Importance of Stevie versus Lindsey
 

To the casual fan, Stevie Nicks personifies the band. She is the face of the Fleetwood Mac "brand". Accordingly, she is the one that attracts the casual fan to Fleetwood Mac concerts.

The casual fan comes to see Stevie. But they leave the venue talking about Lindsey Buckingham and his incredible talent and stage presence.

We as hard core fans know that Lindsey is the creative genius behind the band. And yes, his guitar work is absolutely brilliant. But at this stage of the game, his stage presence is probably his most important contribution...especially since creating new material is no longer a priority to the other members.

With all due respect, Stevie and Christine are showing their age. Lindsey props them up with his high level of energy and charisma.

Neil Finn seems like a nice enough guy. And from what I understand, he is brilliant on a creative front. But I don't think he has the stage presence to captivate and energize audiences. It's especially tough taking the reins and sharing a leadership role when you're the new kid on the block.

And I understand that Mike Campbell is a great guitarist. Again, does he energize the audience like Lindsey??? Time will tell. My bet says no.

Mick and company should have learned their lesson in 1987 with the addition of Billy Burnett and Rick Vito. Both were talented in their own right. But even with new material, they never achieved a status beyond karaoke.

My wife and I have seen Fleetwood Mac 11 times. In addition, we've seen solo shows by Lindsey (6x), Stevie (2x) and Buckingham McVie (1x). Combined, that's 20 concerts in all. For me, the final chapter has been written for the band Fleetwood Mac. Sadly, they have squandered their legacy and lost their legitimacy. At this point, with their advancing age, I don't believe there's time to recover the Rumours lineup.

I do, however, look forward to new material and future LB and/or Buckvie shows.

Very well said. I think you stated how MANY of us feel, here.

It's simply too late in the game for reinvention.

I agree and I disagree. I agree that Lindsey has been the creative force of Fleetwood Mac since the mid-70's. And I agree that Lindsey has been the main source of energy for the live performances in recent years. And I agree that Neil is, like Lindsey, a creative superstar. Very few musicians can write, produce, and arrange music like Lindsey or Neil. Paul McCartney has famously said that Neil Finn is the best living songwriter.

I disagree that Neil and Mike won't bring at least some of Lindsey's energy. I've seen each of them many times and have always walked about impressed with their energy and charisma. Mike doesn't talk much on stage but is a musical tour de force with that guitar. And Neil is a powerful stage presence as you can see in performances by Crowded House, 7 Worlds Collide, etc. on YouTube. No one is Lindsey Buckingham, but Neil/Mike is about as good a replacement as humanly possible.

But Sugar Mick, it should have never happened. The legacy is ruined. I don't give AF if they replace him with Mick Jagger and Keith Richards.

THEY RUINED THE BAND BY DOING THIS.

Perhaps Lindsey should have simply played the tour rather than backing out. He could have done his solo thing next summer. If Lindsey had done that, the band would still be together and all would be good.

Lindsey was the real deal for Fleetwood Mac. He wrote, produced and performed at a high level. Audiences recognized his authenticity. And they responded to his energy.

This latest incarnation is a cover band. Until they produce new material, Neil and Mike are nothing more than karaoke as it relates to Fleetwood Mac. Perhaps they will bring energy as Sugar Mouse claims, but they are not the real deal.

In 1987, I was so disappointed when I learned that Lindsey had left the band. But he left on his own accord. Giving Fleetwood Mac the benefit of the doubt, I embraced the new lineup with Billy and Rick. And I respect the fact that they tried to write a new chapter with Behind the Mask. But the chemistry wasn't there.

The Rumours lineup, in all its incarnations, has been around since 1975. That's over 40 years to create a legacy. Even if this new band creates new music (contrary to Stevie's assertion that nobody buys new music), they will soon run out of time to establish real legitimacy.

The thing I remember the most about the BTM tour is how much Christine stepped up. She was leading the chat with the audience. She had a solo. She was full of energy. Stevie was floating around like a drugged out balloon for that tour. Billy and Rick were great for energy because they were super excited to be there.

I'm not sure Christine can do that now? As great as she looks, she cheats on keys so much with Brett there, it's embarrassing. Almost as bad as Stevie singing 2 notes for one song.

But it's Fleetwood Mac. I can't imagine they won't have a blockbuster show.

WE SHALL SEE....

I strongly suspect if Lindsey would have known he'd be fired, he would have just toured. After all, Stevie has held up the show many times and I'm certain he never would have pushed to get her fired because of it. From the limited info we have on the situation, it seems Lindsey was blindsided by the whole thing. The way the whole situation is being handled just smacks of dirty business.

You're right. Lindsey thought his was negotiating based on his strong belief in touring behind new music. Then he tried to integrate a solo tour...and they fired him. His wife's "raw deal" comment confirms that he was blindsided.

