Please read - Possible Release of Fleetwood Mac Videos on DVD...

[ThePenguin]

Hi--

Ok, here's the scoop. ;) I talked with Ken Caillat both yesterday and today, and what he is suggesting is his company, 5.1 Entertainment could license music videos for release to the online fans. A lot of this is still open for discussion but some important points are:

The release would be on DVD format so the sound and video quality would be outstanding. As they were not broadcast or distributed this way before, this would be the highest quality ever released. They also would look into releasing them on VHS as well (but the quality would be less). I asked about a European release and Ken said that DVDs here should play over there as well. They are going to look into this though too.

They were thinking 10 to 12 songs, arranged perhaps like an album. I suppose the emphasis would be on music videos, but perhaps performance videos, television appearances, and such might be possible. He'd like to know what we want and then he can find out about the licensing. I inquired about the different record labels but he thinks he could probably get videos from multiple labels as they are working as a third party. This would therefore permit Fleetwood Mac material as well as solo material to be included.

Distribution would be through The Penguin; they just wrote that the DVDs would have a retail value of $24.98 plus shipping/handling costs.

One important thing, however, is that they want to make sure sufficient demand is there for something like this-- they are requesting that we collect 10,000 names and email addresses before they proceed. Obviously, that is quite a lot and greatly exceeds the population here on The Ledges! I'm suggesting we iron out the details here and then pass it along to Ken. Once everything that can be set up on his end is taken care of, then we can start to collect the names and email addresses.

I think that if this particular project goes well, it might really capture Fleetwood Mac's interest and then we could hope for subsequent releases too!

Clearly, details are all still being decided upon so any and all of this could change, but this is how it stands right now.

So please discuss. I guess it would be good to prepare a few possible setlists and then we can vote.

- Marty

[Vianna]

This is a fabulous idea=:-) Put me down for a copy-that's one!!

I'd want the Gypsy video definitely; there's a performance clip of Stevie doing Sara I'd like (I think it's on Tusk Documentary?); Lindsey's Countdown video;and there's a performance clip of Stevie doing Rhiannon I'd like - it's on the Going Home video. O ther than that anything will do-I am sure to love it.

I hope this goes over well. If we could get the band interested in us, maybe we could get some of the other things we'd like.

Marty, thank you so much for doing this for us, and I am so grateful to Ken, too-please pass that on to him..

Vianna

How many people do you send the email update thing to these days? I know it was around 1600 wasn't it, a couple of years ago?

[d2brian]

Since it'd be limited to 10-12 tracks, perhaps it'd be best to put the 12 regular Fleetwood Mac videos on:

Tusk/Hold Me/Gypsy/Big Love/7 Wonders/Little Lies/Everywhere/As Long As.../Save Me/Skies The Limit/Paper Doll/Love Shines.

It'd probably satisfy the majority of the fans better than releasing specific band videos, which could probably end up being done seperately if the demand for the 1st DVD ends up being higher than anyone's imagined.

But no matter what happens, sign me up too, Marty! :nod:

~Brian

[Johnny Stew]

I posted a slight variation on this list on the Rumours Forum, but it bears re-posting.
And I really do feel a Fleetwood Mac video compilation should resemble the Bruce Springsteen DVD that's currently on the market... which contains a nice mix of both "concept videos" and live clips.
(Although the songs are listed chronologically, according to album, and in the order they were released as singles [for those that were singles], i'd rather see them mix the track-listing up a little. Otherwise you'd have 5 of Christine's videos, one right after the other.)

Over My Head (Midnight Special)
Rhiannon ("Rosebud")
Say You Love Me ("Rosebud")
World Turning (Midnight Special)
Go Your Own Way ("Rosebud") (hell, the entire Rosebud documentary needs released!!!)
Dreams (live promo clip, filmed in Paris)
Don't Stop (live promo clip, filmed in Paris)
You Make Loving Fun (filmed live in Japan)
The Chain (Mirage Tour)
Tusk
Sara (from the Tusk Documentary)
Not That Funny (Tusk Documentary)
Sisters Of The Moon (Mirage Tour)
Hold Me
Gypsy
Eyes Of The World (Mirage Tour)
Big Love
Seven Wonders
Little Lies
Everywhere
As Long As You Follow
Save Me
Skies The Limit
In The Back Of My Mind
Paper Doll
Love Shines
Silver Springs (from The Dance)
Bleed To Love Her (from The Dance)
Landslide (from The Dance)


I'm hoping they won't have to stick to a strict 12-track compilation... as there is SO much space on DVD, it would be a pity to use only approximately 60 minutes of it.


I also hope we're able to prove to the record company that there is enough interest in this.
Does it count that I am interested enough for about 75 people?
:D


Johnny Stew

[Johnny Stew]

Oops!
I read and then replied to this thread, and afterward I went back thru and read the other threads i hadn't had a chance to read before... only to see that Les had already posted my "wish-list" in the Music Video Compilation thread.


Sorry about the repeating of info!
:)


Johnny Stew
(could i have said the words "read" and "thread" more???)

[ThePenguin]

Vianna-- Our list is just under 2000-- the sign up is tied to photo gallery registration and isn't therefore very visible. I've been thinking about how to change that so more people see it.

Johnny Stew-- I'm thinking it has less to do with how much space a DVD can has for material and more for how much it will cost to license the songs. If we were to send 20,000 names then I'd think they could put more songs on there but 10,000 is going to be hard enough! We're going to have to trim your list (or another list) down to 10-12 songs (probably 12 :) ). I did send yours and Brian's to them yesterday just to show them two that were posted. As I mentioned if this goes well, I'm hoping it can be the first of a series of releases and then we would get more songs.

- Marty

[wetcamelfood]

I'd tend to agree with Brian's list for the initial release as most everyone would agree that the music video compilation is much overdue then hopefully if all goes well with this we could branch out into other areas for future releases.

Marty, I say great thanks to you too! let's hope we can get it all together. Did Ken say we should still write to David May regarding the CD re-release with bonus track idea or what? (as I'm just as interested in this area as much as the DVD stuff!)

John

[ThePenguin]

He didn't mention that we specifically should be writing about this to David May but he did say that he told him to expect a lot of requests.

I have an idea to beef up our mailing list with more people; I'll work on that this weekend as it could facilitate the collection of email addresses from at least 10,000 people.

- Marty

[DesertChildAZ]

Marty,

It is very important that you put together something that unregistered people can sign. I have several other Rock Mailing Lists that I'm on as well as other bands whose listeners highly respect Stevie & Fleetwood Mac. I'm sure they'd sign as well, but I'm not sure they are all willing to go through the trouble of registering. (I hate registering for different sites and will often abort rather than sign up.)

Let me know when you've created something, if you in fact intend to.

Thanks,

Kelly Anne

[ThePenguin]

Hiya Kelly Anne--

There will be no registration necessary to sign up for the list-- that's a good point you have. I found some petition software today that looks absolutely perfect for what we'll need and I'll start working on that later tonight. I've actually been spending the past couple of hours adding more questions and answers to Ken's Q&A. I could probably open up the petition for those to sign who would buy the DVD regardless of which videos are on it and then everybody else could wait until we've decided on an actual setlist here and Ken gives it the ok.

So has anyone come up with a setlist yet? I hope you are all thinking! :D

- Marty

[mylittledemon]

I think that's a great idea. The videos would be cool. But I am much more interested in shows like the Tusk tour documentary and the MIRAGE forum live show especially than the music videos. But the more Mac, the better. Put me down for 2 of em.

thanks

Brandon

[Gypsyblue]

Marty,
Thanks for putting this together!!!
Here's my wish list:

Rhiannon ( Here's a song that I KNOW there must be some live performances from the White Album tour .........I personally believe that best versions of Rhiannon done live were done on this tour.........when Stevie could hit all the high notes)


Sara ( a live performance from the Tusk Tour, is it possible to get something that has NEVER been seen before.......like from a show they did in Minnisota or some place like that???? I Think we've all seen the performance from they Tusk Documentery and also the one from Largo or Landover MD)

Gypsy ( I know there has to be other Live footage from the Mirage Tour)

Gypsy ( The Video of coarse:D )

Dreams ( From the Mirage tour)

Sisters of the Moon ( Anything live that has never been seen before)

The Chain ( From the Mirage Tour.......unrealesed performances)

These are the things I would REALLY love to see on the DVD.
I think were all mainly intererested in getting things that has never been seen or released before. I would really love to see a ledgendery peformance of Rhiannon from the White Tour, like the one from the King Biscuit Flour Hour.
Also any concert footage from the Mirage Tour that has never been seen before.

-Thanks again Marty

[Gypsyblue]

P.S.-

Please add my e-mail adressee to your list :
Greylinen@hotmail.com

[rhiannon1119]

Marty, I think this is a great idea! Please thank Ken for even considering this and also a big thanks to you!!

I agree with Brian's list. On the other hand, Gypsyblue had some great ideas as well. It is always nice to see the regular videos, but it is even better, sometimes to see never before seen footage.....and who knows, if this is really a huge success, we could be seeing greater things in the future!!

I would buy anything that they put on DVD for Fleetwood Mac!!!

:) Michelle

[Jo and Jensen]

I like the idea of a video DVD, but I think it should be the videos from the White Album to 'Tango'. The largest fan base is the 'Rumours' lineup. So maybe it could have the
'Rhiannon' video which is live
'Go Your Own Way' (live)
'Say You Love Me' (live)
'Over My Head' (live)
'Tusk'
'Sara' (live)
etc. until you reach the video on 'Tango'
I would really like to see a clear version of 'Paper Doll', too.

Love,
Jensen

[Jo and Jensen]

Marty...

Would concentrating on getting 'Mirage', the HBO In Concert Special, released first on DVD be easier?

This is something that everyone wants and it would eliminate the step of having to discuss a set list. I think this may generate the 10,000 names needed and then a video comilation can be proposed as a follow-up.

And then maybe the Tusk Tour Documentary and Disney 'Going Home' Special.


Jo :-)

[wetcamelfood]

I agree that previously unreleased stuff would be top priority but I'd still hate for them to take a song from an unseen concert and then have to buy it again later if they were to release the whole concert so I vote for avoiding duplication and chopping up concerts at all costs. If they do plan to jack up the price, we might as well get our moneys worth rather than them using all the marketing tricks like releasing a big set of stuff we already have but we'd still need to buy it because it has one thing on there we don't have you know what I mean? I know that's not the original plan anyways but it's just a fear of what could snowball that should be given some thought, I'm sure I'm not the only one that thinks this way.

Also, since they seem to want to test the waters with a singular release. I'd say Brian's list is the one which would guarantee them the sales figures they would hope for on the initial project (as, in addition to the fans, the more everyday customer may buy the music video disc as has been the case for artist such as Madonna's video collections) which would then hopefully make them feel more enthusiastic about possible future releases. Also, as the music videos use the studio recordings, I presume it would be easier for Ken to do his thing with the surround sound audio tracks on the videos and there would be more of a chance of the inclusion of "special features/bonus materials" like outtakes from videos (such as the ones from "Hold me") and "making of" footage (like the film that exists already of the making of "Gypsy") etc. Anyone else been thinking this? (I hope I'm not the only one!) As I say though, I will buy it regardless so if everyone wants to go with the other compilation idea then that's OK with me and I'll go along wit it, this is just my humble opinion.

John

[wetcamelfood]

As I was posting the above, I just saw the above post by Jo and Jensen, yes, I agree, maybe this would be easiest, and if it takes off as we are all sure that it will there won't be the urgency over the one release and what should go on it because I would hope at that point that as they would be happy with the sales results, they may be more flexible with more releases, space & time restrictions so it would then be a more relaxed discussion group over subsequent releases and the content therein. Once again though, I'll go along with the majority ruling because I'll take anything! What do you think Marty?

John

[nodmod]

Hi All

VH1 in the UK have shown a Greatest Hits package from Fleetwood Mac and the following videos were shown -

Everywhere, Hold Me, Family Man, Seven Wonders, Big Love, Rhiannon, Need Your Love So Bad, Gypsy, Little Lies, Save Me, Man Of The World, Isn't It Midnight and Go Your Own Way.

If we are resricted just to music videos on the first release may I suggest

Tusk
Hold Me
Gypsy
Big Love
Seven Wonders
Family Man
Isn't It Midnight (the video was a segment of the Tango Tour)
Little Lies
Everywhere
As Long as You Follow
Paper Doll
Love Shines
Save Me
Skies The Limit

plus - The Making of Gypsy and Big Love and the outtakes from Hold Me as bonus material on the DVD

Any thoughts?

[scorpiocgm]

I'd go for anything, but would be particularly interested in the Mirage HBO special, Tusk Documentary and the Disney Going Home special too!! Even better, would be some unreleased footage which might include interviews as well as concert footage.

[scorpiocgm]

Footage from the Rumours tour... backstage as well as live concert footage that was shot in Japan I think...:D :wavey:

[Johnny Stew]

Since an approximately 12-track compilation would be the most financially feasible to produce, I've written up a couple additional lists.
Obviously we'd have to have some kind of vote to narrow down which of these (or any others) would be the most popular choice.
I have tried to keep the tracks as even-handed as possible... trying to make sure each singer/songwriter is adequately represented, and that no one dominates the selection. But doing that can be difficult, as Lindsey has the least amount of singles/videos, and Christine has almost more than Stevie and Lindsey combined.

