This forum is such a relief
 

I think the post-Rumours forum might be the best place to discuss the new line up. While I understand the disappointment about Lindsey not being in FM, I am just astounded by some of the theories, speculation, and rumors that are being tossed around as fact on the Rumours board. The name-calling and rude remarks are one thing, but the way misinformation is being spread as truth is insane, and actually making any argument against FM for firing Lindsey seem credible.

Someone posts what they think happened on page one, and when you get to page 3, someone is repeating that theory as fact, and then someone else responds "I knew it!" Sure, there's some comic relief, like the Freudian reading between the lines of every statement Stevie has said since 1975, or reading into their body language during their televised interview or at MusiCares, but the outlandish theories they share make me suspect of everything they share. I mean, I could believe Stevie wanted Lindsey out of the band, but when they show as 'evidence' a remark she made about touring in 1982, yeah, they lose credibility in my eyes.

I would encourage folks who want to discuss Fleetwood Mac now start doing so on this forum. I come to this board to check on tour dates, latest news, etc but doing so on the Rumours forum means wading through a lot of negativity and hostility. Hopefully people will continue to post the latest news about FM in this forum, not only so we can avoid the negativity, but also so we don't irritate them.

really? funny, I've been reading all those threads and have not seen that reference at all. :eek:

I am content to look forward to the tour and the possibility of new music. A lot of the vitriol on other parts of this site is vile but predictable. And the rhetoric keeps ratcheting up. I am sure Lindsey would be sickened to read some of the stuff his rabid fans are writing.

It's like a breath of fresh air in this forum. Calm and peaceful with reasonable discussions. A good place to be :)

My hope for this lineup of FM is not so much the upcoming tour, but the prospect of new recording. Maybe the chemistry will be good and the creative juices will flow.

I agree. I started visiting the "old" Ledge back during The Dance, signed up for this version while anticipating the Say You Will tour and have been visiting again throughout the past year+ just the check on the status of the tour (and then to try to find out what was going on with Lindsey when I saw a tweet referencing it on a political [trolling] twitter I follow).

Even before all this Lindsey stuff happened, I was surprised at the difference in tone of The Ledge from what I remember. Back in the day everyone had their favorites, but I don't recall so much vitriol (but it's been awhile and my memory isn't great). Anyway, while the ousting of Lindsey was shocking, I'm still looking forward to the tour (I love Mike Campbell and I think Neil is an interesting addition) and was hoping to be able to get info and talk among fans...but trying to read through some of the other threads is frustrating.

Looking forward to a potential setlist shake up...and planning to see them in Buffalo next March.

The theories and speculation on this board are born right out of the band's statements especially Stevie Nicks. I am tired of listening to her because there is no way I believe anything she says anymore. Of course the fans should have problems with what she says. She is to be commended for always sticking by the Mac during Lindsey's first departure and Christine's departure. However her statements over the last few years project her dysfunction in the band.
Lets me be specific.
A miracle happened and Christine came back to the band. Stevie was so happy that she did the cutest thing ever. She would come out after the concerts and talk to the crowd alone just basically glowing how happy she was Christine was back. The band went on a long tour but the excitement was the possibility of getting another Rumours 5 album. Holy moly would that be exciting. Not since the 1980s this happened. We looked past this part in the beginning but Lindsey and Christine were leaking they were busy with new recordings and were excited for the world to hear them. They were shelved and the band went on tour. When the tour ended Lindsey and Christine went back into the studio in anticipating it would be a Mac album. I thought Stevie would definitely come along but she didn't. Mick gave press statements that he was not sure Stevie would join them. She didn't and gave the reason albums don't sell anymore. This was confusing because Stevie said In Your Dreams was her favorite solo album and she did not care about the music industry anymore. While Mick, John, Lindsey, and Christine worked in the studio, Stevie embarked on a solo tour. Her tour was extended twice. Since it was clear Stevie would not record with her old band, Lindsey and Christine called their album "Buckingham McVie" and went on a tour. After both tours ended, Stevie went away for several months or a much deserved rest. Lindsey gets fired. Mick and Stevie's statements are odd. Basically they state Lindsey would not tour with them. The Mac's tour does not even begin for a half year (October). WTF. Lindsey could have done an extensive solo tour by then. This time last year Lindsey was the only one in the band saying the Mac had many more tours to do and he did not understand why other band members were calling the next tour a goodbye tour.
This is not a typical way a lead guitarist and vocalist gets fired from a band. Usually substance abuse or a violent incident leads to a termination. This is even more odd because this could be the Mac's last tour. Is it really worth it to end their legacy this way?
IMHO its completely normal to speculate what the hell is going on. It makes no sense. I think its fair to say that Stevie and Lindsey do not get along. Its foolish to not bring this into the equation when discussing this action by the band. IMHO Lindsey is the reason Stevie did not record with the band. And its not logical to believe this had nothing to do with Lindsey being fired and Mike Campbell taking his place immediately.
To not speculate is not telling the truth IMHO.

