I wasn't aware that she never agreed with it. So she was surprised to hear that Lindsey was fired after getting back to London. Does this mean that she had NO IDEA of what was going on within the band? No input as to what the band should do concerning the touring schedule conflict? And we don't even know if there was anything else that went down to cause the split. Whatever it was, she went along with the bands' decision. Yes, Christine McVie, one of the most venerable members of the band, was clueless.



Yes, we can agree with that, in part. Chris has had quite an illustrious legacy with FM. But let me remind you, that although you seem to think that everything after '98 didn't matter, after Chris took her leave, was when Lindsey took the reins and led the band through the next 20 years. He kept them alive. I think that's an important part of the journey, considering for the most part it is why this latest incarnation of FM is around today. Yeah, Chris is sitting pretty after her 16 yr. hiatus, which I don't begrudge her a bit, nestled in that comfy cash cow known as FM. And the man that kept it together for the last two decades is FIRED! That's some good principle there!



Yes Lindsey does get it, and I feel that at least through comments his family has made, is that he's been screwed. Perhaps his fans have the right to be ticked off, considering that he's no longer in a band that he's helped mold and shape, and been largely responsible for their sound since 1975. No, not many people would leave FM. Don't you know it's all about the money! Diamonds are a girl's best friend.

Lindsey Buckingham Finally Explained His Fleetwood Mac Departurehttps://t.co/srsDHm8eNi

— Kip Brockett �� (@KipBrockett) May 14, 2018

https://www.cinemablend.com/pop/2419...-mac-departure

POP
Lindsey Buckingham Finally Explained His Fleetwood Mac Departure
BY WILL ASHTON

Lindsey Buckingham "Big Love" Official Live Video

On April 9th, it was announced that Lindsay Buckingham was no longer a member of Fleetwood Mac. Over 40 years since the singer/songwriter/guitarist joined the world-renowned band, Buckingham either quit the beloved group (again) or he was effectively fired. Rumors had it (no pun intended) that he left the iconic band involuntarily, as was suggested by fellow guitarist Billy Burnette. One of the reasons why Buckingham's departure has been mysterious is because we haven't heard from Buckingham himself since he divorced from Fleetwood Mac. Buckingham has only been involved in a limited number of public engagements in 2018, but the musician was seen publicly again on Friday at a campaign fundraiser for environmental attorney Mike Levin. It was there where Buckingham finally opened up about the much-publicized split. Here's what the rocker had to say:

For me, personally, probably some of you know that for the last three months I have sadly taken leave of my band of 43 years, Fleetwood Mac. This was not something that was really my doing or my choice. I think what you would say is that there were factions within the band that had lost their perspective. The point is that they'd lost their perspective. What that did was to harm -- and this is the only thing I'm really sad about, the rest of it becomes an opportunity -- it harmed the 43-year legacy that we had worked so hard to build, and that legacy was really about rising above difficulties in order to fulfill one's higher truth and one's higher destiny.

Lindsay Buckingham's words, as recounted by a user on Medium, don't specify any Fleetwood Mac band member in particular, although people surrounding the legendary musician at the public event were quick to point fingers at Stevie Nicks, and a few people in attendance weren't afraid to use explicit language when it came to voicing their disdain for her behavior. however, at the fundraiser, which was held to give Mike Levin a chance to represent the 49th Congressional District of California as the Democratic candidate, Buckingham made an effort not to express ill-feelings towards Stevie or any of the other specific band members.

This is not the first time Lindsey Buckingham has separated from Fleetwood Mac, as he previously left the band between the releases of 1987's Tango in the Night and 1997's The Dance, but it's the first time Buckingham didn't choose to leave. We're sure he has more to say, but those words will arrive on a different day. Since Lindsey's exit from the rock band, the veteran rocker has since been replaced by not one, but two separate musicians (which should hopefully serve as a testament to Buckingham's impact in the monumental band). Neil Finn and former Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers bandmate Mike Campbell are filling in for Buckingham now, particularly as they are preparing to tour once again starting in the fall. The tour begins on October 3rd, to be precise, in Tulsa, OK.