And don't forget "There's nobody I would rather tour with than Tom Petty". After Tom died, the writing was on the wall. Now she's acting out on her grief.

That McCartney quote surprised me....so did a quick Google search. I think you'll find it's FALSE!
Your sources appear to really lack credibility buddy....and this is on your beloved Finn forum!
https://www.frenzforum.com/topic/pau...alks-neil-finn

I've also seen Buckingham and Finn multiple times each, and Finn definitely holds his own as far as stage presence. Neil loves interacting with the audience - he used to do a bit (not sure if he still does) where he asks fans to toss their CDs of their own music on the stage (musicians in the audience knew to bring them along for the potential exposure) and he'd play something. At one solo show, he took my nephew's CD and played it, attempting to play/sing along, and doing a really good job... and giving my nephew one of the biggest thrills of his musical career. Finn turned what could've been a pretty annoying bit into a lot of fun for the crowd through his talent and sheer earnestness. I'm eager to see how he does with FM.

I know all about the McCartney quote where he said that Neil Finn is the greatest living songwriter. Paul was asked about it last year and he smiled and sort of denied having said that. Very unclear. More likely he said it and doesn't recall it.

I disagree ....I have seen Finn live more than FM/LB. Finn is brilliant, he is comical with plenty of banter and very entertaining. He does not have LBs energy nor does he work the stage and jump all over the place during a solo.
They are totally different and not comparable. I am not saying Finn won't be good but he shows none of LBs stage persona, he has a unique style.

Agree with that. Neil isn't animated on stage. He's very entertaining and a consummate professional but he doesn't jump around a lot.

Perfect for more intimate shows...but I'm not sure his style is really suited to bring it to larger arena shows. Lindsey's animated stage presence captivates the crowd as you don't need to be close up to see he's a bit mad.

"Agree with that. Neil isn't animated on stage. He's very entertaining and a consummate professional but he doesn't jump around a lot."

This confirms my point. Stevie and Christine are showing their age (not an insult, just a fact of life). Lindsey's youthful energy props them up. He has been stealing the show since the Dance.

As I said in my original post, the casual fan comes to a Fleetwood Mac concert to see Stevie. And walks away talking about Lindsey.

If you want to see Neil Finn's stage presence, here is two hour concert of Neil performing with another songwriter extraordinaire (Paul Kelly). Neil and Paul go back and forth playing their songs. Amazing show!

I'll have a proper watch at some point when I've got a bit more time. Had a very quick flick through and I really cant see anything that jumps out and makes me think- Wow!. I promise you, I really like Neil Finn and his music, but I just cant see him and Mike filling the void.

I don't mean to sound rude...but you have seen Fleetwood Mac shows haven't you? I'm sure you have as you sound very knowledgeable. Its just...its hard to describe how much Lindsey steals the show and nothing I've seen of Neil Finn and Mike Campbell live tell me they'll have the effervescence of Lindsey Buckingham. As I say...great in smaller intimate venues. But for an arena supergroup? Hmmmm

Nice, laid back sound. Perfect for smaller venues. But the fans will be falling asleep in a large arena. The following quote sums it up...

"Perfect for more intimate shows...but I'm not sure his style is really suited to bring it to larger arena shows. Lindsey's animated stage presence captivates the crowd as you don't need to be close up to see he's a bit mad".

g. fish
- dude, where have you been for 15 years?

Probably not the best and most accurate quote to use whilst proving a point then?? :shrug:

Thanks for the shout out. Actually, I've been lurking on this board since the Dance. I usually maintain a fairly low profile online. But I became motivated to post my thoughts based on the events of the last three months. As you can see, I'm a bit late with my replies! Thanks again.

Exactly, great to have some insightful and intelligent debate back!

You seem to have a lot of common sense. Good to have your thoughts :thumbsup:

I don't disagree. They're different. Neil doesn't have Lindsey's passionate energy. However, Lindsey doesn't have Neil's warmth and wit. Neil brings a very high level of warmth and humor to his shows. Neil and Lindsey are both consummate professionals from a music standpoint. It will be different, for sure, but I still expect it to be great. And from a new music standpoint, there are few songwriters alive today as good as Neil.

Lindsey brings a lot of physical energy to the show, but he needs to after all that psychobabble-as-banter.

That said, Neil’s SiriusXM interviews don’t have me too optimistic, but that’s not really the same thing as performing.

FOR ONCE I actually agree with you. You have articulated both their strengths well here and realised they are different.
But Stop trying to shove Finn's talent down forum members throats, it is not helping your case. I hold Finn in the highest regard too but people need to make up their own minds personally. I don't believe FM will ever be great again, with or without Finn. Music is subjective and shouldn't be forced on anyone. You are only enraging those that are still sad and angered by LBs firing....

