thoughts on firing?
 

i have a range of thoughts, some are -

• shocked and sad for how betrayed he must feel :distress:
• happy he's not tied down for the next 2 years with the stale oldies act
• excited he can instead finally fully focus on his creative endevours
• can't wait for the solo album(s) he promised will be out this year and next
• can't wait for the solo tour (hopefully this fall!) - we didn't have one since 2012!
• frustrated that although fans and general public are supporting him so hard right now, by the time he finally announces the Best Of album and tour this great momentum will be gone
• know better than to hope he will actually have a successful social media campaign to let people *know* he's touring

I am angry
I am sad
I am bitter
Lindsey wanted so much more for Fleetwood Mac but they just want to play oldies
I wanted one more album
I wanted one more tour
Shame on all of them

I'm angry.
I'm dismayed.
I'm piss off at the disrespect the band has showed him.
I'm sick and tired of Stevie Nicks highjacking this band
The irony that they want to play the hits that he crafted. Without him they will be a lounge act.
I hope this tour fails spectacularly and they come crawling back and he tells them to suck it.
I'm pumped for so much new music, new tours and vitality.
I hope he has no Fleetwood Mac music in his tour, only solo material.

Turn It On Linds.

Shocked/angry
Not surprised
Happy to now at least get some more new music.
I get it.... He's not just about the "hits tour"
I figured he would be in the "last chapter of the MAC".... But I guess not.
Disconnect....between Buckingham/Nicks on the future of the MAC as it relates to releasing new music.
I will get over it....I love all the versions of this band.

I'm all over the place
My heart is broken cause I wanted a final album and a final tour even if it was the same songs we've heard a gazillion times.
I'm enraged AF for him being fired--just typing the word 'fired' pisses me off. Ready to take out my earrings and fight!
My brain says this is the most FM way of doing FM--of course they're doing all this krazy **** after Chris came back and Stevie's tour was successful and BuckVie was stupendous. What other outcome would be as FM as this??

i love you! :wavey::laugh::nod: :lol:

i think all of this played a role in the implosion.

Lindsey saved their a**es so many times in the life / near death / bankruptcy situations, if what they tell us can be believed. that's some heavy personal stuff, besides what he did on the musical side. yet none of that apparently means anything, just drop him at the end. because he's difficult? please! he was way more difficult over the course of the last 50 years. why was he not fired, if they couldn't stand it, 40 years ago during the Tusk tour when some bad stuff was happening? nah that was apparently nothing, now somehow he became too difficult. after a lifetime together. before the last tour. pleeeeaaase.

I'll feel a little better when Lindsey puts out his tour dates. I'm dragging my feet on plans for my parents 50th wedding anniversary in the fall. Yesterday I read for hours online about Lindsey. Somewhere (not here) I read a comment about his tour starting in September. Wish I could confirm that but i guess I'll just wait and see. I don't even know where i'd find that comment again.

My thoughts...

The only shock at all is that Christine didn't
have his back. Even if they all had a vote,
she could have told them that she was out.

Ole what's her name would have had a hard
time carrying the band without Christine.

From what I notice on a neighbouring thread, Lindsey has a solo album all ready to go. I get the impression he was more keen on doing that than an FM tour and as so often happens with these older bands (Journey/Styx/Yes) when one member wants more time and the rest want to go ahead with the tour the odd man out gets dumped.

By that logic though, they should have ditched Stevie and made BuckVie an FM album.

Although getting fired is terrible, I think Lindsey will be happier putting out a solo album and doing a solo tour than doing another oldies tour with the Big Machine without any new music.

My main disappointment is that Christine didn't go with him. I believe she honestly enjoyed the BuckVie album and tour, but (apparently) she is choosing the Big Machine tour rather than hitching her wagon to his star. Best case scenario is he plans for this to be a true solo effort, and he will recruit her for more BuckVie in the future.