This first list compiles clips strictly from the Buckingham Nicks era:
Over My Head (Midnight Special)
Rhiannon ('Rosebud')
Go Your Own Way ('Rosebud')
Dreams (Paris soundcheck promo video)
Don't Stop (Paris promo video)
You Make Loving Fun (filmed live in Japan)
Tusk
Hold Me
Gypsy
Big Love
Seven Wonders
Little Lies


This second list includes clips from both the Buckingham Nicks era and the Post-Buckingham era."Everywhere" and "In The Back Of My Mind" are omitted, because, quite frankly, the band members aren't featured enough in those two videos, in my opinion[list=1]
Rhiannon ('Rosebud')
Go Your Own Way ('Rosebud')
Tusk
Hold Me
Gypsy
Big Love
Seven Wonders
Little Lies
As Long As You Follow
Save Me
Skies The Limit
Paper Doll
[/list=1]


This final list is a strict compilation of the "concept videos" from 1979-1993 only.
Of course, Christine completely dominates this list, as more videos were filmed for her singles than any of the other band members.
[list=1]
Tusk
Hold Me
Gypsy
Big Love
Seven Wonders
Little Lies
Everywhere
As Long As You Follow
Save Me
Skies The Limit
In The Back Of My Mind
Paper Doll
Love Shines
[/list=1]



Opinions?

Johnny Stew

[Gypsyblue]

:nod: I really like "Johnny Stews" lists , except that it does'nt include Sara:( I think the DVD should really include an unrealesed performance of Sara.
Someone also mentioned about putting in some behind the scenes footage or "making of" footage , I think that's a GREAT idea.
Another question that seems to come up is, is this going to be just a compilation of all the videos onto one DVD or will it be a compilation of different concert footage on one DVD??? If had to choose between the two I would really love a Live footage compilation DVD, that contains never before seen performances.
I personally think a video compilation of things already seen is nice, but to get a DVD of "Live" never before seen footage is even better!! :)

[ThePenguin]

Hi--

Ok, here's an update. I am working on preparing an online petition and its going quite well. I hope to have it up soon. I'll put it up now because there are a lot of us that, regardless of the 12 songs that are on it will assuredly purchase it. 10,000 is a lot...we should start collecting them as soon as possible. :D Others may want to know what is specifically going to be on it so we'll ammend that information as soon as we know it.

I inquired with Ken about some of the live performances that are in Warners' vaults. As we don't know specifically what they have its rather difficult for us to tell him specifically what we want-- especially for the never-before-seen stuff. He replied that he got a listing of Warners' vault contents last Thursday and is going to have it faxed to me; I guess this would be on Monday. We'll then have a much clearer idea of what is in there.

He had indicated that the Mirage video might be more difficult to release as the rights to that are owned by HBO.

This is also to be added to the Q&A in his latest answers:


Hi Ken! I've heard you say a lot about people's questions to release live recordings to the public. But what is the PROBABILITY that it could happen? I am a HUGE fan of a lot of they're live material from the Tusk tour, and would love to see some of it out. Do you think it can happen? Thanks!! (Graham Zebrasky, Brownsburg, Indiana, USA)
<p><blockquote><font color="#841010">
If not help from the outside, then Warners would have a less than 10% chance of releasing something live. Remember they already have the Dance out and the live album, they don't want to hurt sales on those, I promise you some exec at Warners knows he'd be canned for suggesting such a "stupid" idea as hurting sales of product they already have out. Plus, you know musicians, they're always excited on what they're working on now. The band probably would feel not inclined to release old stuff. I believe they'd think that their fans would think they're just releasing the old stuff to make money, which is exactly what labels do after a band is finished putting out new stuff. Look at the Beatles. Capitol is releasing <b>every possible</b> combination they can think of to make more money. We call it "milking the catalogue." I'm going to downgrade my estimate to 1%. Now if Marty can collect enough requests for this as well, we could probably license it.
</font></blockquote>
<p>


I'm really hoping that whatever we come up with here would prove that there is a fan base. Ken looks like he would be a powerful advocate for us to see this footage. If we get a strong showing and it is sucessful, then I would think that it would make subsequent releases much, much more possible. I'm, of course, hoping that we won't have to collect 10,000 names for each release too!

I'll try to have the petition scripts running within the next few days, if not sooner on The Penguin. We'll really need to get the word out about it too in order to get the required signatures.

- Marty

[nodmod]

[i]
This final list is a strict compilation of the "concept videos" from 1979-1993 only.
Of course, Christine completely dominates this list, as more videos were filmed for her singles than any of the other band members.
[list=1]
Tusk
Hold Me
Gypsy
Big Love
Seven Wonders
Little Lies
Everywhere
As Long As You Follow
Save Me
Skies The Limit
In The Back Of My Mind
Paper Doll
Love Shines
[/list=1]



Opinions?

Johnny Stew [/B]

Hey Johnny Stew - Don't forget the Family Man video, I think we could do without Isn't It Midnight as it is only a segment from the Tango Tour vid

[sulamith]

I would like to see the concept music videos mainly, but a few live performances would be OK, since that is the only way we would get certain songs like Sara and Rhiannon. As I said in the other forum, the "making of" and behind the scenes footage from the video sessions and interivews about the videos would be great, too. Those things were aired on MTV and VH1.
I would definitely buy it.
I WILL BUY WHATEVER THEY PUT OUT!!!

[Glittermoondust]

I thought I remembered seeing a video for Oh Diane as well that should be added to the list don't you think?? And I agree that Isn't it Midnight and Sara from the Tusk documentary should be left off just because it has already been released and would be released again if those concerts went on DVD. Rhiannon from the Midnight Special would be great though as that hasn't been officially released on anything yet :) Also if getting names might be a problem--could people that are going to some of Stevie's up coming concerts maybe leave some flyers around or something like that to get more signatures and get the word out?? Just a thought......

~Amy~

[d2brian]

I had no idea there were non-live clip videos for In The Back Of My Mind and Family Man. What were they like? And how could they have done a video for Family Man since Lindsey had already left?

~Brian

[Josh2003]

I know I, personally, would love to have a mix of concept videos and live clips.

And I know that there are a lot of fans of the Post-Rumors era, but would a lot of people be upset if they left off the Post-Rumours era videos (Save Me, Skies the Limit) in exchange for live footage of the Rumours era?

My thinking is that if we would want people OTHER than us die hard fans to buy the DVDs, too, the chances would probably be better if we stick with what was the most popular.

My list would be something like this:

Tusk
Gypsy
Hold Me
Big Love
Seven Wonders
Little Lies
Everywhere
and then 5 or 6 live songs, depending on what Marty finds out is in the Warners vault. Once I see THAT list, I'll definitely be able to make a more accurate choice :D

And like Marty even said, since this is the first time they've tried anything like this, and if it goes well, maybe we could do more, then why not start it out with something you know everyone will like? I say the first DVD should be "Rumours" era only, then if another one sould come along, throw in some of the other era's too. Just my opinion.

[ERigby818]

:blob1::blob2:
Heck, I'll buy it no matter what's on it, I trust his judgement for what the good stuff is, but I'd love for it to include all of the videos, including a Lindsey solo one (I haven't seen any so whichever is the best)!!
Thanks for doing this Marty!! Rock on!! :D
-Sonia
:wavey:

[marc402]

what a great thing that us fans (in numbers) can make it happen.
And i already want to THANK YOU MARTY AND KEN for al your trouble to try to make this possible you guys are the best!!!

I agree with brians setlist as long as we are limited to 12 tracks (he i'm happy with whatever i can get my hands on!!!
and he did a very good list THUMBS UP FOR YOU BRIAN!!

so this would be my list (or actualy brians (credit comes where credit is due)
Tusk/
Hold Me/
Gypsy/
Big Love/
7 Wonders/
Little Lies/
Everywhere/
As Long As.../
Save Me/
Skies The Limit/
Paper Doll/
Love Shines.

hope this works i'll pass along my email to every mack fan i know i promise!!!

[nodmod]

Originally posted by d2brian
I had no idea there were non-live clip videos for In The Back Of My Mind and Family Man. What were they like? And how could they have done a video for Family Man since Lindsey had already left?

The Family Man video was shot at the same time as the Seven Wonders vid, it is roughly the same as the Seven Wonders vid

[Johnny Stew]

Originally posted by nodmod


Hey Johnny Stew - Don't forget the Family Man video, I think we could do without Isn't It Midnight as it is only a segment from the Tango Tour vid


Hi Neil... I honestly had no clue that there was a video for "Family Man". I've never seen it, or even heard about it.
I see that you mentioned that it's similar to the "Seven Wonders" video... is it just "left-over" footage from that video that they used, or do you see Lindsey and the band actually performing "Family Man"?

I left videos such as "Isn't It Midnight" off the list, because, yes, they were merely clips lifted from the 'Tango' video.
Also, there were two videos for "Everywhere" in that there was a "concept video" featuring some gothic goings-on at an English manor (that showed brief, super-imposed glimpses of Christine, John and Mick, throughout the video)... and there was also the clip lifted from 'Tango.'

In my opinion, "Everywhere" and "In The Back Of My Mind" can very easily be left off. The main focus of each of those videos is not on the band, and when you do see any of the members, it's either very briefly ("Everywhere") or using previously seen concert footage ("In The Back Of My Mind").
I did, however, include "Paper Doll", because I feel that video is a cool little summation of the videos that have gone before it, and it's also a groovy nod to Fleetwood Mac's image (the writhing bodies that the footage is projected onto, look, in many fan's opinions, a lot like Lindsey and Stevie. Even though it's not them, of course.)


I can definitely be counted amongst those who will buy this release no matter what is included on it, but hopefully we'll be able to find some type of track-listing that will please most, if not all, of the fans.


Johnny Stew

[witchywoman]

I can't tell you how long I have hoped for this kind of news!!
Thanks Ken for your help.
:D I would like to see some of Lindsey's early stuff, but as
many have stated I would welcome any Fleetwood Mac
to my collection :laugh: Count me in :nod:
witchywoman

[wetcamelfood]

I know I've said this already in other threads, but just to agree with marc402 and Brian, it does seem the concept video idea would be the most initailly popular collection ("Tusk" through to "Love shines") and if we need to impress the company with sales so we can get further deals in the future, this is the most important first step so I'll vote for this and the "making of" video footage and outtakes from videos as bonus materials and/or special features on the disc if possible with the twelve vids but as I want any release badly, I'll go with whatever the majority vote is, I hope it's this though!

John

[d2brian]

Well, maybe since it's so rare, Family Man should be added to the proposed tracklisting. The Seven Wonders video rocks, so I imagine the Family Man one must, too. That, and it should be added for its rarity, like how most people don't realize there was a video for Love Shines.

~Brian

[Les]

Originally posted by d2brian
I had no idea there were non-live clip videos for In The Back Of My Mind and Family Man. What were they like? And how could they have done a video for Family Man since Lindsey had already left?

Honestly, I think y'all might be disappointed with the video for Family Man. It was released after Lindsey left, so the video is made up of old black and white footage of random people (families, I guess?) and interspersed with shots of the band that were clearly from the Seven Wonders video shoot. They show just enough of the band to make it look like they could be playing the song in question, but they edit it so that you never actually see anyone singing.

[nodmod]

Originally posted by Les


Honestly, I think y'all might be disappointed with the video for Family Man. It was released after Lindsey left, so the video is made up of old black and white footage of random people (families, I guess?) and interspersed with shots of the band that were clearly from the Seven Wonders video shoot. They show just enough of the band to make it look like they could be playing the song in question, but they edit it so that you never actually see anyone singing.

Yes I agree but I feel it is importent to have all the Fleetwood Mac videos on one release, that also goes for Everywhere (concept video) and In The Back Of My Mind.

We will only get one go at this and it would be nice if the video / DVD is complete and upto date to this present moment.

I still feel that bonus material on the DVD such as "The Making Of Gypsy, Big Love and Hold Me" is added to the DVD.

I presume we are talking a video and DVD release or is just one or the other?

[ThePenguin]

They were going to look into VHS in addition to DVD. When I designed the petition I put in an option to state your preference-- DVD or VHS. The quality on a DVD will obviously be much better but not everyone owns them yet.

Ken told me they will be faxing me the list of what is in Warners' vaults today so I'll transcribe it tonight and post it. Should be interesting!

- Marty

[Johnny Stew]

*lol*

Thank God we have so many knowledgeable fans around... together we should be able to get a really killer compilation put together.

Ok, for completist's sake, here's my updated updated list!!!

Concept Videos-only
[list=1]
Tusk
Hold Me
Gypsy
Big Love
Seven Wonders
Little Lies
Family Man
Everywhere
As Long As You Follow
Save Me
Skies The Limit
In The Back Of My Mind
Paper Doll
Love Shines
[/list=1]


Looks like a nice collection to me!
:D

Johnny Stew

[Skylark]

Marty and Ken C. and All Mac Fans!
Thank you for a wonderful,knowledgable Q&A! This is definitely the best ever...IMHO!!! :)
Since Iam not allowed to buy a sub-woffer I need to be able to buy this on VHI for me!!! :-(
But Iam happy for all you lucky fans who have the umbrella effect of DVD surround sound!
It must be just awesome! Perhaps when * my-ship* comes in!!!:eek:
Thanks again for the honor of your presence!
Cheers for The Fantastic F Mac Music!!!
Luv Ya', ~Sky~/cam :laugh::)

[Rumours]

YES YES YES YES YES YES YES!!!!!!
COUNT ME IN TOO!!!!
I agree--concept videos for now, with extra "making of" and outtake footage at the end........keep it complete........
We'll worry about all the live stuff later, after we get the ball rolling, so to speak, on this particular collection (whether it be on DVD or VHS).

Marty, does it have to be from just us here, on this site alone.......or could you check around, maybe with John Kinney at NicksFix, see if we can get some kind of like collaboration effort going?????? That can bring in some new names/email addy's..............