Meanwhile, Mick Fleetwood also opened up about Lindsey Buckingham's departure recently. He admitted that it wasn't a "happy situation" with Fleetwood Mac, his partial namesake, and that they needed to make a decision for the good of the band, also noting they felt it was time for Lindsey Buckingham to go. A "majority rule" made the hard choice. In any case, this isn't the last time we'll hear about this split.

i completely agree with everything you wrote here. especially the highlighted parts. including that LB probably did originally asked for delay (although most probably Nov 2018 and not 2019) and then backed off by the time of Musicares. which means at the time they fired him the reasoning Mick and Stevie keep citing was not there anymore.

so no arguments from me - from what i can tell you are basically saying the same as most LB, FM, BN and disappointed SN fans here.

from everything you say above and what we can piece together there was no good reason to fire LB, while there were many good reasons to fire SN over the last decade.

Basically yes, except I am acknowledging that the remaining 4 and their management thought there was a reason to fire him....fans and LB and his family and his band just disagree and are disappointed. But the band had their reasons.

Just like they had their reasons *not* to fire Stevie over the years, when it would have been their right to do so.

I don't see any sides as lying...just different perspectives...that fans are not going to necessarily agree with.

While I am disappointed, I am not going to spend time and energy hating or insulting Stevie, Christine, Mick, or John, or waste time hoping the tour fails financially or critically.

I am trying also not to argue with fans who are very upset because I agree no one should tell people how they feel. And I feel bad and how I acted right after this happened. The above paragraph is just stating how I feel and how I am trying to respond to this latest chapter going forward, not saying that anyone is "wrong" if they feel/act differently

thank you! such a refreshing attitude. :nod: :cool:

https://www.guitarworld.com/artists/...ir-perspective

Lindsey Buckingham Responds to Fleetwood Mac Firing: "They'd Lost Their Perspective"
“It harmed the 43-year legacy that we had worked so hard to build.”
DAMIAN FANELLI

Lindsey Buckingham performs with Fleetwood Mac in New York City on January 26.

Kevin Mazur/Getty Images for NARAS

Despite his lengthy and celebrated tenure with Fleetwood Mac, the iconic British/American band relieved guitarist Lindsey Buckingham of his duties just over a month ago. This past Friday night, Buckingham publicly addressed the firing for the first time—while performing at a campaign fundraiser for California Democratic congressional candidate Mike Levin.

"It's been an interesting time on a lot of levels," Buckingham told the crowd. "For me, personally, probably some of you know that for the last three months I have sadly taken leave of my band of 43 years, Fleetwood Mac. This was not something that was really my doing or my choice. I think what you would say is that there were factions within the band that had lost their perspective [a female fan shouts, '**** Stevie Nicks!', prompting Buckingham to raise his hand].

"Well, it doesn't really matter. The point is that they'd lost their perspective. What that did was to harm— and this is the only thing I'm really sad about, the rest of it becomes an opportunity— it harmed the 43-year legacy that we had worked so hard to build [another fan chimes in, 'That you built, Lindsey']. That legacy was really about rising above difficulties in order to fulfill one's higher truth and one's higher destiny."

It should be noted that "43 years" is actually more like "33 years" (when you pull out the ol' iPhone calculator). Buckingham joined Fleetwood Mac a few months after guitarist/singer Bob Welch quit in 1974. Buckingham made his recording debut with the crew on 1975's Fleetwood Mac, which spawned several hits, including "Rhiannon," "Landslide" and "Say You Love Me." He also was a major driving force behind two of their most iconic albums (of their "pop" period, anyway), 1977's Rumours and 1979's Tusk. That said, Buckingham left Fleetwood Mac in 1987—only to rejoin the gang 10 years later. He had been with them ever since—until the firing, of course.

"Words like 'fired' are ugly references as far as I'm concerned," drummer and band cofounder Mick Fleetwood told Rolling Stone last month. "Not to hedge around, but we arrived at the impasse of hitting a brick wall. This was not a happy situation for us in terms of the logistics of a functioning band. To that purpose, we made a decision that we could not go on with him. Majority rules in term of what we need to do as a band and go forward."

Buckingham was replaced by two guitarists—the late Tom Petty's former right-hand man, Mike Campbell, and Neil Finn, he of Split Enz and Crowded House fame. The new version of Fleetwood Mac recently announced a 2018 tour, and you can see all the dates right here.