As someone who became a FM fan when Time was the new album, I really don't care about the speculation of who, why, when, etc.

I care about new music, be that from Lindsey as a solo artist, Lindsey in FM, or Stevie, Mike and Neil in FM.

This band has been pretty much crazy from the beginning, from John McVie not joining the band that bore his name, to Peter leaving, Jeremy leaving, Danny being fired, Walker and Weston being fired, Peter and Nigel back again (and we can argue another time if Nigel was an FM member or not), and Welch quitting when he surely should have stayed. And that's just 7 or 8 years out of 51.

If there was any expectation that the band would end in any way different to how it lived its life, it wasn't from me.

This is pretty much my sentiment.

Some will also defend and support any corporate decision the band makes. If tomorrow they decided to wear Kiss make up and sign country, many would fall in line.
I guess what irks me the most especially in today's world of double standards men vs women is if Stevie was the one fired for wanting to promote her solo album.

Starting to get really frustrated and down about all the posting on other forums. It's one thing to be hurt, angry at the band or persons for what has happened, but another when you rip someones character apart and become rude, disrespectful and at the point of almost wishing a certain member dead.
The fact is, no one really knows what went down, none of us were in on any of the discussions, everything is second-hand news. So I'm coming here for rest and to go forward with whatever direction the band takes us. I am very grateful that we have had as many years as we did, that all the band members are still alive and working. Yes, I need a breath of fresh air.

I remember hearing an interview with Mike Campbell on Sirius XM after Tom Petty's death. He was talking about continuing to be creative with his music career. So maybe he will funnel that creativity into Fleetwood Mac.

I don't fully understand your point. Lindsey is out, his fans hate Stevie and believe Lindsey can do no wrong and it is all the fault of the other band members that he's out. If Stevie was out, her fans would hate Lindsey and believe that Steve could do no wrong and it is all the fault of the other band members that she was out. Only difference being, like it or not, she probably has more fans.

As for the Kiss makeup and country, if the music was good, we would listen because ultimately its about the music.

Agree.

It's a little creepy when fans start putting together their own narrative based on what they see on social media.

I'm in it for the music and have enough drama in my own personal life. I can't imagine getting so engrossed in the drama of people I don't know personally.

Also - this band is mostly in their 70's. They should do what they want when they want.
I'm just happy they still have the desire to play. None of them need the money, so the cash grab comments are pretty absurd.
They're like Bob Dylan or the Heartbreakers in that they do what they love.

Some people have a tremendous amount of free time on their hands.

That's been my feeling. They should do what they want and they don't owe me anything with regard to actions or explanations.

I'm just glad they're all still alive. Alive and willing to tour? Even better.

I don't get the cash grab talk either. Their ability to tour and make money doing this is reaching the end of its shelf-life; they should go ahead and make all the money they can while they can. The fact that in this stage of their lives and careers they can still pack arenas and get paid buckets of money to do it (rather than playing small venues or county fairs like all but the very tops of their generation)? More power to 'em.