Stephanie :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

[wetcamelfood]

Oh yeah, killer! Great list Mr. Stew, nice and complete! All the concept videos seem to be there. I just hope that Ken will agree to there being 14 included. Didn't Marty say something about that it should be only 10-12 songs? Marty, do you think this will cause major mayhem in Ken's camp? Hopefully not, I for one will pay a few bucks extra if it means it's a complete collection of the (bands) music vids as I'm sure some of you guys will but hopefully this won't effect the price tag too much if this is even the issue in question. I certainly hope that we can squeeze them all in. I mean come on Ken, running time on this is only going to be an hour if we are lucky, (but I'll take it)!

John

[ThePenguin]

Hi--

Ken didn't send the list today; he wrote last night that when it is sent I can post it so I'll do that. He sent back another 5 answers for his Q&A and I'm going to add those tonight.

I would hope a lot of websites do help out with this whole thing. I had written to John Kinney last week and he said he would post about this on the Nicksfix news section when it happens. I have the petition all ready to go-- I just want to make sure the wording was all ok w/ Ken before I start it.

He had indicated 10-12 songs so that likely is the limit. Hopefully 12 instead of 10. ;)

- Marty

PS-- Richard Dashut has also agreed to do a Q&A according to Ken, although the format will be different then what we have done previously. We're still figuring it all out.

[RoxyRockstar]

Marty...has anyone told you how much you rock? I could just kiss you for putting this together! I would definitly love to have one of these if they do it.

Personally i don't care what they put on it...they could have all five of them just sitting there and i would be happy :D But i would definitly think something from early mac, some solo videos, like "Got a Hols On ME" and "Edge Of 17", maybe a interview clip or two of them discussing the videos and then the regular mac videos.
As for the concert footage, that could come or go, personally i want the entire concert than just one song.

[wetcamelfood]

If we do decide on the music video list, of course (Johnny Stew's great complete 14 song band vid list is above) I was wondering, if Ken's people are adamant that the limit is 12 songs, which two should we take out of this great 14 vid list? Not that we would want to but if they simply say that they will not include all 14 then how can we narrow this down (or preferrably get around it)?

I was also thinking about how with some vids like "Seven wonders" there were actually two versions (there's not much difference between the two, just a couple of shots that are in one that aren't in the other and vice versa but once again for completeness sake). I don't know if they would be willing to put one version under the "Special features/Bonus materials" section (which I'm sure we all agree we would want included as a section anyways for some of the "making of" footage (like for the "Gypsy" vid) and the outtakes (like Lindsey's attempted but unsuccessful glass smashing guitar throwing antics in the "Hold me" vid)) so I don't know if we would be allowed to stick some of the alternate versions of vids under that section to get around the space problem and still have it be as complete as possible or how to handle all of this. Any thoughts?

What do you guys think of either of these two confusing areas? (that is, if it does turn out we go with the music vids list in the end, I've already signed the petittion regardless of what's on there) Sorry for sticking my beak in all the time I'm just really excited about the possible releases. Hopefully the word can be spread far enough so we can get this thing done which we all want, here's hoping!

John

[Jo and Jensen]

In the case of a band like Fleetwood Mac that had songs way before the "concept video" explosion, I think we really have to reach back and put some live material on with the videos.
The "average" fan expects Rhiannon and Go Your Own Way with a major FM release.

Plus, if you look at the list of concept videos, it is WAY too lopsided towards Christine.

I would vote off the Family Man video since it doesn't feature the band, as well as Everywhere which is just really bizarre! IMHO. Where did they get that idea anyway?!

:-)

[Skylark]

Hi Jo & Jensen...
Good thread here...but...what is the difference of a music video for a song and a concept video?
My two to X would be Seven Wonders & Family Man! They DO not have much artistry just some moving around on a very large empty space! There are some "cute" moments but nothing significant!
DVD is exciting but gosh... 10,000 sales is a LOT to expect unless it could be promoted with the
new F Mac Album and world tour some way! Just MHO!!!
Cheers for the Mac! Luv Ya', ~Sky~ :)

[marc402]

BACK OF MY MIND and FAMILY MAN would be the ones i'll scrap from the perfect johny stew list (IF WE ARE LIMITED TO 12 and that seems too be the case right now) .
not that i have seen either one, and i would defenately like to, but out of the other 12 there are none i want to scrap.
I defenately would like to see SEVEN WONDERS and EVERYWHERE included.
Thanx again to everyone involved for trying to make this work!!!

[d2brian]

I was thinking scrapping Family Man & Tusk, because the Tusk video could just be on the Tusk documentary DVD. If that gets released.

But honestly, I'd rather have all 14. Even if it means paying an extra $5-$10 bucks.

~Brian

[Les]

Jo/Jensen brings up a good point in that by sticking only to 'concept' videos, we'll be very heavy on Christine's material since it was her songs that were most often chosen as singles.

I guess this brings up the discussion about how important it is to us to have the footage on this tape be distributed evenly among the different singers. If there is to be more equal representation, it may not be possible to stick only with concept videos.

So . . . this puts a few ideas up against each other here:

The purity of a complete concept video compilation vs. more varied coverage of the different singers through the inclusion of performance footage.

Just throwing one more rock in the pond. ;)

[ThePenguin]

Quote from Ken Caillat last night:


We can put at least 2 hours on a DVD maybe 3. The problem could be the licensing costs, the more we put on the more $$$/disk we pay, but don't worry about that now we'll figure out how to pay for it later, let's make the best disk we can!


I'd suggest going through the video list first and seeing what things we most likely *wouldn't* want first just to narrow it down. There is obviously enough footage on there for at least a dozen DVDs but we're only getting one at first.

- Marty

[Gypsyblue]

Marty,
I was wondering if Ken finally sent you that list ?? It would be nice to know exactly whats out there ( or in Warners "Vaults") to choose from. :D I'm dying to find out!!!!!

[ThePenguin]

It's posted right under this thread! Look at the top of the Q&A Ledge as I made it 'sticky'.

- Marty

[Gypsyblue]

Thanks Marty I found the "sticky" list :p
I just have one question, is that a list of audios or videos??
How do we tell which is which?

[ThePenguin]

It's all videos. The audio one was sent to me first and I started to transcribe it but took it down once the video list came.

[Gypsyblue]

Marty , forgive me for bring a "pain in the butt"
But is there any way you can find in your heart to post it here, I've been waiting for days........YEARS!!! to see that list......Pleaseeeee!!!
I sure I'm not the only one here who would like to have one more glimpse......PLEASE!!

[ThePenguin]

I don't think this was the list you were waiting for; I only got up to page 7 out of 17. All of the songs were from Tusk (+ Farmer's Daughter) and the code was hard to follow as no legend was sent. When things calm down I'll transribe the other 10 pages and link it into the Tusk entry on the Penguin. I don't want to confuse what's available by posting it again. I'll private message you a copy of what I had transcribed instead.

So which is better-- FM at 21 or the Going Home special?
We need to narrow this list down!

- Marty

[Johnny Stew]

Originally posted by Les
Jo/Jensen brings up a good point in that by sticking only to 'concept' videos, we'll be very heavy on Christine's material since it was her songs that were most often chosen as singles.



Hi Les,
I agree. I've been saying all along that a concept videos-only release would be, in my opinion, way too heavy-handed where Christine's material is concerned.
If everyone doesn't mind reading back to the 2nd page of this thread, I listed two other possible track-lists that are a little more even... and both of which would be, to me, preferable over a strict concept video collection.

I completely understand that a lot of people would like to FINALLY have all of the videos in pristine condition, and on the same collection... I'd love that too... but being that we're limited in the number of tracks, and therefore unable to balance it with live clips, I feel it would be better to not stick with the idea of compiling all of the concept videos onto one collection.

I also feel that if we're going to be able to really push this title to a wider audience (remember, more sales means a better potential for future releases), we're going to have to make sure it's a little more balanced.
I can just see a lot of the fans grumbling about Stevie and Lindsey each having only three videos apiece on the DVD/VHS, while Christine has six (not counting "Hold Me").
Not to mention that key songs, such as "Rhiannon" and "Go Your Own Way" would be left out.


Marty, you certainly don't need any more work, but I think we're definitely going to need to vote at some point.
I think we're all in agreement that we want *SOMETHING* released, so perhaps it won't be so difficult for us to narrow down exactly *what* we want.


Johnny Stew

[Gypsyblue]

I agree, I think the sooner we vote the better.

[ThePenguin]

I'm really hoping that a few people can pick up the ball here and run with it! I really think that a vote should happen soon too as it will be easier to push this petition further if we knew exactly what could be on the release. I really, really, really have my hands full now keeping everything else moving so I'd like a few people here to organize lists and set up the polls. Les and Johnny Stew perhaps? I can relay things back and forth to Ken if needed and he responds quite quickly. I think you should be shooting for between 90 min and 2 hr worth of footage as he is now indicating they can do more than the original 10-12 videos and wants this to be the best it can be.

We are now up to 738 people on the petition with 509 confirmed as I write this. If you registered for it but never received the confirmation letter (this seems much more prevalent on AOL), please just drop me a tiny note and I'll confirm it manually. Remember the goal is 10,000 so we have a very long way to go. I think its quite a good start for less than 2 days though. :D

- Marty

[Gypsyblue]

Is it possible to repost the "Warner Bros" list in a new thread in a "Poll" like format, and have everyone check off what they want from that list and then count it up???
I thinks it's the best way to get a clear idea of what people really want on the dvd.

[ThePenguin]

You can't do that with the format here; it only lets you vote a single time for a single item. Also, some people here have some of the footage already (although I'm sure its generations upon generations old) and can comment on it.

[Gypsyblue]

Perhaps we could start the poll by picking 3 videos/ Live performances (or more depending on space) each for Stevie, Lindsey and Chris, (which makes 9) and the rest behind the seen footage and interviews Tot: 12.
???

PS-
Sorry if I'm comming off as a "loud mouth" here, I'm just really really excited:D

[ThePenguin]

I think an easier option really might be if a few different lists were prepared and we vote on those in their entirety (or discuss them a bit first). I think we're all excited about the possibilities here. :)

- Marty

[Lori]

Okay, one thing I never thought of before...I was thinking about all the singles that have been released since the "video era" - basically since Mirage was put out - and it occured to me that Love In Store was released as a single (and it is one of my all-time fave FM songs), but I don't *think* there was a video made for it - was there? It's a shame if there was no video for that song, as the videos for the other 2 Mirage singles (Gypsy, Hold Me) were rather elaborate. Maybe Love In Store would have charted better if it had had a video.

Secondly, with the supposedly upcoming album from FM, I wonder if Warners would see a video compilation release as an opportunity to promote the new album. If so, I have 2 thoughts:
1) They may want to stick with only Rumours era material, with both Lindsey and Stevie since they will both be participating in the new album.

2) They may want to limit the Christine material, since she WON'T be participating in the new album.

That brought me to this thought...instead of having the compilation be just "concept videos" which would be heavily laden with post-Rumours line-up material and also be lopsided in terms of Christine material, what if we looked at a list that would include either the concept videos for or live performances of the singles from the White Album to Tango. If I'm not mistaken (although it's likely that I am, and if so, please feel free to correct me) this would include:

1. Over My Head (live)
2. Rhiannon (live)
3. Say You Love Me (live)
4. Go Your Own Way (live)
5. Dreams (live)
6. Don't Stop (live)
7. You Make Loving Fun (live)
8. Tusk (video)
9. Sara (live)
10. Think About Me (this *was* a single, right?) (live)
11. Hold Me (video)
12. Gypsy (video)
13. Love In Store (live, I guess, if there was no video, of which I'm not sure)
14. Big Love (video)
15. Little Lies (video)
16. Seven Wonders (video)
17. Everywhere (video)

Okay, now I know that this list is still VERY lopsided with regard to Chris versus Lindsey/Stevie material (Chris - 9 songs, Stevie - 5 songs, Lindsey - 3 songs); however, of the first 10 selections, only Tusk actually had a video. Therefore, the other 9 of the first 10 would have to be represented by live performances of the songs. Now, I realize that this doesn't change the fact that a lot of those songs are Christine's, but I feel that including the live performances would at least show a lot of Lindsey and Stevie's participation in the songs. One example of this that I'm thinking of is Over My Head (from Rosebud? I think - the outdoor concert where Lindsey is wearing the red shirt. ;) ). Even though it's Chris's song, you see Stevie and Lindsey singing harmony, Lindsey doing the little guitar licks, Stevie singing harmony and doing the "round and round finger/hand motions" on the "your mood is like a circus wheel..." part.

I guess what I'm saying is, if you had a list like this one, you would be:

1) Sticking with Rumours line-up material, which at this point might be the most attractive to the general public and casual fans. This could be better for sales, not to mention for use as a promotional tool for the new album.

2) Allowing for a *bit* more of Lindsey and Stevie's material to be included by including the "pre-video era" live performances (like Rhiannon and Go Your Own Way).

3) Balancing out the fact that most songs are *still* Christine material by showing in the live performance clips that, although they were Chris' songs, Stevie and Lindsey's roles in the songs' performances were both integral and essential. You would get to see alot of the onstage chemistry that the band members had with each other, which is something exciting to see and is severely lacking in the polished "concept" videos.

4) Achieving a balance between the concept videos and the live performances (9 or so live, 8 concept) - a mixture of this would, in my opinion, be much more fun and exciting to watch than just concept video after concept video. For example, as others have previously mentioned, the Everywhere video is a bit "dry" as far as band involvement...but after that maybe throw in Stevie's live "exorcism" performance of Rhiannon, and you can keep MY attention! Face it, a HUGE part of the appeal of Fleetwood Mac (Rumours era, especially) is the chemistry between the band members, and that is something you really only get from a live performance.

5) Using the live footage as a promotional tool for the video compilation: "Includes rare live performances of Over My Head, Rhiannon, and Go Your Own Way!"