It's hard for me to believe that money is the primary motivation for anyone other than Mick. I find it hard to believe that each of the three songwriters aren't getting handsome royalty checks every week. But maybe Stevie is greedier than I imagine. Heck, maybe they all are.

i don't think it's about money for Stevie. if it was, she would have simply left the mac after her last solo tour, where she doesn't have to split the income 5-ways. yes, Mac makes more money than her solo tour, but probably about 3 x as much , not 5x. so either she was trying to get out of the Mac tour blameless (speculations are that Mac tour has been booked since January), or she just really wanted to show Lindsey not just how she would leave so fast that palm leaves would hit him in the head or whatever it was few years ago - but that she now can even push him out. for her it would be a win-win - either they cancel the tour altogether if they don't wanna turn on LB, or they fire him if they do.

i think LB wanted FM tour because he wanted to finance comfortably his next solo tour. he was counting on Mac tour for that. he didn't want out, but after his album got converted and pushed back, he probably did want to try to push the start of the Mac tour from august to a bit later. but, the story goes, he relented. but then he wanted them to wait for his dates to be cemented before they announce the Mac tour, and supposedly that was the last straw. :shrug:

Mick wanted the Mac tour and to get as much money as possible. plus we've seen Mick and Stevie together around the world an awful lot in the last few months. maybe there was a resentment that BuckVie was so well received and that LB and CM looked like they had so much fun.

then supposedly the vote came. it was Mick and Stevie vs Lindsey. i have to assume LB couldn't believe that they would even pull something like that on him. so Mick and Stevie want him out. they say they can't work with that arrogant jerk anymore. John goes with Mick, by default, because the 2 of them had a pact forever that they stick together - or something like that. so that's 3:1 and it's basically over. Christine is in the middle, and sad about the whole situation. i have no idea whether she voted or not. but she stayed with the band. Mick's social media looked like he's been really trying to butter her up lately. plus Mick is her real friend i think. he always kept in touch. i hope she tours the shortest time possible and then bolts.

Not sure what you mean about his album being converted. None of LB’s albums have been converted to Mac albums this side of 2003.

The Reason
 

A psychologist once explained to me that there are basically three motivations/reasons for most things in life: money, sex or power. It was money for Mick. It was power for Stevie.

he was planning to release an album of all new music right about now. record company decided he should release Best Of album instead, and hold off on the album of new music and release it later. or something like that. that's what i meant.

Is anyone else sick at the thought of listening to Fleetwood Mac atm? I've had solo Linds on repeat, i just cant bring myself to listen to the band. I can't even listen to Buckingham/McVie or any GOS tracks with Mick and John. Still just so angry.

I’ve been playing my 21st Century Lindsey playlist which includes all of SYW, BM, and even Soldiers Angel.

It’s a testament to what they can achieve ... together

Well...I'm watching live LB concerts
 

I'm sad things have happened this way. :( Even if he does sit just this one tour out and comes back for a "Farewell" tour, things have gotten so ugly, it will be yucky. Fans are divided, various fandoms are at each other's throats and it's making it hard to be an FM fan, which SUCKS because I love this stupid band and their amazing music. If this tour w/o LB does gangbusters, then you'll have people rubbing it in everyone's face saying "See, don't need him." It makes me wanna vomit. Then, you have folks who have seen changes from the beginning who are excited about the newbies. That's fine, I get why they are excited, but this whole ordeal has tainted the aura of Fleetwood Mac, to me. :distress:

P.S. Asking the PROMOTERS who they'd rather have in the f***ing band? REALLY, MICK? Jesus.

I thought of you when the news broke, as well as some Ledgies who aren't around much anymore, like Gerald. :(

All I know is he better be playing “wrong” on his next solo tour! I don’t see how he can’t. And he can alternate betweeen Mr. and Mrs. Rock****

I don't want to hear any FM right now. It makes my blood boil! I'm listening to Lindsey's solo work only!

from Rick
 

:Dfor people who are asking about what happened - here is some more, filled in by Rick Turner (luthier who made Turner Model 1, LB's guitar) -

Rick Turner:
At one point, Lindsey had proposed that both FM and he with his band tour at the same time with the LB band filling in dates between the FM shows. The report was that Stevie wanted at least a day between gigs; Lindsey wanted to play as much as possible. That's what I heard from a most reliable source at the NAMM show in January.