If I knew how I'd insert that "Shut up and take my money!" meme here. ;)

I honestly think some fans are losing more sleep and getting more worked up about this than Lindsey probably is. As much as some people seem to hate Stevie, you'd think they'd be relieved that they are now free to see him in smaller, more intimate venues and without having to hear her stories or "goat" singing. :shrug:

I don't know if another album with all five is realistic. If it is done, I think it would be very phony and nothing like the original greatness. This band keeps using marriage and divorce analogies which seem soap opera dramatic but in their case probably apply. Expecting them to go back to that setup is probably like asking a long divorced couple to get hitched again. Something is irretrievably broken and nothing they can do about it.

And at this point in their lives, may also be a risk. We're seeing artists not taking care of themselves, self medicating with new painkillers, while still doing big shows and long tours just dropping left right and centre.

I just wish them all health and happiness whatever they're doing. That's the important thing.

They've got in a rut which isn't much fun. I go to very few concerts as it's a long way to travel, a lot of planning. I went to last tour only because Christine was back. But I don't want to see bands just rotating set list.

At first when I heard about this I thought wtf? and it's obvious something has gone down between various members. But depending on new set list, I may be intrigued enough to check it out. And see some of the traditional pre Buckingham/Nicks work shine. (I say that as a huge Rumours fan too!)

Ha ha, did you see that someone on the Rumours side of the forum is branding those that would like to come here to have a quiet place for discussion as the "Children of Stevie"? Nope, no cult here, just nice to get a breath of fresh air to discuss things like an adult instead of name-calling and hysteria. Besides, shouldn't some of those folks be glad there are people here having discussions about the current line-up after the constant "this should be moved to the Post-Rumours forum" drumbeat? (as if the band has ceased to be an entity now) :rolleyes:

Interesting take, because I've often thought "Goodness, how old are you?" when reading some things on the Rumours forum. :]

I don't hang out over here because I've got some "Stevie can do no wrong" complex, I visit this forum to talk about an upcoming tour that I'm looking forward to featuring four senior citizens that for whatever reason are no longer hanging out with the fifth senior citizen. And because I don't feel the need to get that worked up about that decision. Life's too short.

I didn't see that because I'm spending very little time in that forum now, but it wouldn't take me more than two, maybe three, guesses as to who that was. And you are right, there was so much insistence that the new incarnation only be talked about in the Post Rumours forum, and now that we're doing it, they are still griping. Truly some pieces of work over there.

Yes, this forum IS a relief... except for the odd pornography threads, or whatever they are :laugh:

Right--There's 3 of them for God's sake. WTH

Yep, don't recall that ever happening on the Ledge before and I've been visiting here on and off for more than 20 years. :(

I've seen a couple here before, but it's odd they're only on the post-Rumours board and not the other ones.

I'm just thankful the moderators catch them and delete them so quickly. Great job, guys! :angel:

As I've already said in another thread on the Rumours forum, discussions about the new line-up in our opinion (meaning we Moderators) should stay in the Rumours forum. If anyone feels more at ease here it's not a problem at all but I don't see why anyone should give up the right to post there.

About the spam threads, we Moderators try our best but the site is old now, the web isn't the same as two decades ago, and as you can imagine we also have other commitments during the day.

Thank you for clarifying.

I think I wish to stay here. I know that moderators have difficult thankless job at times, and this situation with change in the group was unexpected. Emotions are running high and that's natural when we first hear news such as this. But if I may say so, I wasn't feeling comfortable with what felt was 'character assassination' in the Rumours forum, people suggesting going and heckling the group at their shows etc. That is concerning to me and I personally feel is out of line and irresponsible.

I could and maybe should have reported it privately and tried to continue, but right now have a lot going a lot going on in my life, my health balance is shaky, I'm supposed to be avoiding environments I find stressful so thought it was best I just move out of it all. At least until things cool off a bit. I'd rather step out than end up posting something inappropriate and out of proportion myself, that disrespects the standards of this board.