6) I don't know if this would be possible or not, but if the release of the video collection would be fairly close to the release of the new FM album, but prior to, what about including a video for the first single from the new album "Bonus track: video for [song title], from the upcoming Fleetwood Mac album [album title]" Again, I don't know of all the red tape that might generate, so it may not be possible at all, but it's a thought. That way, people who buy the video collection will get a preview of the new album and possibly buy that too, or people who buy the album might buy the video collection for the new video? Would the inclusion of something like this be a possibility at all? Ken?? Marty?? Anyone???

Hey, I can even see a title now:
Fleetwood Mac: The Singles Collection
Videos plus live performances from the Grammy Award winning band
PLUS new video Bonus Track!

The inclusion of live tracks could also be great marketing for other future releases. If you give people a taste of Sara (from the Tusk doc), or Love in Store (from the live Mirage show), or one of the Rosebud performances, then they might run out and buy those dvd's too if they were to be released (or re-released) in the future.

I don't know; I could be barking up the wrong tree, but I would find a collection of this nature very appealing. Feel free to shoot me down, though. I won't mind...really... ;)

Lori :wavey:

PS: Actually, I honestly look forward to any thoughts/opinions you all have, so please, let's hear them!!! :nod:

[nodmod]

Hi All

I am still of the opinion of having ALL the videos on one release for continuaty. If we can now have up to 2 hours on the DVD then surely we can have the 14 videos posted by Johnny Stew and then maybe Rhiannon, Go Your Own Way and Sara live.

We may never get another opportunity to get this video complilation released again, so I feel it is really importent to get it right with all the videos on it.

Any thhoughts?

[wetcamelfood]

A great idea, but I too, would personally rather keep all the music videos together. Besides, I think we still wouldn't be able to use the live version of "Love in store" from the Mirage video because of the rights being owned by HBO and not Warners. (Does anyone know of an alternate version that exists to be used if this route is decided upon?)

What if we stick with Johnny Stew's list of the 14 videos as a base and add say, the different versions of videos that exist like the one of "Seven wonders", making of "Gypsy" footage etc., and outtakes footage and/or add some of the solo videos to bring it up to the newly allowed time limit say like, Lindsey's, Mick's, and the ones of Stevie's that do not appear already on her "I can't wait" video compilation. This along with the fact that "Got a hold on me" & "Love will show us how" should be omitted due to the fact that they appear already on the "Christine Mcvie the video album" collection (both tapes we could hopefully get released on disc as future releases), would be a plus because it would:

1. help "even out" the songwriters equal space problem a little and

2. it would keep all the videos together.

What do you guys think? I know "all" the videos that I've described probably won't fit into a two hour time frame but at least if we can use the Johnny Stew list and add these to it and then subtract if we go over. It might make it easier and take less time to compile as a possible list since as Marty says we need to really buckle down and get some set lists together here. Any thoughts on this (just a suggestion from my humble but what seems to be my loudmouth opinion right now but I hope it's not coming out that way, I'm just excited about it as everyone else is!) Let's hear what you think!

John

[d2brian]

I like that idea, John. I also think maybe the television commercials for Tango and The Chain could be cool little bonus features. And there'd be no problem with putting just little 15-second hunks of footage like that on the DVD.

~Brian

[Gypsyblue]

1. Over My Head (live)
2. Rhiannon (live ......anything out there besides Rosebud and Midnight Special??
3. Say You Love Me (live)
4. Go Your Own Way (live)
5. Dreams (live)
7. You Make Loving Fun (live)
8. Tusk (video)
9. Sara (live)
10. Think About Me (this *was* a single, right?) (live)
11. Hold Me (video)
12. Gypsy (video)
13. Big Love (video)
14. Little Lies (video)
15. Seven Wonders (video)
16. Everywhere (video)

I really like Lori's set list. ( I made a abbriviated list above due to space)
I agree with her that we should'nt be tied down to just a Concept video format. Perhaps we should have a mixture of Live performances and also videos??

[Les]

Originally posted by ThePenguin
I really, really, really have my hands full now keeping everything else moving so I'd like a few people here to organize lists and set up the polls. Les and Johnny Stew perhaps? I can relay things back and forth to Ken if needed and he responds quite quickly. I think you should be shooting for between 90 min and 2 hr worth of footage as he is now indicating they can do more than the original 10-12 videos and wants this to be the best it can be.

Johnny Stew? You up for this? ;) I'll email you and we can pull the suggestions together from everyone so far and post some lists and start taking votes. Sound okay? But everyone, please keep listing your ideas!

[wetcamelfood]

For those of you leaning towards the music video idea, since we need to get some kind of list together, how about this for a start and we can edit as we go along. I just thought we should get 'em all down and it then might be easier to decide as Marty has done alot of work getting this thing moving and he needs us to get some lists together and I'm hoping the initial release will be the music vids (if this takes off then I'm all for delving into the live stuff and the cheapest, fastest and easiest way to get it all out of the vaults and into our hands is not having duplication so that's why I think it would be best to just have the first release be more "everyday buyer" friendly to get their trust and get them "on our side" as it were. Then, we can hope to hit them up for the really great stuff! he he!) So those interested in the music vid list, any additions/subtractions?

1. Tusk
2. Hold me
3. Gypsy
4. Big love
5. Seven wonders
6. Seven wonders (alt. version)
7. Little lies
8. Family man
9. Everywhere
10. As long as you follow
11. Save me
12. Skies the limit
13. In the back of my mind
14. Paper doll
15. Love shines
16. (SN) Edge of seventeen (version 1)
17. (SN) Edge of seventeen (version 2)
18. (SN) Edge of seventeen (version 3)
19. (SN) Stand back (civil war version)
20. (SN) Talk to me (alt. version)
21. (SN) Rooms on fire
22. (SN) Whole lotta trouble
23. (SN) Sometimes it's a bitch
24. (SN) Blue denim
25. (SN) If you ever did believe
26. (SN) Everyday
27. (SN) Sorcerer
28. (LB) Trouble
29. (LB) It was I
30. (LB) Holiday road
31. (LB) Go insane
32. (LB) Slow dancing
33. (LB) Wrong
34. (LB) Countdown
35. (LB) Don't look down
36. (LB) Soul drifter
37. (MF) I want you back
38. (MF) Angel come home
39. (MF) Shakin' the cage

I could think of other related videos that would be cool too but as Ken says "2 or maybe 3 hours", if you say an avarage of four minutes a video then this is probably about 2 hours 40 minutes in duration so if we are allowed 3 hours then I guess the other 20 or so minutes could be used for the making of footage and outtakes etc. (we may even need to take out some videos (which I'd hate to do because it would be good to have it be as complete as possible but...) to make room for that as I don't know how long that footage would add up to time wise). I left off Christine's solo videos and Stevie's ones from her "I can't wait" video compilation (besides, from the packaging it looks like it was put out on VHS by the same company that re-released the Mirage concert tape in the late eighties so those Stevie vids may fall under the licensing of HBO too so I don't know if we can touch those anyways) because I would hope those could be straightforward disc re-releases in the future if we can get this first one off the ground (and maybe if the company that does own the HBO stuff will see that it would sell and put those out too themselves, possibly with another petition which would be sent to them if that would help but one thing at a time). If it should be 90 min to 2 hours and no more than that (as Ken seems to be quoted as saying as well), I would vote for the music vid compliation of just the Mac vids (I realize that it's mainly Christine penned songs but at least all the vids would be together and the difference with it being a video is that in most of the vids anyways all of the members can been seen throughout so it wouldn't be as lopsided as all of that) also, as they would include the audio of the actual studio tracks of course, imagine what Ken could do with the sound on the DVD versions, it would be especially interesting to see what he would do with the mixes of the post 1983 stuff as he wasn't involved originally. So, if that added up to say an hour than the other hour could be the special features/bonus materials section with the outtakes/ making of stuff. There are probably other alternate versions etc. that I've left out so any one leaning towards the music video approach, let's get to work! What should we add/minus from here? (by all means live clips people, get your final list together too and let's see what we got!

John

[Johnny Stew]

Les, feel free to email me.
I'd be more than happy to work with you on this.

Everyone's lists look great.
I think we should nix any solo material though. We have way too much stuff to try and narrow down as it is, from Fleetwood Mac's output alone. Solo material will needlessly complicate things right now.
At least that's my opinion.

Remember, if we make this release successful enough, they'll be more inclined to release an additional volume(s).

:D
Johnny Stew

[Johnny Stew]

By the way.... after we started discussing it, and Les and Neil described it... the "Family Man" video started to sound vaguely familiar to me.
So I rummaged thru my tape collection last night, and sure enough, I found it!
Once I watched it, i immediately remembered it... I also immediately remembered why it made so little impression on me.
*lol*

It's not even "outtake" footage from the "Seven Wonders" video shoot, it IS footage from the video. Interspersed with old stock footage of "families"... or at least gatherings of people!

If this were Video Survivor, I'd vote that one off right away!
*lol*


:)
Johnny Stew

[wetcamelfood]

I'll go for that, only band stuff, OK so in reference to my last post, I'll just make it be the list of the first 15 which times 4 minutes a vid comes to an hour and with the making of & outtake footage, that should bring it up to about 90 minutes at least but probably more. There's no way it would be more than 2 hours though (and 90 minutes to 2 hours is now of course the suggested running time) but if it is, I'm happy to cut out redundant videos like "Family man" if need be. Anyone else like this 15 videos with "extras" band only release idea? (for those of you leaning towards the music videos list)

John

[Gypsyblue]

I think it makes a lot of sense to have "band" only footage and no solo stuff. But I REALLY like the idea of including live material on it.
Perhaps we can make one BIG list, including the Warner vaults List, and just narrow it down from there????

[d2brian]

I just thought of something, and this is all based on John's awesome list - Keep in mind this first one is a long-term idea:

If a DVD with videos 1-25 is succesful enough, perhaps there could be an all Stevie disc (videos 16-27) released next. Now, maybe I'm nuts, but I bet an all-Stevie disc could sell better than a Fleetwood Mac disc, and maybe then enough money would be made from the whole venture to release a third disc consisting of videos 28-39, but in a limited edition (perhaps 5,000-7,000 copies) since I imagine a Lindsey/Mick/Chris-only disc wouldn't be as successful as the other two.

Between the sales of the 3 discs, I'm sure there'd be enough reason to rerelease all the live DVDs people want.

2nd - this is more of a short term 'what if':

Perhaps ALL 39 VIDEOS could be rereleased for a price something like $59.99 in a super-limited edition - say, 2500 copies - and a normal compilation - based more on what would sell the best in the mainstream (something like Lori's list) - could be the other 7500 released compilations.

I don't know, maybe I'm nuts, maybe these ideas are disgustingly silly. But they're just ideas. :) And if you twisted my arm and made me pick my favorite between the two of them, I like the 2nd one. ;)

Perhaps these could be 2 of many choices on a future poll?

~Brian

[Josh2003]

I agree with Lori that this should be kept strictly "Rumours era" only. Not that I don't like the other eras, but if we honestly want to get the demand high enough for this, we can't really include things that people aren't going to know. I think if, given the choice, the casual fan would much rather have a DVD of songs he is familiar with, rather than songs like Love Shines and In the Back of My Mind, which only the die hard fans would like.

So if we do limit it to the Rumours era, that gives us 7 concept videos (breakdown: Lindsey-2 vids; Stevie-2 vids; Chris-3 vids...as even as we can get it). Then throw in some live songs. If we go with 13 songs total, that leaves 6 (each singer having 2). My list would go something like this:

-Tusk (vid)
-Gypsy (vid)
-Hold Me (vid)
-Seven Wonders (vid)
-Big Love (vid)
-Everywhere (vid)
-Little Lies (vid)
-Rhiannon (live)
-Sisters of the Moon (live)
-Go Your Own Way (live)
-Not That Funny (live)
-Love In Store (live)
-Songbird (live)
<b>Bonus Track:</b>
-The Chain (live)

That way, if we break it down:
Stevie-4 songs
Lindsey-4 songs
Chris-5 songs
+1 for all of them, The Chain.

What do ya'll think?

[Lori]

I like your list, but what would you think of 2 substitutions:

Eyes of the World instead of Not That Funny - first, I just happen to like Eyes of the World better ;), and secondly, at least with that one you would have all 5 members onstage (instead of Stevie back getting her hair and makeup fixed...;) ).

I'm thinking maybe a live version of Dreams instead of Sisters of the Moon - it IS FM's only #1 song, plus it is obviously better known by the general public. I LOVE the Sisters/Moon performance on both the Tusk doc and the Mirage concert video, though. I guess I would only vote for Dreams if it was a better live version than the one I've always seen where Stevie looks high as a kite... ;)

What do you think?

Lor :wavey:

PS: Thanks for agreeing with some of my ideas, and by the way, I LOVE the idea of having The Chain as a bonus track - maybe even as the first track on the dvd, with Songbird as the last track, for sentimental reasons of course! :D

[wetcamelfood]

Brian, I certainly wouldn't mind paying 60 bucks for the complete music vid collection either!

Josh has got a good compromise here but...

I don't know from what Marty said that we should decide on a cuople lists and then a vote would take place and majority would rule but if we want to merge this way this sounds like a good compromise.

I must say though that if we are going to include live footage we might as well keep things as clean as possible without chopping into concerts because if we do get further releases we don't want to have to pay for the same footage again along with some not seen footage on a possible future release. Like say, (I know this isn't the case but just so you can see what I mean) you bought the Tusk doc and then you bought the Mirage vid and say the Mirage vid was more than half full of stuff that was already included on the Tusk doc. You'd still need to keep Mirage for the footage that wasn't anywhere else but it would be annoying that there would be alot of duplication, no? Of course we are happy with those tapes in reality (for many reasons but mainly) because they both include completely different footage to the other so for the live songs mentioned in some of your great lists. How about hashing around these ideas?