I agree with every word! I would never, ever condone violence and incidents where that happened were flat out wrong, no matter what the circumstance.
But I think the idea some people have that Lindsey was the only one who was mean is ridiculous. I don't doubt he was mean to her, but I am 100% convinced she was mean right back and probably initiated dozens of arguments herself. Others who were around in those days said the same thing as well.
There were also those audio tapes of Sara Fleetwood and Beverly Vance talking about Stevie and I remember Beverly mentioning that she used to hook up with Lindsey at some point and Stevie and her whole posse knew about it and they really gave her a hard time about it and I think Sara mentions that Stevie would start fights with Lindsey when she'd hear about him and other girls or if he brought someone around. It was definitely a two-way street.

Yes, I mean, if we're going to come up with a story to justify Christine's behavior, we should at least all agree here! :laugh:

Did she go back to London before the voting and she was never asked about her opinión?
Did she voted against firing Lindsey but it didn't matter because power couple had already made their mind?
Was she asked while in London and she didn't care because she knew power couple had already won?

What is it gonna be? :shrug:

if it happened nowadays days they would have been both picked up by the police probably, if somebody reported those fights. like Paul Simon and his wife, or whoever that was.

that's the option i heard her say happened, so that's the one i will go with.

In the CBS debacle, it sounded like she was told not asked, furthermore, didn't she go so far as to say the plan was to tour with Lindsey...something like that... Mick was VERY displeased with that comment.

yes, exactly.

Their reasoning for voting without her is suspect. Were they protecting her potential future working relationship with Lindsey? Did they go behind her back to avoid her resistance? Or, did they go behind her back before she could get to John, thus preventing her and Lindsey from blocking them?

The other thing that gets me is the language they’re using. “Lindsey will not be participating on THIS tour,” “firing is too strong a word,” and “taken leave” all suggest that whatever is going on isn’t necessarily permanent. I think Lindsey is still a member of the band, at least legally, and that he actually is only on involuntary leave, not fired. The fact that none of them, except Stevie, has been absolute in their language says a lot.

I've noticed that too--could it be for legal reasons (gotta be hard to boot someone after 30+ years?)? Mick was very clear on not using the word fired. The thing that really gets me is the press release they issued "The band wishes Lindsey the best" Talk about a kick where it hurts...that was awful. Part of me thinks if they handled it better/smarter from the outset, would they be reeling in this backlash now? Who knows? But yes, I have noticed the language is suspect to say the least.
Has Stevie been absolute in her language--heard her say "She's sad" and we know she wants to twirl around her house, but has she said something so finite yet? I have admittedly tuned some stuff out--so could have missed.
Regardless--I definitely agree with you. thx!

oh i like that option. and completely possible. of course John should have called her and discuss with her too, if he was smart. :shrug:

yeah i read it that way, legally, since the first time i read their official statement. they wanted him to leave voluntarily and be out. he said no and started fighting it. i think he's still legally a member. but that may not last forever, if they didn't reach some kind of settlement and are still in legal standstill. maybe they did reach a settlement though, since they are going on with the tour, and he was telling fans on Friday he is too with his solo tour.

Is it possible to download these tapes anywhere?

https://www.mediafire.com/folder/acz...ra_%26_Beverly

Here you go! I didn't upload these, I really don't remember where I found the link I just had it saved, so props to whoever put these up! For what it's worth, they are, for the most part, really long and boring. None of them band members, just friends talking about random things with the occasional somewhat juicy tidbit. I didn't listen to the whole thing, just skipped through it.

They probably knew Christine would be against it given all her praise she had for Lindsey last year. So that would have meant another "impasse" (as Mick put it). Stevie & Mick were for Lindsey's firing and John & Christine against. I read in an interview that Stevie & Mick had to talk John into voting with them and after that they told Christine about it. On the flip side I've heard that all hell broke loose after MusiCares and she was the first one to hop on a plane to London. Maybe that's why she didn't know any of the details. I don't know what to believe anymore. But I agree with you, it's suspect that they voted without her not to mention plain weird because she's a member of the band.

Thanks for the link!

That’s what she said. The others said they got John to vote with them to force Lindsey out.

It might mean she didn’t know ousting Lindsey was in the cards.

We’re all only fans, and none of us are qualified to answer that question. All I’m saying is that based on all that has been said up until now, it’s pretty clear that Christine was not part of the decision to oust Lindsey, and based on the tone of what she has said, she was not especially happy about it. But, Mick and John are her family, and she’ll always pick them over the others. That’s just a reality within Fleetwood Mac, especially at this stage.