Peace and ty.

You guys are doing a great job, SisterNightroad! Keeping the peace may seem like a thankless job, but your efforts are much valued and appreciated.

As far as posting about the current lineup on Rumours vs post-Rumours, I'm torn. I think most people don't want to seem like they're rubbing Lindsey's firing in his fans faces when they talk about their excitement for the tour. I appreciate their feelings, which run the gamut from anger to sadness, so like I said, I'm torn.

I'm sorry to hear about your health issues. I hope you feel better soon. Yes, you are right, it is stressful wading through all the negativity over there. I keep telling myself I am going to step away and try to avoid all the fuss, but somehow I keep coming back to check for any real, solid news. Against my better judgement I snapped and got involved in an argument with one of the loudest voices over there. Perhaps I should take the high road and try to make peace with them. Fighting over a bunch of people none of us know isn't worth stress and bad feelings.

Realistically though, this is a new line-up, a post Rumours lineup. If Billy and Rick and Dave and Bekka were post-Rumours then Neil and Mike should be too.

There is absolutely nothing different now than there was in 1987.

I don't think any of us criticize the moderators. There's no doubt that this place isn't the same since Michele left, like it or not.

Its an old site, that is out of date, incomplete and not going anywhere fast. It needs an owner with resources and a commitment to recording the legacy of Fleetwood Mac. At this late stage in the game I can't see that happening.

Yes, but obviously this isn't the Post Rumours band at all since neither Mike nor Neil have anything to do with Billy, Rick, Dave and Becca, so idealistically it would need a forum of its own, but realistically on an old site like this one it's impossible without overpowering anything.
You also have to think that any sub-forum of this site in reality was meant to talk in a retrospective manner about its subject (saving Chit Chat I guess), so even the Rumours forum is actually about the band from 1975 to 1987. By the time The Dance came noone expected a reunion so from that point onward the Rumours board has been used for every subsequent output for convenience.

Michele hasn't left, she just sold the site, so she's not the owner anymore and doesn't have all the economical burdens that come with that, but she's still the administrator.

I'm feeling confused - but I guess many of us are because it just is confusing after awhile with all the various incarnations this band has been through!

They're talking about this new combination with Mike and Neil as if it's a new entity, 'a brand new band', and saying that the new members are not just temporary replacements on the road, even if it's all in the initial stages right now.

There are probably many people on this board who are always going to regard 'the true Fleetwood Mac' as the five members of Rumours. (I can sympathise because there is nothing like that lineup, even though I have respect for the other lineups.)

I'm not a big Heartbreakers fan so I don't know much about Mike Campbell, but obviously he's had his own very illustrious career, as has Neil Finn - whose career I started following in the 1980s. He's a 'legend' in his own right in Oceania as a singer/songwriter, with a notable catalogue. He brings with him a long list of his own credentials.

Feeling very torn atm because I respect both Lindsey and Neil as musicians and music creators, in their own right. It feels wrong to me to pit them against each other, or try to judge between them because they're both so worthy on their own terms. As was Peter Green. I can't even go there.

Just a shame that there's bad feeling over this, which isn't very auspicious for the newcomers. The band are trying to tone it down as being a scheduling conflict, though many of the fans obviously think there's more to it.

I honestly don't think however that Neil Finn would support unfair treatment of another great artist. He believes in his craft, and has had enough success of his own that he doesn't need to do anything for money. Nor does he seem the type who would do something just for fanfare or financial reward.

Not trying to prove any point here! Just my own mixed feelings and emotions about everything atm. Sorry if I'm rambling :rolleyes:... take care everyone.