On the Warners video vault list that Marty has put on the ledgeboards, you'll see entries for the following

Dreams (4:19)
Go your own way (Live in LA/Visible time code)
Songbird (Live in LA/Visible time code)
The Chain (Live in LA/Visible time code)
Sisters of the moon (Live in LA/Visible time code)
Not that funny (Live in LA/Visible time code) (3:56)
Love in store (Live in LA)

(sorry, I couldn't find one for "Eyes of the world" that wouldn't chop up shows) I don't know if we've seen these or not, my fear would be that they may be from the Mirage tape which of course we wouldn't want to take stuff from right now as that would be duplication. if they are, then we can choose other clips, but if they are not (which they probably aren't if they are in the Warners vault & if the Mirage tapes is owned by HBO...), these might be good choices for those particular live performances. As it is, I know there are some other "Live in LA/Visible time code" choices there but these seem to be the songs that were discussed above and as I'm sure I'm not the only one out there who thinks we should avoid chopping up longer video footage, these seem to be the clips that do involve the songs relevant to the choices mentioned above and as they are listed seperately it would be easier to keep track of these so we would know which "Live in LA/Visible time code) pieces we haven't chosen this time (so we could use those on possible future releases. This just seems to be the least choppy way but including the above ideas as much as possible. You know what I mean? How about this?

My only suggestion would be to maybe replace the "Love in store" clip from above with say maybe "Don't stop" as this may be more acceptable to the general public as it was a higher chart position than "Love in store" and it would open up a few possibilities such as using the "Paris promo (with "Don't stop" & "Dreams")" this "Dreams" if chosen of course would superseed the LA version listed above if people preferred to have the Paris versions. or we could keep the LA "Dreams" and use the Clinton ball thing of "Don't stop". There's other avenues which would not chop things up but be of great use on DVD quality (and be of great use for those who collect VHS to have an original copy of) like say the "Brit awards" performances, possibly other combinations from other things of this type?

How about that? I can bend on the music vid thing if we can compromise on live footage that doesn't cut up tapes we could hopefully get released in their entirty in the future. Is this idea of any use/sense/etc.? (if we do decide on Josh's great idea, I hope there would be enough room for the extras like the alt. "Seven wonders" vid, making of "Gypsy" footage & "Hold me" outtakes!)If not, should we go by what Marty said and have maybe three complete lists, one of strictly live stuff, one of strictly band music vids and another of a mixture? What do you guys think?

John

[ThePenguin]

If anyone is interested in what the list actually looks like, I'm attaching a small portion to this message. I like your lists Lori and Josh but I think we could probably go for more material-- perhaps between 90 minutes and 2 hours. Maybe add Lori's EOTW and Dreams to Josh's list and then a few more items? There's also no interest in any of the documentaries for half? Just curious...

- Marty

PS-- Any progress on a banner Josh? Something flashy!

[wetcamelfood]

How about the Tusk documentary with the 7 Rumour era mac music vids on the end? That way, it's even with the vids and everyone wants the Tusk doc to be re-released (whether it be on DVD or so that VHS collectors can have their own new copies as opossed to getting throw aways from old video stores that have gone bust from ebay (for a pretty price too)).

I'm still thinking on how to compile another list and keep it even with songwriters and live and vid footage but since Marty just said about the docs, I thought I'd mention the idea now.

Anyone like this?

John

[wetcamelfood]

OK, how about this list? In no particular order:

1. Tusk (vid)
2. Gypsy (vid)
3. Hold me (vid)
4. Big love (vid)
5. Seven wonders (vid)
6 Little lies (vid)
7. Everywhere (vid)
8. Rhiannon (7:86 is what it says on vault list (?))
9. Sisters of the moon (live in LA/Visible time code)
10. Go your own way (live in LA/Visible time code (or from Brit awards)
11. Not that funny (live in LA/Visible time code)
12. Love in store (live in LA/Visible time code)
13. Songbird (live in LA/Visible time code)
14. The Chain (live in LA/Visible time code)
15. Eyes of the world (billed on list as "Eyes" live in LA/Visible time code)
16. Dreams (live in LA/Visible time code (or from "Paris promo")
17. Sara (4:00 is what it says on vault list (?))
18. I'm so afraid (live in LA/Visible time code)
19. Don't stop (either from Clinton ball or from Brit awards)

(of course we would have to do some rearranging if these LA things were from the Mirage tape but...) This keeps those three songwriters even at 6 each with "The chain" representing everyone and with the addition of a few somgs, it brings the total closer to the 90 minute mark but still keeps it even with those three. If there was time left over either the extras I've mentioned in above posts or maybe to please the fans of the older stuff (as Peter Green did form the band after all) maybe have the clip of "Oh well" from those sessions that gave us "Like crying" & "Linda" which were used on "The early years" DVD but much to my disapointment, "Oh well" was omitted. That would clean that session up as well as keep the songwriters from the Rumours line up even. I was trying to think of a way to work in the Hall of Fame stuff (as this and the Brit awards and the Clinton thing are of great historical documentary vaule in Mac history) but there was no way to get it all in and still have it be even and/or withiout being repetitive ("Big love" etc.). I would've preferred this "Landslide" to this mysterious "Sara" that I've listed above but as we seem to be going by what charted as top 40 hits in the US as most eminent, this is why I chose that but of course we have to remember that we have many overseas fans and they had some other hits in their respective countries (in addition to the Peter Green stuff there's "Oh diane" of course, if anyone thinks we should use that full clip of them lip synching it on British TV we've seen in the "The story of Fleetwood Mac" doc, I'm all for replacing "I'm so afraid" or whatever with this). So we should take some of these things into consideration and I've tried to do that with this list and these comments. I just thought that if weren't long behind the 90 minute mark with most of what we have been able to agree on then that would be a good way around keeping those three songwriters even, having it be at least 90 minutes (but probably and preferrably longer) and making those happy who want footage of foreign hits/other eras of the band represented in some way even if it is only for a few minutes. I would hope though that if you do say "Go your own way" from the "Brit awards" that you would consider taking "Don't stop" from the "Brit awards" too (or "Dreams" from "Paris promo" that "Don't stop" "Paris promo" would go with it too) to attempt to keep things together you know? Any amendments, comments, suggestions, etc. ? Let's hear 'em!

John

[Skylark]

Hi John,
Thanks for your great list and adding...Iam So Afraid... for Lindsey! I would like the Mirage... Not that Funny which makes more sense for me then that rather crabby... Not That Funny... on Tusk!
Lindsey is very cute & sexy on both versions! :eek:

I really like LB's videos for Soul Drifter &
Countdown...or even Go Insane!
Just my ideas from an emotional point of view!:nod: Your List ROCKS! :)
Marty and all the fans...KEEP up the Good WORK!
CHEERS for THE MAC MUSIC!!!:blob1: Luv, ~Sky~:)

p.s. I forgot to tell you! The Brit Awards is GREAT!!! That was a thrill in motion!Lindsey was AWESOME...good footage !!!:laugh:

[Gypsyblue]

John,
Your list looks perfect!!!! I like the way you got live stuff mixed with the videos.
Is it possible to add in some "making of" footage?? Or maybe there won't be room.

[wetcamelfood]

Yeah, as I figure those songs will add up to about 75 minutes or so, my first choice for the remaining 15-45 minutes of the disc would be the making of footage/outtakes but I just threw in some of those other ideas in case this was not possible.

I like the Mirage "Not that funny" too but.. well, maybe I'm alone on this one but I don't know if many people would want to have the Mirage version on there if we can hopefully get a contact at HBO somewhere down the road after this project ends to see if they would be willing to release the entire show on a seperate disc. Hopefully they will like the idea if we can in fact prove that we have at least 10,000 ready and willing buyers but this hopefully being the case, "Not that funny" from the "Mirage" tape on this first disc would eat away some valuable space for other things that could fit on and I don't think (but maybe I'm wrong) that many people would want to spend money for that piece of film twice when they could still hopefully get it in it's full beauty and use the space that would be vacated by that version on this disc with another version (I don't know from Marty's attachment above post if it's from the Mirage tape or not, it looks like it says "Mirage tour" next to at least one of those LA things which is a fear that it may be from that tape and if it was, my thought would be to try and find another "Not that funny" or whatever (as well as replacing the other LA stuff if it is all Mirage tape stuff but I wouldn't think it would be. If HBO owns the rights, why would Warners have it in their video vault?) So I don't think having "Not that funny" from the Mirage tape is a possibility because of the rights thing anyways but at least this is a good step forward. By all means, if everyone disagrees with my non duplication ways, let's hear it on here so the majority can get what they want! Once again, I feel like such a loudmouth on all of this but I just remebered Marty saying that because he was so busy right now, he needed some people to carry the ball for him a little bit and as I'm ultra excited about the chance of this, I just thought I'd get as involved as I can in the talks you know what I mean?

Anyway, let's hear more yays or nays on this!

John

[jwd]

I think that's what we have to concentrate on the most. This has to appeal to everyone, not just the diehard fans like ourselves. Just take the greatest hits or songs that Fleetwood Mac are best known for. Since we haven't seen all the footage in the vaults I think it would be hard to pick which "performance" to choose to represent a certain song. So I guess I'll submit a song request for what I'd like to "see":

Rhiannon
Over My Head
Landslide
Say You Love Me
I'm So Afraid
World Turning
Go Your Own Way
Dreams
Don't Stop
You Make Loving Fun
The Chain
Songbird
Gold Dust Woman
Silver Springs
Tusk
Sara
Gypsy
Hold Me
Big Love
Seven Wonders
Little Lies
Everywhere

Whether it's a conceptual video or a live performance doesn't really matter to me....just pick the best one. This should be more than enough to get 2hrs worth of footage.

I also think it's a good idea to release it on both DVD and VHS format since most people still have video recorders and have not upgraded to DVD yet....better sales potential.

And yeah I agree there is so much more I would love to see released but I think this a good start.

Joe :wavey:

[Gypsyblue]

This is why I like John's updated list. It includes all the well known hits and live stuff. It's not just a list of obsure songs, but a list of videos and peformances of songs everyone knows and love!!!

[d2brian]

What about post-Rumours stuff? Specifically, the box set videos, Skies The Limit, and As Long As You Follow are really really good.

~Brian

[Josh2003]

Lori--Those songs could definitely be added...I left Dreams off, simply cause I'm kinda tired of that song ;). But like I said, that list was just to get an idea on what type of breakdown. And I would LOVE Eyes of the World rather than Not That Funny, too. But I put NTF in b/c I thought it might be a little more well known than Eyes, since they did NTF on the entire Dance tour, too. So with your added songs, my list then turns into John's :D.

John--That's definitely the type of list I had in mind. So since we CAN add those other songs to my list that Lori suggested (and then some), your list is PERFECT. And since we still have more time, I think some DOCUMENTARY footage would be essential!

Marty--I have NO artistic ability as far as computer art goes. I'm sure somebody would make a much better banner than I could! :D

[Josh2003]

A few more things I just thought of.

While I love the songs John included on his list, I'd hate to see so many of the live clips be from that same LA show. I think it would be a better idea if we could have a wider variety of shows represented. But we have to go with what we have in the vaults.

Also, why not include some newer footage? Some of the live shots could be from The Dance, too. I know, its already available on DVD, but if we want to make this a real anthology type of thing, we need some newer stuff in there too. So that's why I like John's idea of including the Clinton inauguration, Brit awards, or even the Hall of Fame induction.

Just some thoughts...

[Les]

I think this might help. The total time required to show all of the 'concept videos' is about 56 minutes. These would include:

1. Tusk (3:30)
2. Hold Me ((3:57)
3. Gypsy (4:12)
4. Big Love (3:57)
5. Seven Wonders (3:38)
6. Family Man (4:00?)*
7. Little Lies (3:34)
8. Everywhere (3:41)
9. As Long As You Follow (4:07)
10. Save Me (4:14)
11. Skies the Limit (3:42)
12. In the Back of My Mind (4:59)
13. Paper Doll (3:56)
14. Love Shines (4:10)

*This Family Man video is a little bit of a mystery. I'm not clear on whether this was a "real" video or if it was something that MTV Europe threw together (since it never aired in the US). I noticed it's not on the WB vault list either, while all of the other videos are. That is what is making me wonder...)

Anyway, even if we stick with all 14 videos in order to have the complete video collection, that still leaves us with a good 35 minutes to fill if we're sticking to the lower limit of 90 minutes for the whole DVD. And why stick with the lower limit when there's a higher limit? ;)

If we go with the higher limit of closer to 120 minutes (give or take), then we've still got another 65 minutes to fill.

If we remove Family Man if it's not "real" (for lack of a better term), we're down to closer to 50 minutes occupied, with a good 70 minutes still to fill.

If we decide to only focus on Rumours era, and subtract the last 6 videos from the list above, we're down to about 26 minutes occupied, with a good 90 minutes(!) still to fill.

So we've certainly got options here. I don't think this is a case of needing to go with only videos or only performances. There's a good deal of room for all of the videos and then a whole lot more.

[d2brian]

Perfect, Les.

I think the DVD should have <B>all the videos</b> no matter what, and then the additional live stuff could be added as needed.

~Brian

[wetcamelfood]

Great going Les!

I really would like to see all the music videos there and as there is more time left than I thought, I guess the live stuff could come after those as a good compromise.