You got me. SYW, EP, and a couple of oldies tours are the shining pinnacle of the legacy of Fleetwood Mac.

But, and this seems to be the point you’re missing, by saying “factions,” he implies that not everyone agreed with what happened. He’s implying that he doesn’t blame Christine with that statement.

Lindsey was lucky to have had the opportunity to join a well established band that had a solid record contract, was big enough to be getting played on the radio, was big enough to sell out places like the Fillmore, had been on national TV, was self-managed and free of external pressures, and was just under the radar enough where the label didn’t care what the band gave them. That what was left of that band was a rhythm section and a singer/songwriter used to being just a third should have been a dream come true. He basically had carte blanche within the confides of being in a band to do whatever he wanted. That’s a hell of an opportunity/outlet. The sad thing is that not only did he not appreciate it, he resented and felt held back by it.

And, what Fleetwood Mac brought to Buckingham Nicks was greater than the other way around. Christine’s songs sounded more refined with Stevie and Lindsey, which is expected, since they spent probably as much time recording that first album as they did all of the Bob Welch era albums combined, but the fundamentals of her songs weren’t that all that different. “Over My Head” could have just as easily been on HAHTF. “Rhiannon,” OTOH, went from sounding a typical bar band song with Buckingham Nicks to sounding like an epic rock masterpiece with Fleetwood Mac.

If Lindsey had left after they decided to call the the album something other than Fleetwood and not fed us that “it just felt like a duet album” line of crap, I might be inclined to agree, but Lindsey is the one who said close your eyes, grab the money, and run. So, he’s not exactly pure in that regard, either.

I was thinking about the timeline...

When did Christine get back from London? Were Mick and Stevie auditioning singers and calling Mike Campbell before she even knew Lindsey was out?

When exactly was this said?

Lindsey wanted a final Fleetwood Mac album more than anyone. It's ridiculous to say he was gunning for the money from the tours. No doubt he definitely wanted the money and that had a big part, but he was the main one actually pushing to make an album and put out something new. He wanted the album for years and it didn't happen and I'm sure he was very frustrated by it.

My gut feeling is that there was a huge blowout, and when they decided Lindsey was out, Mike Campbell was the first and only name thrown out, Without much though behind it. It was obvious that TPATH were heavily on Stevie’s mind from her Musicares speech.

I see it going like this.

Blowout…

Stevie: I can’t work with him anymore.

Mick: Okay, but who are we going to get on guitar?

Stevie: Let’s get Mike Campbell. He likes playing Peter Green songs.

Mick: Okay, that could be interesting.

I sympathize with him on that, but if I’m being honest, Stevie may have a point about his production style. It is fairly sui generis and not necessarily appropriate for her songs. I’ve listened to some of the demos, and I can see where she would want something more simple and straight forward. “Silver Girl” is a good example. It didn’t need to be that produced. However, she should have been more involved with that album if she wanted something different for her songs.

I agree. I've always thought her displeasure with some of SYW songs had a big part in her not wanting to get back in the studio with him as producer. I myself even wondered that the BuckVie album would be a lot like Say You Will (which personally I think is fine as an album, not remarkable or anything, just some songs are overproduced) so I was very pleasantly surprised it. I think he reeled it in a little bit and Christine likely made it clear what she wanted so the album turned out great if you ask me. Better than Say You Will, reminds me a lot of Mirage.
I think had Stevie given him the chance, he could've done nice things on her songs but she would not budge.

A song like Everybody Finds Out, beautifully written, would be amazing on an album like BuckVie.

If you go back and listen to her songs on Say You will LB did a great job. Silver Girl is not a great song and LB did as much as he could with it.

Agreed. I think the main problem with SYW is the running order.

And Silver Girl was just awful. So nasal and lacks melody imo.

This album needed to be edited. Not much wrong with the production.

To be fair, I'd argue several of the songs were overproduced; Illume had those distracting weird voices; Say Goodbye had the unnaturally sped up guitars needlessly taking away from the song; most infamously, Smile At You was downright ruined.

I was never a huge fan of that album, but if you paired it down to one it would have been really good. Yes Illume had those wierd voices and I agree they were bad, but the song just isn't that great. It's got a bout 3 notes in it. Say Goodbye should have been done closer to they way they performed it live. But he did a great job on some of her other songs. I liked Smile at you, thought he made it more interesting.