I think I could become a fan of Neil Finn. I really like his sound. And he is charismatic. But based on what I've seen, I don't think he (or anyone else) can fill Lindsey's shoes.

Vince Gill has done a great job of imitating Glen Frey. But it's still just karaoke in my mind...even with a known replacement. The only way to achieve legitimacy is to create new music.

As HomerMcvie said...It's simply too late in the game for reinvention.

Maybe if Fleetwood Mac had another 10 or 15 years. But at that point, they will be pushing 85 to 90.

I'm not trying to force any music on anyone. Just stating my opinions just like all the others do here. Mine standout though because I'm not espousing the "Lindsey as victim" theme and just talking about how brilliant Mike and Neil are. Hey I wish Lindsey would have just backed down and honored his commitment to tour with Fleetwood Mac and did his solo thing next summer. If he had, Fleetwood Mac would still be the "classic five" and Neil would in Auckland finishing his album with his brother Tim.

Yes, to make them a legitimate band they need to record new music....proper new music, i.e. an album, not just one or two songs.
However, if they did that they'd be taking the piss knowing that's what Lindsey had been pushing this band to do for many years.

That's a fair view.

My understanding is he did back down. They (she) wasn't interested though.

We won't know for sure until Lindsey comments. The band is saying that Lindsey wanted to delay the tour for a year and wouldn't back down from that. Hopefully we'll hear both sides of the story at some point. Either way, I wish he would have simply played the tour and then did his solo thing next summer.

YES, we all know your point of view. You state it over and over and over. Yet, with no ability to show us your sources as you always claim we need to show you..........

Also, you never did mention if you have seen any actual Fleetwood Mac live shows................???? (Neil Finn shows don't count)

Angel75, the same thing could be said about you guys who are voicing your complaints about Lindsey being fired. I mean, how would you feel if someone posted "But stop trying to shove your complaints about Lindsey's firing down members throats?" Sugar Mouse has just as much right to post about Neil Finn's talent as you have to post about your anger at Lindsey's firing. I really appreciate the posts and links about both Neil and Mike Campbell, since I'm not familiar with their work.

I'm sorry you're mad at FM for firing Lindsey, but not everyone else is. I'm still a fan, but maybe that will change when I actually see Neil and Mike perform as FM. You said music is subjective and shouldn't be forced on anyone... but it seems like you have already decided to not like the new version of FM. Which is totally your right... just like it's my right to actually give FM a chance. I gave them a chance when Lindsey left, and when Stevie left, and when Christine left, and I'm still going to give them a chance now that Lindsey was fired. But saying people shouldn't post links about Neil or Mike here just seems misguided. You shouldn't think these posts are here to rub salt in your wounds... they're here so we can all learn more about these guys who are now a part of FM.

The difference is that many supporters of Lindsey feel they support the Rumour's lineup of the band, and the fact that it's now defunct has many people sad, disappointed and even angry. We just are and we want to talk about it.
Sugar Mick seems to want to argue with everyone that talks about this, and people are sick of hearing his/her point of view because it's done to annoy. So maybe he/she should just leave alone those who want to discuss it??? And leave alone those that do not share the same point of view on who caused it.

Some thoughtful insight in this thread. This Finn/Campbell experiment could go any of a dozen ways; I'm trying to remain optimistic. I consider myself a Lindsey Buckingham Super-Fan and I hold Neil Finn's work in almost as high regard. So I'm really torn here! But I'm getting over the shock/disappointment and starting to look forward to the new Mac. Not ready to take the plunge and buy tickets just yet, but I will eagerly check out the early setlists and videos. Finn's never disappointed me before, so...

I understand what you're saying. Maybe instead of replying to Sugar Mouse, you could ignore him? That would cut down on the problem. It does take two to argue. If people didn't respond to his posts, it would die. But instead of telling someone to quit posting, how about using the ignore feature? I know people use that feature on me all the time LOL!

I respect your right to vent about Lindsey's firing and have no problem with people doing so, especially on this forum. The name calling got old, but it looks like people are backing down from that, which makes it much more bearable, hopefully on all sides. I mentioned on another thread, when or if I post something about how excited I am to see footage of Mike and Neil performing with FM, that's not meant to rub salt in anyone's wounds. So it's kind of a catch-22, I think.

Sorry to tell you that I don't post with the intention of annoying anyone. On the flip side, I find many of the posts on this forum annoying with all the "Lindsey is a victim" stuff and all the expletives. How about you ignore me and I'll ignore you. Or we can try to understand each other's perspectives. Life is short ...

Fair comments. And I never said I would not go to a live show again (although I am not convinvced now due to the backlash from fans that they will tour outside of the US)....what I did say is that I don't think that they will ever be GREAT again.