It's a shame that there's such bad feelings here and this forum community can't enjoy discussions and anticipating a tour as in years past (at least distant past...I was more of a Ledge poster back during The Dance and SYW Tours)...but I think the bad feeling is much more obvious here in this little fishbowl. I think the the public at large, if they care at all and pay attention to even know Lindsey is gone, there's been more of a "oh, that's too bad was hoping to see them all together" to a "crazy old band still crazy" reaction. :lol: People moved on and will buy tickets or won't. I expect the tour to still do well and I expect to still go and have a great time.

As for the newcomers, I've always enjoyed TP and the Heartbreakers and love Mike Campbell. In addition to his work with Tom Petty and with Stevie, he's also worked with Don Henley writing my two favorite solo Henley songs. I'm glad he's got something to do now that Tom's gone and I'm really excited to see him this tour.

I'm far less familiar with Neil Finn. Outside of Don't Dream It's Over I'm unfamiliar with his work. I really like his voice, though, and given the recent live footage of Don't Dream It's Over shown on the CBS interview it sounds like his voice is in great shape; I'm looking forward to hearing more from him and seeing how the harmonies turn out on the upcoming FM tour. :)

I appreciate your (and others) sharing more info on Neil for those like me who aren't very familiar with his work. :)

It's kind of like going to a party and no one's there. All the fun and excitement is happening somewhere else. We'll see. :woohoo:

Besides relief is for pussies! :lol:

jwd, please quit with the name calling :laugh:

Just kidding, couldn't resist!

Someone said this elsewhere, about Stevie and Lindsey: "She's worked with him through worse times. Why, in her mid-60's, when the band is in it's final stages, would she decide to make a move now? It doesn't make sense." http://ledge.fleetwoodmac.net/showpo...45&postcount=1

That's how I feel - if they had insisted Lindsey stayed, I think she still would've gone with them. In her solo career, she gets to do what she wants. Then when she returns to FM, she's amenable to what the majority want to do.

Honestly, if it were Stevie or Christine departing, I wouldn't be getting as worked up as some others are about this happening. Or think it was end of the world.

Ty - this weekend I think I'm gonna do a crash course in Mike Campbell!

From Neil, I also like 'One Step Ahead' and 'Message To My Girl' with Split Enz. 'You Better Be Home Soon' with Crowded House. There are many others (I don't want to go overboard:D)

He writes clever lyrics with very catchy hooks. Many would say he's in the top five best songwriters from this part of the world, of all time. I certainly would.

He just did a show with Mike Campbell joining for a try at 'Man Of The World'. Reviews have been very positive but we're unlikely to see footage because apparently recording is strictly not allowed at the venue.

Some people believe that Stevie was there too, though she didn't get on stage. Discussion here in Neil Finn section of a forum. (They've noticed this forum too!)

http://www.frenzforum.com/topic/neil...75276121814383

I guarantee that once there is some actual tangible activity from this band, and by that I mean something that isn’t a news show to announce they fired Lindsey. The first concert taking place for sure will make a difference but even just one good TV performance will change many minds (not all but many) and any sort of even remotely concrete recording news will turn the vibes around immediately. Neil Finn already said today on Sirius that he thinks the band will record new music.

Yes that would be a good move, once the musicians get a bit used to each other. There would be more confidence in this lineup.

If things go okay, I can definitely see a creative collaboration coming out of it. It will probably be more of a true 'team effort' than anything else FM has done in a long time.

I think Neil's voice will blend in well with both Christine and Stevie.

(Trying to figure out how to get SiriusXM in Australia - don't know if I can, damnit! Still looking around...)

Don't know if this has been mentioned previously - Neil's first group Split Enz toured with Tom Petty in 1981. Apparently Tom Petty was a fan of the group. Stevie Nicks was also on that tour sometimes, and Neil recalled her being present, though doesn't sound like they all hung out together much.

Neil and Mike also both helped write songs for the Dixie Chicks album 'Taking The Long Way'. You learn something new every day huh?

http://rocktourdatabase.com/sites/ro...981-07-21a.jpg

Missy, thanks for the info- what a small world that the Heartbreakers toured with Split Enz back in the day! And now Mike and Neil are in Fleetwood Mac.