IA, those were some of the worst of the bunch in terms of production. The others of her songs were mostly fine and I actually really liked Thrown Down and Goodbye Baby.
IMO the worst song was Say You Will itself but that's not because of the production...the song itself is just awful. It sounds like a kindergarteners rhyme on crack.

Silver Girl drags, and if you listen to her demo in the documentary, he didn't actually change it much from her demo. She doesn't bring plinky piano demos in anymore to him, she spends time with her other musicians to bring more fleshed out production ideas to him. Her demo had flute on it, and he changed that to some sort of synthesized keyboard that sort of mimicked a high flute-y sound and played almost just what was on her demo. So it was one of her new found drone-y songs (she would repeat the same style on Cheaper Than Free and even on You May Be The One -- but Dave salvaged the latter one with his acoustic guitar; CTF was beyond salvage). It's like her "poems" are just long lists of words anymore. That's why I like Destiny Rules (even tho she cribs the same lines in Illume)-- he did a great job on DR with the guitar.

Thank you!!! I get so tired of hearing Lindsey talk about the "machine" that is Fleetwood Mac. He wanted his freedom, he wanted to work on solo material and on and on and on. Honestly, I can't remember him ever saying how much he appreciates Fleetwood Mac, how much he enjoys being in Fleetwood Mac, how he wouldn't trade it for anything. Instead, the closest he can come is to say I'm sad because we have always worked through the "disfunction." Then of course, the plug..."everything else is turned into a positive." Oh yes, your precious solo material, lest we forget.

How about saying something positive about the band? How about saying how much they have given you rather than the other way around.

Honestly, I like Lindsey, he's *close* to being my favorite member and yes, he is by far the nicest and most generous when it comes to fans. But holy hell, the band must get sick and tired of hearing how they are such a thorn in his side.

I agree with Stevie. Being 70 years old, she has the right to want to be happy.

I hate what they did to her voice on BV. Listen to In the Meantime which was a few years before that and her warm, honeyed voice is still there. He and Froom effed around with too much pro tools crap on BV esp on her voice.:mad:

For me it's the complete other way around! I listened to some songs off ITM a while ago and I remember vividly noticing that her voice was different. Something about it was just... different to me. She sounded a lot more British than usual? She's obviously aging (her voice live is veeeeeeeeery hit or miss:sorry:) so it makes sense that her voice would be tweaked but I honestly thought it sounds more soft/natural on the BM album.

Also it wasn't exactly a few years. It was 12 years before.

A few years? It was more like twelve years.

Yeah it's been quite a long while since ITM and she's no spring chicken. I think it's the other way around and that LB had to fool around with her voice to make it sound PASSIBLE. This is NOT LB's fault. I mean you have heard her voice live lately right? Love Chris, but girlfriends voice is shot AF.

I get what you're saying, especially considering his repetitive speech about the big/small machine and all that, but I don't think that means he (in recent years) isn't grateful for the band. He's talked lovingly about the band multiple times and even wrote that song On With the Show from the BM album for the band.
I think he still wishes the band would be more 'out there' creatively but in general I think that was much more of an issue in the past than it has been in recent years and his speech about big/small machine is his weirdo way of accepting that. Plus I think he really valued that 'cycles'/coming full circle thing he always talked about. That's why he wanted them to do a final album, he really wanted to CREATE within the group and he valued wrapping up their final chapters.

Ironically Stevie is the one who I think has most treated Fleetwood Mac like a thorn in her side. Lindsey may have bitched about it but hey, he still did the work and got his job done. Stevie on the other hand has blown them off/complained about them a bunch of times, ever since her solo career took off. Her lack of availability during Tango in the Night, the album that was supposed to happen soon after The Dance but didn't, the album that was supposed to happen after Unleashed but didn't, the 2013 tour that was actually supposed to start in 2012 but she said no, when 24 KG came out and she was complaining that she couldn't promote it enough because of the FM tour, wouldn't record with them etc.

IA. I think she's maintained the overall tone of her voice much better than Stevie and Lindsey but I watched videos of performances from the BuckVie tour and yikes at how many bum notes she hits. Like, a lot. Stevie and Lindsey's voices are shot too but I never really hear them hitting bad notes?