i asked Rick whether it's ok if i post here (you know, weirdos on The Ledge, as Jimmy P. nicely calls people here :eek:). this was Rick's response:

Rick Turner
Elle Llew Sure. I think it just points out one point of contention. Maybe it looked to some as though LB was going to do really well touring hard; perhaps not doubling his money on the tour, but certainly getting in nearly twice the audience face time. I did not hear whether Christine was going to possibly do the LB gigs as well as the FM gigs, but Bret and Neil would have, and that would have made nice...and deserved...paydays for them. Good guys, great musicians. I know Federico was looking forward to ti.

and more:

Rick Turner
Felix Le Chat Lindsey would have gotten more press than Stevie if they'd done a double tour like that.

this doesn't even make sense. FM would need at least one or two days between Mac gigs in order for Lindsey's plan to make sense... like, how could he do solo shows if they booked Mac shows.....

She's always had like stretches with fairly close shows mixed with stretches with 3-4 days off. Hence, Chrissie Hynde having time to do solo shows in between. I just don't see how FM would have been different....:shrug:

was he proposing that they go from city to city faster so the expense of moving all the musicians and equipment would be more streamlined??

yup. the numbers may not be exact, but you get the point. FM always has few days in between, just like Stevie solo. LB could easily fit small venue dates in the same area in between, just like Chrissie did.

so sounds more and more like it was power play all along, as we thought.

the whole convo -

Rick Turner At one point, Lindsey had proposed that both FM and he with his band tour at the same time with the LB band filling in dates between the FM shows. The report was that Stevie wanted at least a day between gigs; Lindsey wanted to play as much as possible. That's what I heard from a most reliable source at the NAMM show in January.

Elle Llewi heard the same. thanks so much for filling this in Rick!

Elle Llew Rick Turner is it ok if i quote this on The Ledge? it's a google-able place and people sometimes check there.

Rick Turner Elle Llew Sure. I think it just points out one point of contention. Maybe it looked to some as though LB was going to do really well touring hard; perhaps not doubling his money on the tour, but certainly getting in nearly twice the audience face tim...See More

Elle Llew Rick Turner 😪 this makes me sad even more. what a f**king shame!

Elle Llew (excuse my language)

Rick Turner The whole thing is a mess, and I'm sorry for them all. I've had some memorable moments with that crew!

Haley Clark So then tensions were already high at Musicares. Because NAMM and Musicares were the same weekend. Which is probably what led to Stevie and Lindsey having their fight. And the rest is history.

Felix Le Chat Rick this is the most disgusting thing to hear: all could have been avoided.
Give Stevie 2, 3 or even 4 days between shows. I wouldn’t mind to visit consecutive LB gigs 😜
...See More

Pattie D I know for a fact that LB wanted to do a solo tour in between the FM tour. He did say that it was complicated and I guess he wasn't kidding.
I hope he gets to do the solo tour after all. I will not support Fleetwood Mac anymore.

Rick Turner Felix Le Chat Lindsey would have gotten more press than Stevie if they'd done a double tour like that.

Pattie D I really couldn't see Fleetwood Mac going along with his plans. What if people couldn't afford to see FM and went to see LB instead as it was more economical? Big problem.

Rick Turner Pattie D Would have to have been planned for different cities.

Pattie D I could see where that would get costly. Not to mention would the crew get any rest?

Elle Llew but that makes complete sense:

FM plays arena in downtown DC. LB solo plays the Fillmore in Silver Spring, MD.

FM plays MSG . LB solo plays Red Bank, NJ.

easy peasy!

Felix Le Chat Rick Turner : a logistical nightmare (aside from costs) 😝 to have it in different cities.
Most cities do have multiple venues. Although in this group the LB fan ship reels highly I do believe Lindsey would have been ok to play smaller venues than FM.

And I’m sure he got enough guitars 🎸 for 2 sets (if not you could probably help on that 😜)


Rick Turner Pattie D Well, it would just be two interlaced tours with some of the folks working practically every night. But that's what they do in musical theater...Broadway and off-Broadway actors do eight shows a week...six nights and two matinees. That's what professionals are capable of. At one point the Beach Boys were often enough doing two gigs on the same day, and on at least one day, they did three...in three different cities. Lot's of alimony to pay for those guys!