We could set up another poll but I don't honestly think the majority of people would want to buy some of the footage from "The dance" (or other things on commercially released DVD/VHS) again if they already have it and as the Clinton thing, Brit awards and Hall of fame stuff is from the dance era and most seem to be in agreement that these are of great historical value to the bands videography, should this be the live footage that could be tacked on to the end? (I know this would mean we would get the video of "Big love" as well as the hall of fame live version and 2 "Don't stop"s (Brit awards and Clinton) etc. but at least it would be more useful previously "unowned" disc (or new VHS) footage for our collections. If we can narrow down to what particular live footage should be tacked on to the end, we would then be well on our way to having a good complete list ready for Ken and Marty which we really do need to get together soon. Let's see...

Don't stop (Clinton)
Don't stop (Brit awards)
Go your own way (Brit awards)
Big love (Hall of fame)
Landslide (Hall of fame)
Say you love me (Hall of fame)

I doubt that this adds up to more than 30 minutes so plus the videos, there is still some time left for the two hour mark. Many people seem to like the idea of the Making of/outtakes/alternate footage for the music videos as the extras so I guess that would fill it up or come close anyways. Is this a fair time estimate and a fair content listing everyone?

In ducussions here with those that feel as though this should be a "mixture" collection, I think they would like the songwriters credits to be equal. If this could be accomodated on the live footage section of the release than that would be the answer but I can't figure a way to choose footage from the list and not chop up concert footage (which was the only reason I suggested all of that LA stuff because it would've been to our advantage at a later date as it was all listed seperately) which I'm sure not many people want to buy the same footage twice (that is if all goes well with this disc/tape and looking towards the future we get future releases of complete concert footage on video). By all means we can set up a poll on this very topic and if it turns out the majority wants to do it this way then so be it but until then is it safe to go under the assumption that the majority doesn't want to "duplicate"? I certainly don't want to but let's hear it if you do, if you don't say, we won't know that's how you feel out there.

Any ideas on this songwriting/chopping up dilema? (Hopefully if we can agree on this complete video (with extras) and live footage being from those three historic shows than this would make this alot easier for Ken to get the licensing and to do the sound. What do you think guys?

John

[Les]

I like the idea of not using the previously released stuff. I do have one thought though about using something like say, the Clinton Inauguration performance, just as an example, and that is that I'm not really sure that we'd then be selecting the best actual performance of Don't Stop to show, in what is essentially shaping up to be a retrospective. My thinking here is just that the sound system for that performance of Don't Stop wasn't very good, so would we want to include rarer material for the sake of it, or should we be looking for "best" performances?

Another issue about trying to not use previously released things is that the footage from different eras that is available to us then dwindles. Except for the Mirage Concert (which I think "Live in LA" must be raw footage of), I don't see anything else on the WB list that resembles Mirage era live performances. And except for the Tusk Documentary, I'm not sure what's available from the Tusk era. So would we just skip any live footage from those eras if what's available is only previously released material?

If we had some way of knowing what some of the things on the list were -- like "Fleetwood Mac Live," "Fleetwood Mac Concert/The Company," "Fleetwood Mac on Tour," etc... -- it would solve some problems. But we don't.

We do have a lot of time left over to intersperse live performance footage with the videos in order to try to even out the equal representation issue and to try provide a greatest hits selection through the different eras. But based on what is in the WB vault, some of these performances, if not many of them, may be things some of us have already seen somewhere before. So I guess the question is -- is that bad? Are we looking for greatest hits? Are we looking for rare performances even if they're not the best performances? Can we do a little of both -- take some familiar footage, some rarer footage to cover all bases?

Take this list for example (which is a mild variation on something Johnny Stew posted earlier):

1. Over My Head (Midnight Special) ~3:45
2. Rhiannon (Rosebud) 6:52
3. I’m So Afraid (Rosebud) 5:02
4. Say You Love Me (Rosebud) 3:55
5. World Turning (Midnight Special) ~6:00?
6. Go Your Own Way (Rosebud) 3:32
7. Dreams (Paris Promo) 4:19
8. Don’t Stop (Paris Promo) ~4:00
9. You Make Loving Fun (Japan) 3:45
10. The Chain (Mirage Concert) 5:45
11. Tusk (video) 3:30
12. Sara (Tusk Doc) 4:08
13. Not That Funny (Tusk Doc) 2:10
14. Sisters of the Moon (Mirage) 7:45
15. Hold Me (video) 3:57
16. Gypsy (video) 4:12
17. Eyes of the World (Mirage) 3:45
18. Big Love (video) 3:57
19. Seven Wonders (video) 3:38
20. Little Lies (video) 3:34
21. Everywhere (video) 3:41
22. As Long As You Follow (video) 4:07
23. Save Me (video) 4:14
24. Skies the Limit (video) 3:42
25. In the Back of My Mind (video) 4:59
26. Paper Doll (video) 3:56
27. Love Shines (video) 4:10
28. Silver Springs (Dance) 5:45
29. Bleed to Love Her (Dance) 3:14
30. Landslide (Dance) 3:50

McVie: 12 songs (incl. World Turning)
Nicks: 9 songs
Buckingham: 9 songs (incl. World Turning & The Chain – as he’s lead singer, sort of)

For the record, this list is too long - it's about 135 minutes worth of material. Who knows how much it would cost to license this many different performances or if we even could get all of them. But this is just an example of something like a greatest hits type of package, arranged chronilogically (more or less), with a lot of previously seen footage. We would have to subtract a few things and could make subtitutions for different, rarer performances, or different songs by the singer ...

What are your reactions to this kind of list?

As I think someone stated previously, maybe it would be an option to simply submit a list to Ken of the videos and then also a list of the songs we'd like to see live performance footage of and then let him pick the performances, since he might have a slightly better idea of what is on some of these videos in the vault.

[Gypsyblue]

As I think someone stated previously, maybe it would be an option to simply submit a list to Ken of the videos and then also a list of the songs we'd like to see live performance footage of and then let him pick the performances, since he might have a slightly better idea of what is on some of these videos in the vault. [/B][/QUOTE]

Being that there is room left over after adding the concept videos, may we should make a small list of Live material we would like to see?
I noticed about 2 or 3 peformances of Rhiannon, and a couple of other songs on the "Vaults" list, perhaps Marty or Ken can clearify as to where these songs were peformed at, to get an idea if we seen it before or not.

[Rumours]

Great list Les.....albeit a long list......but great!!!
You, Lori, Joe........I think you're on to something.........we've got a lot more time and space than originally thought now.........use all the concept videos, then in the plenty of remaining time and space, we could make a list of what live footage and making of/extra bonus footage we would like to see, and Ken could pick the best ones or the "most favorite ones as voted by the fans"..........
And also, so what if it's a little more heavily weighed toward Christine--her songs were the ones chosen for a good deal of the singles, so obviously her songs are going to be represented more.......but I just don't see why that matters as far as videos are concerned, especially the concept videos--the entire band is in the video, so they are all represented, and they are all there, no matter which of the three songwriter's song it is........don't cut good videos or live footage out just because oh well it's a Christine song and she's too over-represented........

Stephanie

[watchdevil]

:wavey:

Hi everyone.. I'm an old shoe in Stevie / Fleetwood Mac Circles but just new to posting to this message board...

The petition is a great idea. There are so many worthy Fleetwood Mac videos that need to be complied and released on DVD.

Basically I believe every single one of the promo videos for all the Fleetwood Mac singles NEEDS to be released on DVD. They all seem lost to me.. Of course I have many of them that I taped off MTV and VH1 but they are not the best quality and of course when you are taping you always miss a part or cut it off. They need to be permanetly preserved as a DVD video release. This extended to all of Stevie's solo videos as well.

Also, Tango In The Night Live Tour video should be released.

What else... The Tusk Tour Documentary, The Rosebud videos.. ah the Rosebud videos.. they have to be released! Nothing beats watching that version of Stevie doing Rhiannon! What about the one she did for Midnight Special too!

There's also the Mirage Concert footage that needs to be included..

I feel so much material is going to be lost of it is not released on a compilation of DVD videos. There is nothing I would enjoy better than all these videos on DVD because you have instant access to each song and video without having to search, fast forward and rewind to find the many different things that I have personally recorded to VHS tape.

DVD is the only format for the future.

I just want to say I love my Rumours 5.1 DVD-A.. I am however dissapointed that the players for DVD-Audio 5.1 are so expensive and hard to find. I had to settle for a regular DVD player with CD/CDR/CDRW playback capability. I still feel like I am missing somthing by not bein able to enjoy the full 5.1 surrround sound. But the quality of the stereo track versions are incredible as well. My only misgiving about the DVD-Audio release is that I wish there was some way it could be played in a standard CD player as well. The only way I was able to overcome this is to record from DVD player to CDR using analog inputs only. I could not duplicate digitally just so I could have a copy for my car's CD player.

Anyway lets keep ou fingers crossed that we will finally get something incredible for us all to enjoy! There is nothing short of death that would stop me from buying anything new that is released for my ultimate Stevie and Fleetwood Mac pleasure... there are few pleasures in life that feel as good as enjoying their music...

[Johnny Stew]

(Quick personal message:
Wow... Angelo/WatchDevil.... I used to be a VERY frequent visitor of your Stevie site, back around 1996. At some point, I lost the URL though, and was never able to find the site again. :(
I'm REALLY glad to see you here, posting with us.)
:)


To everyone else:

Personally, i like the idea of rare, little-seen material... but i am also all for including the best performances of each song.
Like Les said, sure the Clinton Inaugural performance of "Don't Stop" is rare, but is it the best performance?
My answer is no.
So, in some cases we will probably end up using something from the Tusk Doc, or maybe even the Mirage concert.
(The other stumbling block, as Les said, is that we just plain don't know what's on some of these things!!! *lol*)


You have my word that we are seriously weighing every option, and listening to everyone's suggestions.
Hopefully we'll be able to come up with a track listing that is a respectable compromise between all the suggestions and opinions.


Also, just to let everyone know, we have every intention of using all the concept videos (we're still not sure on the "official" status of "Family Man" though, so we're going to check into that).
We're not going to drop any of those videos just because Christine has "too many songs."
She's definitely going to have more tracks than everyone else... that's a given. We're merely trying to make sure that Lindsey and Stevie have adequate representation as well.



Johnny Stew

[wetcamelfood]

I do love the Rumours DVD audio and all of that but well, maybe I'm alone on this too but I personally watch videos more for the video portion. If it has good audio, that's a real plus but what I mean by good sound is if we can hear it and enjoy it. If it's doing all of it's swirling around surround sound thing, I can take it or leave it (Ken will definately have a chance to play with that on the audio portion of the concept videos anyways as of course the audio portions of those are the original studio tracks) so I think it's better to take something from a TV performance or whatever rather than from the Tusk doc, Mirage tape (which we don't think we can use anything from anyways because of the HBO rights thing) or anything like that when maybe those could come out in full in the future. Yes, the sound quality may not be perfect, yes, the performance may not be as good but as fans, it will be better for our collections in the long run and the general public is not to know that this is not the best performance of the song available. That's an opinion thing anyways. The everyday buyer may prefer the Clinton "Don't stop" (for instance) even if we don't think it's the best version. It would be up to 5.1 Entertainment anyways but they may want to play up the fact that the versions of some of those performances are from those shows so the general public may read the box and think "wow, I like that version, I remember seeing that on TV, I think I'll get it" as oppossed to "Oh it's got the Mirage tape version, I think I've got that kicking around the attic somewhere, oh I don't want to buy it again". As long as the units get sold, this is what could matter in getting future releases. If we do plan to get other stuff released in the future we have to think ahead and think in the same ruthless way they do. A customer can't return something because he/she doesn't think the performance is the best the band has ever done. Once they get your money, they aren't broken up over the fact that your disapointed over the product.

It's good we seem to agree on the idea that all the FM music vids should be there and for those wanting the mixture, the compromise of having some live stuff in there with the remaining time is going smoothly too, we just need to decide on what live stuff to put on it. I agree that those are great performances from Rosebud, Midnight special, etc. but I would hope that we could get those complete films released on future discs (or put the complete footage from those on this one) rather than just use some parts of them here just to buy them again in their entirety later but it doesn't seem like many wish to do this so I just hope we can come up with something that won't make us buy the same material too often and chop up concerts you know pieces of it on this release, pieces of the same show on that release. I can't be the only one out there thinking this way. I hope not anyways!

John

[nodmod]

Originally posted by wetcamelfood
Let's see...

Don't stop (Clinton)
Don't stop (Brit awards)
Go your own way (Brit awards)
Big love (Hall of fame)
Landslide (Hall of fame)
Say you love me (Hall of fame)

John

I love the idea of all the videos and the above list from the awards shows and The Clinton thing, speaking from a UK / European perspective many of us have never seen the Don't Show performance for the Clinton thing or the Hall Of Fame performance

With that we could still do the extras

Making Of the Gypsy video
Making of the Big Love video
Alternate Seven Wonders video
and the outtakes for Hold Me + others if they exist

I am now getting really excited about this possible release :) :)

[Skylark]

Hi John...Les and Johnny Stew...
Thank you so much for all your hard work on our behalf! I understand what you mean about Mirage and Tusk!!! However...some ppl may not own these works! Newer fans missed so much! Don't you think Clinton is five minutes of old news?;)The Dance ...Don't Stop... is excellent quality Mac Music!
You know what performance surprise I'd be thrilled to see?:D When Lindsey showed up on stage in 1990 and played guitar with the guys...he has on a pinkish shirt and a tie and he looks like he has suffered! One other thing... Don't forget Lindsey's videos if you include Stevies personal videos!Pretty Please!:nod: Thanks!!!
Luv Ya', ~Sky~

(These are just my silly comments... I bow to you guys as the experts on this DVD stuff!:))

[Gypsyblue]

Originally posted by Johnny Stew
Personally, i like the idea of rare, little-seen material... but i am also all for including the best performances of each song.
Like Les said, sure the Clinton Inaugural performance of "Don't Stop" is rare, but is it the best performance?
My answer is no.
Johnny Stew [/B]

I have to agree with Johnny on that one. Some of the stuff is rare, but not the "best"

I would hope most of the live stuff on the DVD is earlier unseen performance's , rather then post-Mirage stuff. Seeing the band perform during there hey day would be great! :wavey:

[Jo and Jensen]

Les, I love..absolutely LOVE your latest list. At the end of your post you said it was too long though. So I just copied your list and placed astrics next to the ones that I think the basic music fan would NOT want to see.

