Man (Capital Center ’75 Concert) ~4:00
4. Rhiannon (Rosebud) 6:52
5. I’m So Afraid (Rosebud) 5:02
6. Say You Love Me (Rosebud) 3:55
7. Monday Morning (Japan) ********
8. World Turning (Midnight Special) ~6:00?
9. Go Your Own Way (Rosebud) 3:32
10. Dreams (Paris Promo) 4:19
11. You Make Loving Fun (Japan) 3:45
12. Gold dust woman (3 reels) ********
13. The Chain (Mirage Concert) 5:45
14. Tusk (video) 3:30
15. Sara (Tusk Doc) 4:08
16. Not That Funny (Tusk Doc) 2:10
17. Sisters of the Moon (Mirage) 7:45
18. Hold Me (video) 3:57
19. Gypsy (video) 4:12
20. Eyes of the World (Mirage) 3:45
21. Oh Diane (billed on the list as The FM story") ******
22. Little Lies (video) 3:34
23. Seven Wonders (video) 3:38
24. Big Love (video) 3:57
25. As Long As You Follow (video) 4:07
26. Something from Rick or/and Billy? Suggestions anyone???***
27. Skies the Limit (video) 3:42
28. Paper Doll (video) 3:56
29. Love Shines (video) 4:10
30. Silver Springs (Dance) 5:45
31. Don’t Stop (The Brits) ~4:00

I'm really sorry everybody
 

OK, I've calmed down now, so I just would like to make a few light comments to help smooth things over.

ChiliD - yeah, I knew there were some compatriots out there! I do understand that if the majority does want the run of the mill stuff on there and this idea wins the vote then so be it. I know there's a long way to go on the signatures, I just figured as long as the content was being decided now, I was hoping that if it was "more rare" clips then it would give me personally more insentive to want to help get the word out and get some more votes whereas if it was a collection of "general" stuff that I didn't want to buy again, then I wouldn't really in all honesty be looking forward to the day that the 10,000th person signed their name because it wouldn't be a collection worth much of anything to me (this was before Marty had informed me of the option of removing my name from the list which I didn't think was an option at the time but I now know that it is) but I do realize it would be of importance to my friends here so I will try and spread the word regardless of the outcome.

Les - In all my flusters, it was probably me that misunderstood but I was cautious of not stepping over the line in trying to change too much on list one going by the thought that it had won and I was truely trying to respect that by only fiddiling with those three songs as this seemed to be the only doubtful area on list one that people seemed to have a thought on.

Jo and Jensen - Your list is fairly good, at least it's a step in the right direction as there would only be six "run of the mill" clips as oppossed to the eight on list one (this "already owned" stuff is the biggest concern to me personally). As far as the vault stuff being of poor quality, well, I'd like to think that if we did pick something for the disc not knowing the state of the quality of the clip that Ken would be kind enough to warn us about the technical difficulties that he may encounter transferring it to the DVD as I'm sure he doesn't want to be flooded with complaints from customers about DVD's that are unwatchable/unlistenable so I wouldn't worry there as I'm sure he wants this to go as well as we do as a good quality product is only going to benefit his company with the profits gained from this proposed project with the possibility of more to come if all goes well and we can get the signatures etc. regarding Rick & Billy etc. OK, if "In the back of my mind "is really THAT poor of a video then I have no problem going for something else to represent them, however, I personally would not take something from the "Tango" video just because once again this is easily accessible on VHS and as it's not the Rumours lineup (if the truth be spoken) then I really don't think many people are in a hurry to put the entire show on DVD. (even though I personally would love that!) but whatever you guys think.

As my ideas are well documented elsewhere, I'm going to try to refrain from taking over the thread that Les is going to set up tonight as I'm sure all will be fairly done and all angles will be considered. I really am sorry to anyone I inadvertantly offended in this and the other related threads. I'm sure my friends will tell you, I'm not that bad, I just love my Mac and can't wait to get a hold of stuff that will fit on the 2 hours of the disc that I don't already have on a factory made tape/disc. That's my only main concern personally although other things I have spoken about would be preferrable but I know they are not possible for this release. Now I'm going to think of ways to spread the word about getting those signatures!

John

Vote #1 is complete...
 

The vote is complete. Option 1 was selected by the majority. Now's the time to begin discussions in earnest to come up with lists in the format of option 1 to challenge the current option 1 list in the final vote. A "sticky" thread has been started at the top of this forum now with the full results of this vote, and as a place for y'all to discuss your ideas for the final vote contenders.

Jo/Jensen -- Great start! Maybe you can cut and paste your list again in the thread now set up for discussions about the final vote? I'm just thinking it might be a little bit less confusing to try to keep all of those discussions going in one place so that nobody's ideas get lost in the shuffle.

John -- No sweat. :D