Pattie D Don't forget Providence after FM plays Boston, Elle. LOL

Elle LlewYPattie D i'm self serving ;)

Rick Turner It would have been doable. It just needed everyone's buy-in.

Pattie D Well sadly it's never going to happen now.

Elle Llew Felix Le Chat nope, wouldn't be. see above. FM plays cities, LB solo suburbs. works!



here's the link to these posts: https://www.facebook.com/groups/8972...5412200239934/

I don't understand why they didn't just tell him no, they wouldn't modify tour dates or announcements for him, and he could quit if he didn't like it. Why fire him for asking?

There has to be more to it. Mick knows that the Mac with Lindsey is more marketable; why not give him the chance to step back in line before dropping the ax?

Maybe there was some ugliness that went down when he asked / was told no which escalated things.

I'm relieved I'm not the only one who noticed those posts on Mick's SM right before this all blew up. Yup, sad to say it but I understand why Chris would be loyal to him. They have been through a lot together since the early 70s. I remember that Chris did the Dance tour only as a favour to Mick and John. And he's indeed probably the only one who kept in touch with her when she was in retirement, and he was the one she called when she wanted to resume flying and rejoin the band. I wish she had put her foot down about this, but such is life.

Question--are they still intending to release his Best of soon, or will the new album come first? I want to see whether to wait or to order the Words and Music promo CD :)

I absolutely believe that Lindsey wanted to do solo concert dates during the FM tour, and that that was why he's not touring with them now. I even shared this theory myself days ago. And I see both pov but ultimately, I understand why the band didn't like the idea at all and didn't agree to it. Two reasons: he would have been competing with the band for tickets, press, etc. Second, he would have been happier performing his solo shows, and that would have been obvious at the FM shows, kind of like how he was at the East/West Coast FM shows. And I don't believe for one second Christine would have performed with him. She's content to perform with FM live and anyway, Lindsey wants to promote his new solo album.

Pure speculation now on my part, which I wouldn't normally share but since everyone else has, I may as well- what if Lindsey was the one who gave the ultimatum? "Either I get to do my solo tour on off days or I won't tour with you guys at all."

I still look forward to hearing what Lindsey and FM have to say about what really happened.

this has got to STOP. what is above is NOT a speculation. Rick Turner has no reason to make up stuff. he told us what happened.

there is more to the backstory though - "him or me" came from several separate sources - but you are right, it has not been shared publicly.

(sorry, the gotta STOP part is not to you specifically, i'm just so tired of fans saying it, when confronted with facts.)

posting here, so it doesn't get lost in the rumours forum:

i talked to my 14 yo daughter this morning, while driving her to school. i told her Fleetwood Mac fired Lindsey. she was like, what? how does that even happen?

she pondered it a bit, and then came up with this: "i guess they just must have gone senile."

i had to laugh. guess kids cut through the crap and come up with the most plausible explanation!

I accept what Rick Turner said, and that wasn't the speculation I was referring to. His explanation makes 100% sense, and I'm sure it's true, we just don't know specifically how everything went down, of course.

We all (subconsciously?) tend to make assumptions based on, I think, which band member we like the most (or which one we dislike the most). That's the only explanation I can think of for some of the speculation going on. If someone is already frustrated or angry with Stevie because she wouldn't record with FM, then it seems they blame Stevie for Lindsey leaving. She's always wanted the band for herself, they say. If someone loves Christine, then she's considered an innocent bystander who is only touring with FM because of some contract she can't get out of. If someone loves Stevie, then Lindsey was fired because of some alleged physical or emotional abuse he did to her 40 years ago.

Fans are scrambling, trying to understand how and why this could happen, and that's leading to a whole lotta speculation, much of it unpleasant. Elle has kept her head pretty clear, and she is probably the most vocal LB fan here, and others could take a lesson. She's clearly hurt and angry and upset, but she's not saying nasty things about other members or calling them names.

Was this thread deleted? I can't find it unless I look under my name...

Oh good, it's still here.

so.... was Stevie arguing for at least a day between gigs on behalf of the supporting players?? Seems like they had decided for themselves they were ok with it. Maybe she thought it would poop them out for the Mac shows over time?? I'm just trying to figure out how the pieces fit logically. Which is a mistake with this band because so much is done emotionally!

What was posted is mostly along the lines from what I've heard too.
Very sad and disappointing from Mick and Stevie.

Still not getting it
 

Here's what I don't get: how could the band—Stevie in particular—be willing to burn that bridge with Lindsey with such finality? Forget the music—on a personal level, it's a monumental betrayal. I don't see how their relationship could come back from it.

If she is the one who pushed for his ouster, I think that one day, in the not-too-distant future, she will regret being so impetuous.

It might be healthy for him and his wife to
leave that relationship. At his age why
not live the most stress free life he can?

According to her, the life she's led is full of
regrets. Her endless complaining would be
enough for me to leave.

My opinion is that he can definitely turn this into
a positive situation. Use the angst to write better
songs.

I'm looking forward to new music from him. And
I think that's why I'm not so upset.

I was hoping for one last FM album/tour and of course angry regarding Lindsey's firing, but more excited about the possibility of solo shows happening sooner rather than later. I have enjoyed the large stadium tours, but it sounds like he wasn't too keen on the Classic West/East and doing the "nostalgia act." Based on reviews, the band was just going through the motions with no energy at the West show, so I hope that he will be happier in the long run being able to concentrate on his solo endeavors.

i've been thinking about this, sifting through all the bs in various different-slanted fan groups, trying to clean up outright slander, mocking and confusion.


as far as the fans trying to preach "all FM members matter" line? it's simple - it's a matter of wrong and right.


i as a LB fan might be way happier for both his [US] fans and ultimately his creative output and legacy if he doesn't waste another second touring greatest hits with FM. he gains. we gain. :thumbsup:

but i'm sad for LB fans around the world who lost probably the only opportunity to see him solo - because the way he was planning intermingled tours, he could have easily done it - throw in a few solo dates in the UK, Europe, AUS. now they not only won't get him solo, but they were also robbed of the only opportunity they've had to see him live for the last decade or so, which was when FM was touring. so i'm sad for those fans. it would have been spectacular for them. and according to Rick, it sounds Christine was considering guesting at some of his solo shows, so there may have been some BuckVie songs thrown in there too.

i do admit this is easy for me to say, being a LB fan first, who is in the wrong. because it's fairly clear-cut and i don't need to try to delude myself and muddy the waters for others like trolls are trying to do. and you know what? i don't deny that bad stuff from LB's past we've heard about probably happened. in contrast, these people cannot accept the smaller thing being wrong with their favorite. it's bizarre. :shrug:

The people I feel most sorry for are the ones who couldn't/didn't go to the last tour. I've been chided (lovingly by my family) for going to multiple shows and my response is always the same---FM is old, someone could die and I'd never forgive myself for missing a show that I could have gone to. For example: I live in the Chicago suburbs so I can drive into the city or drive to Milwaukee to see them. The time, distance and hassle is roughly the same. Why the hell wouldn't I go to both shows! When you tack on all the musical greats we've lost in the past few years it makes perfect sense to me.

I realize some weren't able to see a concert due to travel, money, etc and now they'll never have the chance to see the 5. That makes me SO SAD. I insisted on taking my sister to a show. She's not even a casual fan, just likes a few songs. She was impressed by the length of the show, the graphics, the way Chris, Stevie and Lindsey take turns singing. When she saw Chris putting on the accordion she was like "omg does she really play that". She was blown away by Lindsey's energy and how much more rugged and strong they sound live compared to the radio. She wasn't sure what to make of Stevie's crackhead dance but filmed the whole thing on her phone, lol. She got startled at first when people called out the band members names (and kept doing it throughout the show) but thought it was super cool.

My heart breaks for the fans who won't get to experience the Rumors 5. Maybe the new shows will be fun but it won't be the same.