1. Over My Head (Midnight Special) ~3:45
2. Rhiannon (Rosebud) 6:52
3. I’m So Afraid (Rosebud) 5:02
4. Say You Love Me (Rosebud) 3:55
5. World Turning (Midnight Special) ~6:00?
6. Go Your Own Way (Rosebud) 3:32
7. Dreams (Paris Promo) 4:19
8. Don’t Stop (Paris Promo) ~4:00
9. You Make Loving Fun (Japan) 3:45
10. The Chain (Mirage Concert) 5:45
11. Tusk (video) 3:30
12. Sara (Tusk Doc) 4:08
13. Not That Funny (Tusk Doc) 2:10
14. Sisters of the Moon (Mirage) 7:45
15. Hold Me (video) 3:57
16. Gypsy (video) 4:12
17. Eyes of the World (Mirage) 3:45
18. Big Love (video) 3:57
19. Seven Wonders (video) 3:38
20. Little Lies (video) 3:34
21. Everywhere (video) 3:41 *********
22. As Long As You Follow (video) 4:07
23. Save Me (video) 4:14 *********
24. Skies the Limit (video) 3:42 **********
25. In the Back of My Mind (video) 4:59 *********
26. Paper Doll (video) 3:56
27. Love Shines (video) 4:10
28. Silver Springs (Dance) 5:45
29. Bleed to Love Her (Dance) 3:14
30. Landslide (Dance) 3:50

First of all, Everywhere was weird and the Mac isn't even really in it. Save Me, Skies The Limit, and In the Back of My Mind are all songs off the Behind the Mask album and do not involve LB. I think though since As Long As You Follow was from the Greatest Hits album it should be included along with Love Shines and Paper Doll because that is FMs Box Set.

This running list would keep attention too, and that is what we are really going for.

P.S. I agree with those who commented that the Clinton Don't Stop should be left off. Even Ken said in his Q&A that they didn't look nor sound too good!

[Les]

I'm certainly not opposed to using rarer footage at all. And that's a very good point about how some of these performances have not been available to anyone outside of the US.

I guess what I'd like to ask then is if those of you who favor rare footage could look through the list and see if you can find things that we might include and maybe see if you can track down some times for those segments. There've been some good suggestions so far with Clinton's Inauguration, the Brits, Hall of Fame, etc..

I think the things that Johnny Stew and I have been trying to keep in mind are getting a selection of a few songs from each era (so that there's not a huge collection of performances from any one show or album in particular). And we're trying to keep the numbers relatively equitable between the singers . . . though I'm sure Christine will always have the most given her dominance in the concept video area.

Without knowing what is on some of these tapes, it's a little bit hard to know what the WB has that we haven't seen. . . . . Again, maybe a mixture of the videos, some "greatest hits" performances, and some rarer performances of songs could be a way to deal with this?? It seems like we've got space for quite a lot. Just keep the 120 minute limit in the back of your mind.

Several of you have mentioned some "Making of" footage. I'm not sure if this is available to us or not. There's almost nothing like that on WB's vault list, which is why I'm wondering...

A big thank you to everyone who is participating in this!

[Gypsyblue]

Very nice list Jo and Jenson. :nod:
Like I said before, I really think the DVD should lean towards more of the older stuff with a few newer things thrown in ( Seven Wonders for instance)

[watchdevil]

Hey Johnny.. just replying to what you said. I really appreciate the fact that you liked my website back in 1996. Unfortunately, i went through some rough times shortly thereafter and my prescence online was very sporatic.. i was even absent for a whole year. It wasn't unti two years ago I got back "permanetly" online. When I saw how many other great websites there are when I came back, I decided that I really didn't have anything worth contributing that wasn't already very well covered by others.

So what I do now is provide some basic highlights of Stevie's current happenings... and I also provide links to the best websites when you scroll down my main page. I found that instead of deleting my whole website it is very helpful for me to direct others where they need to go. I discovered that there are an awful lot of people who end up at my site first after doing a keyword search "Stevie Nicks".

Looks like I need to add The Penguin to my links! I can't believe I overlooked doing that. Lisa and Marty do a fantastic job focusing on the Fleetwood Mac aspect of things. There is so much on The Penguin that it would literally take me days to look through it all.

;)

[Les]

Going with this idea of trying to locate some rarer footage . . .

Just as an example, using the list that I posted before (or using Jo's modifications to it), how would you feel about maybe replacing something like "Over My Head" with a Rumours-lineup performance of "Why?" Or maybe replacing something else with the Rumours lineup performance of "Station Man?"

I'm thinking those songs could be available in the item on the WB list marked, "Concert/Capital Center '75." But it's hard to say for sure since there is no time indicated for the length of that tape.

But how would you feel about that? It's still the Rumours lineup, but it would be a little bit of rarer footage and it would be a nod to the previous lineups, for which there seems to be very little representation on the WB list. It would still constitute chopping into something else . . . but I'm frankly not sure how to avoid that and still pull together something that feels truly retrospective of the full span of the band's material.

[Gypsyblue]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Les
[B]Going with this idea of trying to locate some rarer footage . . .

Just as an example, using the list that I posted before (or using Jo's modifications to it), how would you feel about maybe replacing something like "Over My Head" with a Rumours-lineup performance of "Why?" Or maybe replacing something else with the Rumours lineup performance of "Station Man?"

I'm thinking those songs could be available in the item on the WB list marked, "Concert/Capital Center '75." But it's hard to say for sure since there is no time indicated for the length of that tape.

:nod: You got my vote!!
I wonder what the actual set list is for that show?? Is it a full concert?? I would love to see a White Tour Performance of Rhiannon or even a Live performance of Frozen Love from that show.
Do you think Ken might know what songs were played??

[watchdevil]

You know i can truly appreciate everyone's ideas of what should be on the DVD. There are a lot of great ideas here. It seems it would be so difficult to decide what should be included. There is so much material! Yes, since this is a Fleetwood Mac thing it should encompass a lot of the band's past during the pre-Rumours days. It's only fair.

Seems like the real solution is multiple DVD's touching on different eras of the band. I think there would be a great success with the first released item. Such initial success would cetainly determine if there would be subsequent releases. The question is what should be represented first?

[wetcamelfood]

I've come up with this revision of my revised updated list (in no particular order):

1. Tusk (vid)
2. Hold me (vid)
3. Gypsy (vid)
4. Big love (vid)
5. Seven wonders (vid)
6. Little lies (vid)
7. Everywhere (vid)
8. Family man (vid) (still under investigation)
9. As long as you follow (vid)
10. Save me (vid)
11. Skies the limit (vid)
12. In the back of my mind (vid)
13. Paper doll (vid)
14. Love shines (vid)
15. Oh well (from the first "video comp reel" on the Warners vault list)
16. World turning (Midnight special)
17. Over my head (Midnight special)
18. Rhiannon (Rosebud (or Midnight special))
19. You make loving fun (Rosebud)
20. I'm so afraid (Rosebud)
21. Dreams (Paris promo)
22. Sara ("4:00" is what it's listed as on the vault list)
23. Love in store (Live in LA)
24. Eyes of the world ("Eyes" (as it's billed on the list) Live in LA/visible time code)
25. The Chain (Live in LA/visible time code)
26. Say you love me (Hall of fame)
27. Landslide (Hall of fame)
28. Go your own way (Brit awards)
29. Don't stop (Brit awards)

If time permits (since the "Family man" video is still being considered), it would be good to include "Why" from "Midnight special" as it would be a good "nod" to the post Green/pre-BN days (even though it has BN on it as there doesn't seem to be any Welch era footage on this vault list) just as the Green "Oh well" I've listed would touch on the Green era which surely wouln't be too painful for the diehard BN only fans to endure as they surely liked LB doing this song in concert and it's only for a few minutes for god sakes, (you can always skip to the next chapter on DVD or fast forward on your VHS copies) and the post Rumours era is covered with the complete band video list which we seem to have agreed on already which is great. These live choices are good because:

They, as equally as possible represent each member with 6 performances from the Rumours era (2 SN, 2 CM & well, sort of 2 by LB "World turning)), 4 from the Tusk/Mirage era (it seems from the list. "The chain" which is everybody, and 1 from each of the three) and 4 from the 1997 reunion era (2CM, 1 LB & 1 SN. This seems to be as even as we'll get, not only on eras but on people. Also, it coveres all the US hits as well as possible (sorry overseas people, you'll see in an earlier post, I tried for you). In addition, this would keep people like me as happy as possible that we stick with more "rare" footage as oppossed to cutting into the Mirage tape (which we can't touch because of HBO rights anyways), Tusk doc, etc. For those of you fans that do fall into the catagory of what was stated earlier as "too young" and "never seen or able to get those tapes", Send me a private message/e mail with your postal address and I'll send you a VHS copy from my originals of whichever one of those commercial releases you need, aside from having an original, this is the best condition copy you can get, that is until the time comes when we can get the entire thing(s) re-released on DVD/VHS. I'll send it to you for free and with my own money if it means we keep that footage off of this release. Pretty please?

As my VCR is set for Leno tonight as I presume everyone's is, I can't time the performance clips until tomorrow but I think this collection would fit time wise as I say, hopefully with "Why" but I wanted to see if anyone liked this list before bothering to time them so I hope this one works for the masses. Any thoughts? Is there any angles I haven't covered (other than my original wish that we don't chop into things, which some of you are probably correct in saying that there's no way to do a collection and not cut in given what's on the list and given all of these particular politics involved. Let's just please stick with the vault list, I mean isn't that the whole point of what we've been hoping for for years was to get a hold of vault stuff? Now that the chance is here, let's not say "well, we want stuff from "The dance" or whatever instead because it sounds swell" I would hope that these would be considered good enough versions to include as the everyday buyer hasn't heard all versions like we have so there's no way we can judge what is going to be considered "best" as this is an opinion, not a fact. Anyway, I'm going to keep my fingers crossed this list is liked though. OK, What do you guys think?

John

[Johnny Stew]

Hi John...

Excellent list. :)

This is very much along the lines of what we're trying to put together.

A couple of quick notations though... the Rock And Roll Hall Of Fame appearance is nowhere to be found on the Warner Bros. video vault list, so I don't think this particular appearance is available to us, unfortunately.

Also, we're pretty positive that the "Live In LA" clips are simply lifted from the Mirage concert we've all seen.
In addition to that, I'm not sure if the "visible time code" on some of those would also be visible on the DVD. Which, to me, would take away from the enjoyment.

But we shall persevere!
:)


Johnny Stew

[Gypsyblue]

Are any of the things from the vault list, from the White Tour? Does anyone know??...... Johnny Stew??

[wetcamelfood]

That's great that you managed to find out ahead of time that LA stuff was from the Mirage tape and that we all seem to be in agreement that this stuff shouldn't be included. It's a real shame the hall of fame stuff isn't on there too. I noticed that both "Why" & "Over my head" from "Midnight special" don't seem to be there instead. I've come up with another list but, as all ledgies can see for themselves on the list, there isn't any way to represent those different "eras" (as they have been referred to) in an equal way as there simply isn't any footage listed from the Mirage period and very little from the 1997 reunion period that we would want to use. We can choose most of the songs and they will be very good versions but we'll have to face the fact that we won't get "best" versions of each song on here as desired by some participants. With these facts in mind, how about this new list of compromises:

1. Tusk (vid)
2. Hold me (vid)
3. Gypsy (vid)
4. Big love (vid)
5. Seven wonders (vid)
6. Little lies (vid)
7. Everywhere (vid)
8. Family man (vid) (still under investigation)
9. As long as you follow (vid)
10. Save me (vid)
11. Skies the limit (vid)
12. In the back of my mind (vid)
13. Paper doll (vid)
14. Love shines (vid)
15. Oh well (from the first "video comp reel" on the Warners vault list)
16. World turning (Midnight special)
17. Isn't it midnight (Video comp reel)
18. Rhiannon (Midnight special)
19. You make loving fun (Rosebud)
20. I'm so afraid (Rosebud)
21. Dreams (Paris promo)
22. Sara ("4:00" is what it's listed as on the vault list)
23. Songbird (3 reels)
24. Oh Diane (from the story of (billed on the list as The FM story")
25. The Chain (3 reels)
26. Say you love me (Rosebud)
27. Gold dust woman (3 reels)
28. Go your own way (Brit awards)
29. Don't stop (Brit awards)

This (hopefully) "rare" collection keeps the songwriters credits even as before as "Gold dust woman" replaces "Landslide", "Oh Diane" (which replaces "Eyes...") & "Isn't it midnight" (which replaces "Over my head") were both UK hits so this would not leave out our foreign fans and "Songbird" replaces "Love in store" (as there are no other versions of this listed any where else on the list. OK, this was not a "hit" but Stevie & Lindsey are represented by many "signature" songs here so why shouldn't Christine have her most famous one here too? (I mean we are trying to keep things even right? and Christine shouldn't be punished because they made alot of videos for her songs, as was stated before, all of the band members are in the videos, just because so and so didn't write the song doesn't mean you can't enjoy it. We are Fleetwood Mac fans after all aren't we? this being the case we shouldn't have any problems enjoying the videos enclosed). As Gypsyblue stated, it would be great if a set list could be retrieved for the "capitol center '75" concert listing to get us a version of "Over my head" and possibly "Why" and maybe some others so we can cover some of those other previously discussed wants from some of the fans. As you seem to have found out about the LA stuff coming from the Mirage tape etc. do you think this would be a possibility as I presume amendments will have to made to this list I've just submitted. Any thoughs, ideas, etc. anyone on this?

John

[d2brian]

I like that list, John. :nod: I'm curious what version of Isn't It Midnight that is, though.

~Brian

[Jo and Jensen]

If I have to see the Everywhere video on this I will PUKE! :D
I saw the fuzzy version and it SUCKED the first time. I really don't want to have to see it again! :]


P.S. The "Making of" footage for Gypsy and Big Love isn't worth putting on the tape. You don't hear anything but the director giving directions that make no sense, the band members just stand around, and some guy keeps on flashing a light meter into the screen. With all we have to choose from, this can stay far away! :-)

Jo and Jensen
(who really hates the Everywhere video)

[Gypsyblue]

Originally posted by Jo and Jensen
If I have to see the Everywhere video on this I will PUKE! :D
I saw the fuzzy version and it SUCKED the first time. I really don't want to have to see it again! :]
________________________________________________
That video is'nt exactly Fleetwood mac at there best LOL
After all this is a best of compilation

________________________________________________
P.S. The "Making of" footage for Gypsy and Big Love isn't worth putting on the tape. You don't hear anything but the director giving directions that make no sense, the band members just stand around, and some guy keeps on flashing a light meter into the screen. With all we have to choose from, this can stay far away! :-)

Jo and Jensen
(who really hates the Everywhere video)

By the way is the "Making of" footage even in the Vaults ???

[wetcamelfood]

Brian, my guess would be that it's the video but I don't know but as bad as the video is (from what I've been hearing) this may turn out to be a good thing for the video collection completeness per what we were saying before (you know?)

Jo and Jensen, No, it doesn't appear as though the Making of stuff is on the Warners list anyways so I guess you can rest easy that it won't be on there but as we were glad to get the OK from Ken on the larger time scale of up to 2 hours on the disc, it made us feel good knowing that we could have all of the bands music videos (good or bad, for completeness sake) and the rest would be various live performances for those who wish to have this kind of material on the disc so both crowds can be happy with the release. We're still trying to iron out a good set list for the live stuff. Have a look at the Warners list and let's hear your ideas.

John

[Gypsyblue]

Originally posted by wetcamelfood
[BWe're still trying to iron out a good set list for the live stuff. Have a look at the Warners list and let's hear your ideas.
John [/B]
_________________________________________________

I was wondering if there's anyone who knows what those "unknown" performances on the vault list really are??
I keep on getting the feeling that were gonna pass up some really good footage due to the lack of description on the list.
Is there a way to know what were picking and choosing before we start picking and choosing???

Anyone?

[Little Queenie]

:p
This is suck a great idea! I've been waiting forever to see something new of FM coming out on DVD. Hopefully it'll happen. Cause I want to see some videos and ESPECIALLY OLD Live PErformances of the MAC with Peter Green and the Rumours lineup...you know the Rosebud film(1976) and some early performances and the TUSK DOC. How cool would that be?

I hope this goes through. I already signed my name and passed it along. YAY:wavey:

-April:)

[Jo and Jensen]

Les,
Is there a way to get a vote or gauge opinion on if the disc should be a "Best Of" or a "complete" compilation since that seems to be an important question?

We vote for Best Of, of course! LOL!

[wetcamelfood]

I put a poll up a while ago called "ken's DVD" asking people if they wanted it to be a music video compliation or a mixture or strictly live performances but this was back when we were in the belief that we were limited to 10-12 songs. As the news has come down that Ken says now that they will let the collection run from 90 minutes to 2 hours (naturally, we are trying to get the set list we come with to be close to 2 hours!) So, with this length in mind, it seems to have been agreed that the "complete" band music videos will take one hour so as a compromise, the other hour is going to be the "best of live" performance stuff compilation so both sides of the coin can be happy. As the music vid list is "just about" done (Johnny Stew is checking in to "Family man" being a legit video), we are now trying to concentrate our efforts on an even list for the live performances. It is a given that Christine will have the most writers credits overall but we are hoping to well represent Stevie and Lindsey and touch on the pre BN line ups with a few things (as the post BN lineups will be as well covered as can be with some of the later music vids). With these thoughts in mind, it has become virtually impossible to include complete live footage and have a well rounded representation without chopping into footage (much to my own personal dismay but I do understand this after all) and as most fans of the strictly BN lineup wish to see footage of different "eras" (i.e. Rumours, Mirage, Dance, etc.) I came up with a list of live TV performances a while ago on this thread that many seemed to like but the problem was that some of the footage that would appear to obviously be in Warners vaults (Hall of fame stuff, etc.) is not on their vault list! So this does pose a problem given all of the above "wants" of various fans and what is available to us. It does appear clear that we will not go with segments from the Mirage video, the dance release itself, etc. as these can be purchased in their entirety elsewhere and as fans, this is the whole point we do this as we want to get some rare stuff out there that we either haven't seen before or that is so many generations old in our collections that a freshly made original would be invaluable to us and would still include great performances of the band we promise! (as the idea that we include the Clinton "Don't stop" was nixed because it was not deemed an acceptable performance regardless of it's historical importance to the band which was the main reason I wanted it included). Anyways, after all has been said and done on all of this, and given the limitations of what is available to us and what we as fans will accept. My last attempted list seems to have taken in OK but it may require a few adjustments, as least I think it's a step in the right direction and I hope it can be seen as a real choice as a setlist for the disc (if you scroll up in this thread it will be there one or two posts ago for me. Check it out against the vault list and let us know what you think. If you like it, let us know so we can maybe move forward to the next step with it and if you don't like it, say so too so you can suggest what changes you think should be made to it. I hope you like it though as I think I've covered alot of the politics involved as well as possible under the circumstances. Same goes for everyone else, we should really try to move things along here. What do you think is the best ideas you've read/seen so far? (Hopefully Stewy can get a hold of some of those set lists for capitol center '75 and some of those other vague concert listings on the vault list to give us more ideas about this. OK people, let's hear it, what do you think?

John

[Les]

Originally posted by Jo and Jensen
Les,
Is there a way to get a vote or gauge opinion on if the disc should be a "Best Of" or a "complete" compilation since that seems to be an important question?

Hi there,

That is a good question. Because there are a lot of different things that people want to see, Johnny Stew (Brian) and I were tossing around the idea about the sorts of things we should put up for a vote. It's not even just the "Best of" vs. "complete" ideas, but also, I know there are some folks who are interested in a few of the documentaries or full concert shows (if we can ever find out what's on some of the videos that have such generic descriptions).

Via Marty, Ken has indicated that "his people" are now beginning to try to open a more serious dialogue with Warner Bros. It would be really helpful for all of us to know if there are some things on that list that are off-limits to us, or if we can even get a better idea of what some of the items are. I'm not sure how long this will take. I was hoping to vote after we knew for sure what was really available to us, but it would be better to get the general format of the DVD decided pretty quickly. So I think we might just hold that vote sooner and then hold subsequent votes to decide on each last piece included in whatever format is chosen.

Tell me what you think about this? I was thinking an initial, more generic vote might consist of something like the following:

Option 1 - Best of Compilation: with "best of" peformances & the videos. Something similar to the list I posted previously.

Option 2 - Alternate Compilation: a similar idea, but with some of the kinds of rarer performances that John has mentioned, plus the videos.

Option 3 - A documentary plus the videos.

Option 4 - A documentary plus some live performances

Option 5 - A few live concerts in their entirety (IF we can find out what they are, what they contain, how long they are, etc...)

How does that sound?

[Jo and Jensen]

Sounds good Les! It's a tough question though. We would go for option 1 or Option 5 for a first release. We really hope that the first release would do well enough to give us the documentaries later on because they are excellent.

We were just wondering, though, if majority opinion still wanted all of the MTV Music Videos even though some of them are not really that good. But, we like the hard work you all are putting into this and look forward to any of the options.

:-)

Love,
Jo and Jensen

[wetcamelfood]

We need to keep in mind that it is going to be important to Ken's people that this initial release sells well so we may have to have things be a little more generic (like the music videos) than we might want (as fans) for this first collection. As much as all of us can't wait to see alot of this stuff, if we choose only what the fans want against what the general public wants then we can kiss any hopes of a second (and any more releaeses for that matter) goodbye so this is of the utmost importance.

Like we were saying about Warners and CD releases. They would probably only agree to putting unreleased stuff at the end of remastered CD albums as oppossed to releasing a disc of strictly unreleased stuff because as much as we would like to think something like that would sell to the general public (that is in the quantities that Warners want to sell) in all honesty, they are probably right and it wouldn't sell so I've written to them requesting that they remaster the albums with bonus tracks as I hope others have too.

So anyways, the same ground rules would apply here with the video and as we say since all of the bands videos add up to an hour the other hour could be the rare live performances. This certainly sems like a fair compromise on that level. It would just need to be determined what the content of the other half would be. You'll notice on the "Ken's DVD" poll I posted a while back that most people are for the mixture anyways. I hope that the answers releaved in that poll should save us time by telling us some useful facts regarding fan preferences against company demands as very few people have opted for "live stuff only" and this in the minds of the company people wouldn't sell anyways. They will only agree to releasing it if they know they will make and not lose money on it so please take this into consideration everyone. Wouldn't it be better to compromise for the company a little on this one and get lots of good stuff on possibly countless future releases than putting your foot down and saying "well, here's your list of 10,000 people and we all want this even though we know it won't sell to the general public" and if we are lucky enough afterwards that it's released, there most likely won't be another one released and we will get no more chances of releases of this footage again. Oh well, as over a thousand of us have agreed we will buy it despite what's on it, I'm sure we'll all be happy campers in the end!

John

[Gypsyblue]

Les,
Great idea!
Just let us know when the vote begins.
Or should we just cast our vote now???

[Les]

Originally posted by Gypsyblue
Les,
Great idea!
Just let us know when the vote begins.
Or should we just cast our vote now???

Hi,

We'll try to get the vote up some time today. I'll start it in a different thread so that it's easier to find.

[avalonboy]

I personally would prefer only the music videos.
Since we are limited to 10-12 choices, why not save
the live clips for the ongoing series...and not jumble it all just yet.
This would be my ideal choice of contents:

- Seven Wonders
- Gypsy
- Hold Me
- Little Lies
- Everywhere
- Sara
- Big Love
- Love In Store?
- As Long As You Follow
- Save Me
- Skies The Limit
- Paper Doll


Thanks.
this is a cool thing you're doing guys.

[nightbird28]

I would not include Paper Doll, just becuase there is no real music video there. It is just a sort of commerical for the Chain boxset nothing more. I would rather have Love Shines if we need a video from that release.

And also I think there has to be at least 1 more lindsey cut. Your list only has Big Love.

Otherwise my picks would be about the same as yours.
:nod:

[michelle2677]

I would not include Paper Doll, just becuase there is no real music video there. It is just a sort of commerical for the Chain boxset nothing more. I would rather have Love Shines if we need a video from that release.

And also I think there has to be at least 1 more lindsey cut. Your list only has Big Love.

Otherwise my picks would be about the same as yours.
:nod:


oh no's!! paper doll is so much better than love shines....

PD FTW!!!:blob1::blob1:

[PenguinHead]

I thought I remembered seeing a video for Oh Diane as well that should be added to the list don't you think?? And I agree that Isn't it Midnight and Sara from the Tusk documentary should be left off just because it has already been released and would be released again if those concerts went on DVD. Rhiannon from the Midnight Special would be great though as that hasn't been officially released on anything yet :) Also if getting names might be a problem--could people that are going to some of Stevie's up coming concerts maybe leave some flyers around or something like that to get more signatures and get the word out?? Just a thought......

~Amy~


Just for anyone who wasn't aware: Both Rhiannon and Over My Head from the Midnight Special are on DVD. In fact, I just watched them tonight! Unfortunately those DVDs are not sold retail--they are part of a series of Midnight Specials that you buy as a package. I saw the informercial on TV late one night and had to have them! They send one each month - 2 from each year spanning 1973-1981. The very first one was a "million seller" comp. that included Rhiannon. The first 1976 DVD contained Over My Head (both songs were obviously performed at the same show).

Aside from these great performances, the collection is an amazing, unbelieveable capsule that shows how wacky and wonderful the seventies were for its diversity; quite an education for those who lived through it and those who came after! I highly recommend them ...especially when you're high!:laugh: Plus the quality is stunning...you would swear they filmed them yesterday.

[Glittermoondust]

Just for anyone who wasn't aware: Both Rhiannon and Over My Head from the Midnight Special are on DVD. In fact, I just watched them tonight! Unfortunately those DVDs are not sold retail--they are part of a series of Midnight Specials that you buy as a package. I saw the informercial on TV late one night and had to have them! They send one each month - 2 from each year spanning 1973-1981. The very first one was a "million seller" comp. that included Rhiannon. The first 1976 DVD contained Over My Head (both songs were obviously performed at the same show).

Aside from these great performances, the collection is an amazing, unbelieveable capsule that shows how wacky and wonderful the seventies were for its diversity; quite an education for those who lived through it and those who came after! I highly recommend them ...especially when you're high!:laugh: Plus the quality is stunning...you would swear they filmed them yesterday.

Oh wow--I don't even remember posting what I posted waaaaay back in 2001!! LMAO!! But I do also have the Midnight Special DVDs........ quite honestly I haven't watched mine yet!! :eek: I really need to do that!! Thanks for the heads up!!! I hope FM still consider putting out something with all of their videos!!! :woohoo: